Mini 1468: Legends of the Hidden Temple- Game Over!

[AngryPidgeon]

Kidding aside though, I have the impression this game is stuck.
Could the people not currently on the qwints wagon provide reasons for not being there? (as specific as possible)

Qwints feels townish to me. And I strongly doubt he butts heads with me when hes up for lynch as scum and I'm entertaining voting his wagon.

His bit about having notes feels really genuine in hindsight since hes basically auditing himself in the thread and unashamed about any possible inconsistencies spilling his notes could cause down the line if he were scum.

Don't know if I think anyone else is scum in this lynch pool, Qwints looks quite town imo. Maybe Grim but idk, i'll think it over a bit more.

Also, qwints feels different than he did in GoW mafia (I think I may have said that before).

The game has severely slowed down. Majiffy trying to get something going despite this, screams Majiffy being town to me.

This is a really shallow reason to townread someone... 'Screams' town? So anyone posting quote strips screams town to you or is there actually something he was doing that looks town?

You are basically saying the both of us are not of the same alignment and using our converging views on a certain matter as an argument that these views must be valuable, given our different alignment.
In order to use this as a factual argument in the way you just did, you truly have to take it for granted we are not from the same alignment. This is more than you simply suspecting me of being scum. This is you KNOWING I don't belong to your alignment. The only way you'd know we're not of the same alignment is when you're scum.

This is some shit. He never said that you being opposite/same alignments matters as all. I'll admit its a little odd that hes voting you and using your read on Elyse to encourage Majiffy to vote you, but thats more likely dumb than scum

Qwints: How likely do you think Grim is to flip scum?

More on this: Qwints obviously mentioned Grim because hes the other person up for a lynch, although Im not totally sure why he cares. I see hes emphasizing to other people in the lynch pool though, not sure how that makes me feel.

We both had the opportunity to hammer.

This actually makes a ton of sense from a Qwints perspective and I tend to agree. Scum would have way more motivation to hammer town when they can potentially get off w/o being in the lynch pool after doing it.

@Qwints: Ok, so if Elyse is town and Grim is scum why did Grim not hammer? You monologued a bit about why _you_ didn't and of course it involves you being town.

everyone give a list of 3 players you would be okay to lynch.

How about people I wont lynch: you, venmar, wisdom* and prooobably qwints but I really need to reevaluate that since hes in a stagnant lynch pool atm.

*You aren't a scumbutt, are you Wisdom?

Qwints is a tough read for me but out of the current pool I would be willing to lynch him.

You just mentioned Grim as a possible qwints buddy (grim/qwints/enomis). Why do you see them as a possible team over anything else? Why did neither of them hammer you?

Her most recent post about complaining how she isn't in a hydra pings my radar.

I don't think this is alignment indicative. Mollie complained to me (in general, outside of this game) recently about how her hydras are somewhat flaking and overbooking her time in games.

[Wisdom]

enomis/Majiffy/qwints
enomis/Majiffy/mollie
enomis/mollie/qwints

It has to be one of those. Everyone else looks very town.

[AngryPidgeon]

Also FWIW, my Elyse suspicions have been buried in the thread, but basically this.

In 1987 she claims she 'knew' NS was scum by PoE which given the lurking in the game, I just find highly unlikely. And she was willing to admit she was wrong about me on a dime so she clearly is not as headstrong as the AtE in the post would have us believe. And now she throws out hypothetical teams that either involve BOTH qwints/grim being scum or BOTH mollie/majiffy ( I realize she rectified that shortly after) but I have a hard time believing she doesn't see how unlikely them being s/s and not hammering her as town is.

And she claims that her scumreads were all based of PoE townreads at that point but was reluctant to vote Enomis at all until it was clear that amrun was getting lynched. I would not be surprised if this is a Grim/enomis bus whilst MLing qwints.

Elyse is too confident in Amrun being town.
MAybe she's right.

Side note: totally forgot about this. Grim sees Elyse as WKing Amrun but then drops Elyse suspicions for Qwints when suddenly its one of those 2 Vs him and Amrun isn't allowed? And actually vote parks Amrun with a little theatrics despite being paranoid about that. I wouldn't be so sure this was from cum if he hadn't just dropped his Elyse herpaderp IN LIGHT OF HIS PREDICTION BEING CORRECT to tunnel on qwints with his former? scumread.

Also around this time Elyse is still implying that Grim is scum trying to ML her, but Elyse thinks Amrun is town so why is she focused on his vote on her and not his amrun votepark?

Elyse/Grim scumteam. Last member could easily be Enomis or Wisdom.

[pirate mollie]

and you seem to be super duper okay if the stand of is anyone other than your team.

What? I recall i'm the one who ended up trying to kill my partner Day 2? Why do you think I would want to have either of us lynched ever since I have put AP down as town?

PM scumread is largely gut, but some of her posts in particular give me scumvibes. Her most recent post about complaining how she isn't in a hydra pings my radar. She returns after she is accused, and her whole post is full of her just complaining and whining, which may or not be AtE.

tbh venny is starting to creep me out.

- This also made me think PM is scum, since PM's read on me is very flip-floppy, I ISO'd her and she seems to go back and forth on me quite a bit. Trying to decide if i'm reading her right since her ISO is quite all over the place, or if this is legit scummy shit.

Still, got a diff lynch pool... only person I think is scum in this lynch pool now is Grimm.... sooo.....yeah...

Vote: Grimmy

so you are scumreading cos of gut okay there is nothing I can say to that except I believe there were about 3 or 4 people in gears who were "gut reading" me as scum and a couple of them were town as was I. do you remember that venny?

I am waffling on my reads. <----- this is not a scumtell if anything scum are stickier with their reads cos they want specific players to be lynched.

speaking of:

@ groovey kid

taking a step back I starting noticing that your reads seem to change with whoever is around what is up with that

also elyse asked for my reads and here they are:

town:

majiffy - he is still talking to me about the game he is trying to get me to be more active. I think elyse's flip will pretty much clear him if she is scum.

qwints - his heavy analysis posts remind me of bureaucracy mafia I can dig that game up if anyone wants me too.

groovey kid - he is still a strong town read of mine but I don't like it seems like he is catering to a crowd but I am not ready to get weird on him

ap - still town reading him but there are some things that need to happen

unsure:

elyse - I had her as strong town but majiffy has made some really good points. we have talked in private about this and I see where he is coming from I just don't fully agree with it. I think this lynch pool sucks donkey balls and it would not have been my choice.

venny - I wobble on him. he knows me and yet he isn't interacting with me in order to get a better read. venny does my play look anything like reign of fire? nope. <------ that you can't see the difference is why I am not liking you

scum:

wis - knows me and is acting like he doesn't, he is doing the same thing that he did in polygamist I really fucking wish

someone

would read that game I mean there is a reason that I linked it. I think he is snowing people left and right just like he did nacho and me.

I know I am leaving someone out

[Wisdom]

wis - knows me and is acting like he doesn't, he is doing the same thing that he did in polygamist I really fucking wish someone would read that game I mean there is a reason that I linked it. I think he is snowing people left and right just like he did nacho and me.

Ok seriously WTF am I doing here that I did in Polygamy? This game really has to be my most obvtown game, I have literally posted every thought that comes to my mind, no matter how many times I may change my opinion I don't care and I just post whatever the fuck is in my mind that second. I seriously cannot believe that you can be this stupid and keep scumreading me all fucking game when in other games that I was actually scummy you could see that I was town. If you are town, seriously snap out of it because it's fucking annoying. And while you're at it, stop townreading Majiffy for bullshit reasons. His case on Elyse is a nonsensincal stretch.

[AngryPidgeon]

ap - still town reading him but there are some things that need to happen

Like what?

Come on mollie, I really want to work with you. You feel town and I can't really quantify it too well (although I can actually point to How2.5FriendsBangedYourMother now and you really dont feel like you did there).

The fake hammer incident is the HARDEST I've ever townslipped and if that isn't obvious, then : /

Every time I try to engage you about stuff (notably MAJIFFY) you get all paranoid and waffly until I give up and poke around elsewhere. We can sort this out with a solid, coordinated town base and I want to work with you on some lynches for my sanity's sake. We keep ending up on compromises or otherwise 'whatever' lynches.

Is Majiffy your biggest townread?

[qwints]

Qwints: How likely do you think Grim is to flip scum?

I think it's really likely at this point. I'd be surprised if he didn't.

@Qwints: Ok, so if Elyse is town and Grim is scum why did Grim not hammer? You monologued a bit about why _you_ didn't and of course it involves you being town.

Remember that grim wasn't vigorously opposing a hammer, but taking a wishy-washy stance against Elyse as scum. My guess is he thought he could scare me into hammering out of self-preservation. It's also worth pointing out that the pressure was on Elyse and me, not him, while he had the opportunity to hammer.

These are his posts on elyse while the voting is qwints and wisdom on grim, grim on qwints and majiffy on elyse.

Read Elyse's posts. There's an all-knowing aura around her posts, she KNOWS how people will flip, you can sense it from everything she says. She's now trying to cash in on this "all)knowingness" in two ways: towncred + getting me lynched by calling me obvscum.

Elyse: This one is really difficult. Probably the most difficult of all of them. I can copy/paste what I said before about this all-knowngness she seems to portray. It just doesn't feel like she's scumhunting. It feels like she already knows how everyone is aligned, and uses this knowledge to her strategical advantage by townreading those in distress and scumreading those who are scumhunting but on the wrong track. Nobody Special was the ideal scum-sacrifice to this end, and Amrun, a close to universal scumread, the perfect buddy. But there is the chance Elyse is simply a far better townplayer than I am and just expects the same qualities from other town, resulting in a genuine scumread on me for failing to live up to these standards. I really don't know. No clue. But I'll lynch her over myself, obviously, so I won't have any qualms to vote her if a majority on qwints is out of the question.

Then, after Wisdom switches from voting grim to me in 2173 (not counting the early switch he immediately retracted), Elyse becomes a town read:

Not lynching Elyse though, while ISO'ing her in this process I stumbled upon 1993 again and I have to say, they don't make posts townier than that. I made a similar statement about that before, and reading it again now it's amazing how this post influences my read on her.
She's just town on the wrong track.

A switch that doesn't stop him giving other reasons for Elyse to be scum as the Elyse wagon forms.

So grim would have been happy with an Elyse lynch since he could get his town cred from an Elyse flip while staying alive. He wouldn't that towncred by hammering her, and since I had more pressure than he did, he was probably hoping I would hammer someone he knew was a townie, which he could use to line up my mislynch next.

[pirate mollie]

wis - knows me and is acting like he doesn't, he is doing the same thing that he did in polygamist I really fucking wish someone would read that game I mean there is a reason that I linked it. I think he is snowing people left and right just like he did nacho and me.

Ok seriously WTF am I doing here that I did in Polygamy? This game really has to be my most obvtown game, I have literally posted every thought that comes to my mind, no matter how many times I may change my opinion I don't care and I just post whatever the fuck is in my mind that second. I seriously cannot believe that you can be this stupid and keep scumreading me all fucking game when in other games that I was actually scummy you could see that I was town. If you are town, seriously snap out of it because it's fucking annoying. And while you're at it, stop townreading Majiffy for bullshit reasons. His case on Elyse is a nonsensincal stretch.

if you are town then why are you tunneling on me for really bad reasons? this is totally what you did to mara in polygamist. how is majiffy's case nonsensical? and I am talking to majiffy outside of the game thread he doesn't feel disingenuous. the questions he asks point straight to a town pov but I see why you are seeing him as scum cos it isn't translating in this thread. he is more succinct when we talk and it makes sense with what he is saying. I think you are trying to discredit my read on him.

[pirate mollie]

ap - still town reading him but there are some things that need to happen

Like what?

Come on mollie, I really want to work with you. You feel town and I can't really quantify it too well (although I can actually point to How2.5FriendsBangedYourMother now and you really dont feel like you did there).

The fake hammer incident is the HARDEST I've ever townslipped and if that isn't obvious, then : /

Every time I try to engage you about stuff (notably MAJIFFY) you get all paranoid and waffly until I give up and poke around elsewhere. We can sort this out with a solid, coordinated town base and I want to work with you on some lynches for my sanity's sake. We keep ending up on compromises or otherwise 'whatever' lynches.

Is Majiffy your biggest townread?

he is. and I have been trying to work with you but we can't seem to sync up.

how can we fix this.

[Wisdom]

if you are town then why are you tunneling on me for really bad reasons? this is totally what you did to mara in polygamist. how is majiffy's case nonsensical?

How the fuck were my reasons on Mara in Polygamist bad? Did you forget you agreed with them?
I am not tunneling on you. I currently think, and stated one thousand times, that the scumteam is enomis/Majiffy/qwints. Guess what, that does NOT include you. I do think that you might be scum if one of those are wrong however. It is weird that you still don't townread me when you've easily townread me in other games. You said it yourself that it's scum who have weird sticky scumreads and that's exactly what you've had on me for this whole game. It's like you're searching for reasons to scumread me. How the fuck don't you see I'm town?

Majiffy's case is a stretch. He keeps saying that Elyse wants to link herself to dead people and other stuff which can be interpreted in much more simple ways. He was the one who showed me how my case on AP was a stretch because things could be seen in a much simplier way that I could not see, yet he now does it himself. I don't know what you two do privately, but in this thread Majiffy is scum. And I have not forgotten how he forgot his scumread on Grimgroove to vote Coug on D1, something that all of you have completely forgotten and ignore.

[AngryPidgeon]

And I have not forgotten how he forgot his scumread on Grimgroove to vote Coug on D1, something that all of you have completely forgotten and ignore.

Oh shit that totally slipped my mind. I need to read some of those patches that I skimmed wrt Day 1 challenge.

[AngryPidgeon]

Mollie, you forgot about Enomis in your post. Which isn't terribly surprising since hes scum and lurking.

I really don't see anyone other than Enomis getting lynched tomorrow and I don't particularly give a shit who challenges him.

[pirate mollie]

if you are town then why are you tunneling on me for really bad reasons? this is totally what you did to mara in polygamist. how is majiffy's case nonsensical?

How the fuck were my reasons on Mara in Polygamist bad? Did you forget you agreed with them?
I am not tunneling on you. I currently think, and stated one thousand times, that the scumteam is enomis/Majiffy/qwints. Guess what, that does NOT include you. I do think that you might be scum if one of those are wrong however. It is weird that you still don't townread me when you've easily townread me in other games. You said it yourself that it's scum who have weird sticky scumreads and that's exactly what you've had on me for this whole game. It's like you're searching for reasons to scumread me. How the fuck don't you see I'm town?

Majiffy's case is a stretch. He keeps saying that Elyse wants to link herself to dead people and other stuff which can be interpreted in much more simple ways. He was the one who showed me how my case on AP was a stretch because things could be seen in a much simplier way that I could not see, yet he now does it himself. I don't know what you two do privately, but in this thread Majiffy is scum. And I have not forgotten how he forgot his scumread on Grimgroove to vote Coug on D1, something that all of you have completely forgotten and ignore.

yes you are. every time I post you are all like "mollie is scum".

I usually get very town vibes from you and I didn't this game. after polygamist I would expect you to amp it up especially cos I think I caught you early in misstepping and it is nightless so you can't just up and nk me. and I am not being stupid wis and I think you know that. <----- this is why I think you are scum. tell me how I am being stupid cos I am not.

[pirate mollie]

@ ap

I don't like eno cos he is not helping me with wis when he should be since he is "supposedly" seeing the same thing I am. ftr I don't think eno and wis are on the same team.

[Wisdom]

yes you are. every time I post you are all like "mollie is scum".

wtf are you talking about, ive townread you for the biggest portion of the game and I still don't think you're scum that strongly

And yes you usually get town vibes, that's why it's weird you don't in this game.

[Grimgroove]

Qwints: How likely do you think Grim is to flip scum?

I think it's really likely at this point. I'd be surprised if he didn't.

I'll have to get back on all the other stuff later, but this ^^ must have pinged someone else's radar as well, right?
If I'm the lynch today green simply has to be in the lynchpool again tomorrow, facing off against either blue or red.

More tomorrow. Must sleep now.

[Elyse]

@AP
I don't see how Grim/Qwints not hammering me makes them not scum. (with me town) There are many reasons why they wouldn't hammer me. Fear, drastic switch on reads, loss of towncred, my townflip makes them look scummy, etc.

@Mollie
How do you expect us to believe your townread on Majiffy when you could be scum? Is there anything in-thread you could show us?

[AngryPidgeon]

^ How do you expect us to believe your scumread on Qwints when you could be scum : ? What the fuck.

[Wisdom]

Her point is that mollie uses out-of-thread reasons for her townread.

[Majiffy]

And I have not forgotten how he forgot his scumread on Grimgroove to vote Coug on D1, something that all of you have completely forgotten and ignore.

This is just wrong on so many levels. Like seriously horribly bad wrong.

[Elyse]

Her point is that mollie uses out-of-thread reasons for her townread.

Thank you.

[Grimgroove]

@AP
I don't see how Grim/Qwints not hammering me makes them not scum. (with me town) There are many reasons why they wouldn't hammer me. Fear, drastic switch on reads, loss of towncred, my townflip makes them look scummy, etc.

Towncred? What towncred do I have?
Drastic switches of reads: it's not as if I had none of those yet in this game.
Your flip wouldn't make a difference when it comes to how people percieve me.
And fear?
I HAVE NO FEAR!













Seriously, no fear here.

[Grimgroove]

Mollie, you forgot about Enomis in your post. Which isn't terribly surprising since hes scum and lurking.

I really don't see anyone other than Enomis getting lynched tomorrow and I don't particularly give a shit who challenges him.

He's not lurking. He flaked. Which is even worse because it's not alignment indicative, which gives us nothing.

I'm not perfectly comfortable with how easily consensus is being reached about enomis = scum I have to admit. It seems to me as if his recent absense has been the moment some have been looking for to call him scum, completely unchallenged. Somehow this entire thread has a wind whiffing through it, telling us "enomis is scum", but should we trust the wind?

I don't know. But I definitely do care who challenges him.

[Wisdom]

Who do you want to challenge him?
What scumteams do you see without enomis in them?

[Grimgroove]

I told you before, I'm done with compiling scumteams.
But I see more people than just enomis being scummy, so it is possible that they are part of a scumteam where he is not part of.
By now I think pretty much every combination of three people has been mentioned as a possibility in this topic. Quite impressive. We're turning into a human Monte Carlo simulation.

Who do I want to challenge him?
Blue would be nice, but in case I'm the one being lynched, I think Green should go in the lynchpool again.