Mini 1464 - Game Over

[Ankamius]

Vote Count 3.1

Zhero (2)

- Feel It, Daemon385

Daemon385 (1)

- Toomai

Haschel Cedricson (1)

- Smudger

Toomai (1)

- 2birds1stone
2birds1stone -
Feel It -
Smudger -

Not Voting (2): Haschel Cedricson, Zhero

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

Deadline is (expired on 2013-08-03 00:00:00) from now, which is

August 3rd, 12:00 AM EST

Zhero has requested replacement.

Prodding: N/A
Replacing: Zhero

[Toomai]

[...] it seems to me like you're placing an undue amount of weight on MD's list.

Yeah I'm kinda thinking we shouldn't care too much about his list either. It may be from a town player but he protected his third-scummiest read and his play in general has been agreed as pretty poor. That said, I don't really think Smudger is putting "undue weight" on it. Slight bias maybe.

For the record, my list is currently something like this:

Haschel Cedricson

Feel It

Smudger

2birds1stone

Zhero

Daemon385

[Ankamius]

Freshmaniscoolman replaces Zhero starting immediately.

[2birds1stone]

[...] it seems to me like you're placing an undue amount of weight on MD's list.

Yeah I'm kinda thinking we shouldn't care too much about his list either. It may be from a town player but he protected his third-scummiest read and his play in general has been agreed as pretty poor. That said, I don't really think Smudger is putting "undue weight" on it. Slight bias maybe.

For the record, my list is currently something like this:

Haschel Cedricson

Feel It

Smudger

2birds1stone

Zhero

Daemon385

This strikes me as a generally fluffy post (specifically; lists aren't useful). Given that fluff was what I originally called Toomai out on at the start of the game, I feel comfortable in keeping my vote where it was (though, to be perfectly fair, his posts haven't been fluffy overall, it's really just two notable instances which stick out at me; what really bugs me about the two fluff posts is they're both posts masquerading as useful information, which is substantially more malicious than fluff posts that are obviously fluff).

Has anyone actually got a case on Haschel? I've seen a few votes his way, but he strikes me as very much town, and I don't recall seeing anything convincing put against him.

[Toomai]

Okay I'll add s'more work.

Haschel Cedricson

Has seemed generally town throughtout; has done nothing scummy and does good hunting.

Feel It

Also looks to be comprised of good posts and town reasoning.

Smudger

I was rather clueless on his predecessor, but he looks to be starting to make up for it.

2birds1stone

Has shown okay town-motivation in 106, 178, 225 and 240, but the D2 hammer looks bad as does 286's intentional vagueness. Overall leaning town.

Zhero

Just hasn't done much. 235 is his only real townpost.

Daemon385

I see waffling and emptyposting in 131, 172, and 173. 282 parrots my 275.

[Feel It]

UNVOTE: Freshmaniscoolman

Zhero seemed scummy but he was also away and was probably busy and has a replacement now. I wanna give him a chance at least.

[Smudger]

Has anyone actually got a case on Haschel? I've seen a few votes his way, but he strikes me as very much town, and I don't recall seeing anything convincing put against him.

my post 291

[2birds1stone]

Not believing a claim isn't a scumtell. Keeping the vote there was bad, but it was consistent with his play (inconsistency being substantially more a scumtell than bad play is).

Regardless, I've been chewing Toomai over, and I'm kinda unsure. I see lots of scumminess in the slot, but nothing damning.

Ultimately, I really do want to keep my eye on Toomai, I do not have him down as town by any means, but at the same time, it's a slightly risky lynch.

Unvote
Vote: Daemon385

[Smudger]

Birds why say Toomai then vote Daemon, who is actually at the bottom of Tomais scum register and, if I read that properly Toomai believes is scum? Are you suggesting that Toomai is busing Daemon? or have you just made a fundamental error?

[2birds1stone]

My initial reaction was "Yes, Toomai is bussing Daemon".

My second reaction is "Wait, he's a buddy down already".

Huh.

Not sure what to make of this.

Keeping with Daemon for now, simply because he's scummier than Toomai is.

I suppose I could assume Daemon and Toomai are opposite-alignment, but that kinda feels like a cop-out.

Ugh, this game just got less clear.

[2birds1stone]

There are aspects of Toomai's play which just bug me. For the most part, he has answered for himself relatively calmly and consistently, but certain things he has done very much ring scum to me; the other part of me is pointing out that most of it can be put down fairly simply to bad/suboptimal/unusual play.

I'm not sure if I'm overthinking this, or underthinking this, or something else altogether.

[Toomai]

[...] the other part of me is pointing out that most of it can be put down fairly simply to bad/suboptimal/unusual play.

Which parts can't you link to being bad? Those I might be able to explain.

Daemon and replacementguyman need to show up.

[Daemon385]

Can I get an explanation on why I am scummy? I haven't really heard any good reasoning yet.

[Toomai]

Can I get an explanation on why I am scummy? I haven't really heard any good reasoning yet.

I see waffling and emptyposting in 131, 172, and 173. 282 parrots my 275.

[Daemon385]

Well as for waffling I did say I was highly skeptical. I still think Zhero is scum and that is why I have no voted for him. As for the parroting, I said it because you made a valid point. There was probably some kind of scum on that list who voted for him. Again I'm still saying Zhero. Or who ever his replacement is I forgot the name who ever you are sorry about that.

[Smudger]

@Toomai, I don't agree with your picks there, they don't appear to be so scummy to warrant FoS,

@Daemon the , Freshmaniscoolman/Zhero slot, can you give instances where it seals your vote please?

[Smudger]

sorry 2Birds I replaced in so if this is known forgive me but are you a hydra? your posting styles changed in between your last two posts?


and I find 309 "as it says on the tin", a cop out. what is your basis for suspecting Daemon over Toomai, can you give some examples?

[Daemon385]

mnemonic, who is scum?

Honestly I feel your hiding behind someone you think (or know is town). Not saying your scum (yet), but I think it is pretty suspicious to just hang back this early on and wolf your way into sheep clothing.

I voted mnemonic before Haschel did, if that's what you mean. I guess my 'RQS is potential scumtell' post got lost to the void, but I'm not sure how I'm sheeping here.

I don't like that mnemonic is so vague, but I'm not sure he's scum yet.

This sounds like scumbuddy talk.

Is this elaborable?

I'm cool with being wrong about Toomai if Zhero and mnemonic are scumbuddies.

"don't like that mnemonic is so vague" sounds like coaching, and "not sure he's scum yet" is both a soft defense and also leaves room for future bussing if necessary. Both mnemonic and pitoli have ben very reluctant to take a stance on each other's wagon.

I think I believe the claim, actually.

UNVOTE:

Need to reread the thread, content post probably later tonight.

Reread the thread, and can still definitely see a mnem/pit team. Contrary to my last post, I'm okay with either lynch.

Hi guys, I agree that pitoli was scummy, but my role PM said I'm town, so :/

Actually I wouldn't be that opposed to my lynch because it would give lots of info

Big scumpoints here.

I'll wait for others to weigh in on the toomai/2birds thing before explaining.

This also flags me. Basically waiting for someone to make a case for him, and when Toomai obliges, switches gears from a Toomai vote to a 2birds vote accordingly.

Also as mentioned above, he seems to be casting a wide net, without really getting into many details.

VOTE: Infinity

VOTE: mnemonic

These are the reasons why. At first he seemed to hide behind and even "sheep" behind mnemonic for a moment. Then he goes on an off on fit about him being scum and about a him and pitoli team. Vote infinity then the next day jumps right on mnemonic as the first vote. I feel maybe he threw infinity under the bus for his recklessness and proceeded to go jump on the mnemonic wagon to even the field a little more.

[Ankamius]

Freshmaniscoolman has been prodded.

[2birds1stone]

sorry 2Birds I replaced in so if this is known forgive me but are you a hydra? your posting styles changed in between your last two posts?

No, but I am something of a schizophrenic poster; I naturally play in a stream-of-consciousness style, but this isn't actually very readable for a lot of people, so I try to force myself to play in a more analytical manner. The result is what you saw there (and on an unrelated note, This is my hydra).

and I find 309 "as it says on the tin", a cop out. what is your basis for suspecting Daemon over Toomai, can you give some examples?

Daemon's a gut thing which I can't be bothered analyzing more deeply atm, but the "suspecting Daemon over Toomai" came from towntells dropped on Toomai's part, not greater scumtells on Daemon's part.

Having said that, I'm actually changing my vote back to Toomai.

Unvote
Vote: Toomai

I've skimmed (very lightly skimmed, mind) day one of his newbie games, and iso'd him in those games, and his play there strikes me as more together than it is here; I would not have picked him as a new player in those games, beyond the obvious tells someone drops as a new player. In this game, I very much had him down as a new player, which I now believe is the nerves of someone who is scum for the first time on site.

Also,

[...] the other part of me is pointing out that most of it can be put down fairly simply to bad/suboptimal/unusual play.

Which parts can't you link to being bad? Those I might be able to explain.

Nope, don't like this post at all.

[Smudger]

I've skimmed (very lightly skimmed, mind) day one of his newbie games, and iso'd him in those games,

anything in particular you want to share with us to back it up?

[Haschel Cedricson]

These are the reasons why. At first he seemed to hide behind and even "sheep" behind mnemonic for a moment. Then he goes on an off on fit about him being scum and about a him and pitoli team. Vote infinity then the next day jumps right on mnemonic as the first vote. I feel maybe he threw infinity under the bus for his recklessness and proceeded to go jump on the mnemonic wagon to even the field a little more.

Where is this sheeping you're referencing? Are you talking about post 112?

[Smudger]

VLA till Sunday guys

[Daemon385]

These are the reasons why. At first he seemed to hide behind and even "sheep" behind mnemonic for a moment. Then he goes on an off on fit about him being scum and about a him and pitoli team. Vote infinity then the next day jumps right on mnemonic as the first vote. I feel maybe he threw infinity under the bus for his recklessness and proceeded to go jump on the mnemonic wagon to even the field a little more.

Where is this sheeping you're referencing? Are you talking about post 112?

Yes that is what it looks like to me.

[Haschel Cedricson]

That doesn't look like sheeping at all, especially given mnemonic attributed his prior vote to mere OMGUS and had given no scum reads up to that point.

In addition, mnemonic's reply to the question is that Toomai and Feel It are scummy, yet Zhero never votes for or expresses suspicion of either of those two players.

Either we have two very different definitions of "sheeping" or you are doing bizarre mental gymnastics to push a crappy case.