Mini 1489 - VisCon: Murder at Wingate Mansion [Game Over]

[Llamarble]

Scum generally like when town are demoralized because it makes them play worse, so I find peptalks a decent towntell.
Timing I don't have a grip on yet, but I'll try and find a better chunk of time tomorrow.

For some reason I think that town talk about their reading success rate on a given player more often than scum, but maybe that's crazy.

I sound like scum so far don't I >_>

I guess my town not fully engaged game is kinda similar to my scumgame.
Anyhow I'll make myself useful soon

I actually thought you were a newb after reading your post, and then I realized you aren't.

Why are you admitting to us that your town game when you're not IN IT can be similar to your scumgame. You're telling us this why? Why should we spare you

I found it interesting that my posts felt similar to my play in White Flag. You should "spare me" because I'll probably make us win once I get going.

I'm not happy somebody already claimed before I got properly engaged, but that's my fault so meh.
Time to vet out this generic wagon.

[PeaceBringer]

:bangsheadonwall:

[Llamarble]

Dude only has 4 votes, so looks like him claiming this early is his fault not mine.
Also he doesn't look like scum.

[Desperado]

Gaiden yelled at him for AtEing because that's not really useful to town in any way whatsoever. He told him to step up his game in town and aimed to antagonize him a bit by telling him to step it up. I actually liked that quite a bit!

I feel like he took the antagonism too far, and I feel like the tone of his post was geared more towards pushing Generic's buttons than getting him to step his game up.

I haven't finished rereading yet, but Desperado what is your problem with me and what about anything makes it sound like I'm scum with Generic? It's neat that you brought up that quote because I have no idea where your pot shots at me are coming from. I was going to say something already when I noticed you left me out of the mystical 'townblock' (which is a concept that needs to die) but you've upgraded it to 'so why aren't you voting me' territory.

Although speaking of Pillboy, as weird as you're beinbg, I don't want to vote you. I get alot of flack for 'using AtE' too when I'm just saying how I feel. I'm telling you that playing like everyone else is the enemy is going to get you lynched, and from my viewpoint that would be a waste for all of us.

#1 I misread something Tammy said in an earlier post and corrected my mistake in #222. Maybe you should have finished rereading before flipping out.
#2 I wasn't taking any pot shots at you. Tammy and Emp both had you as town and I wanted to know why, and then I read the link Emp provided and commented on it.
#3 We still don't know who you suspect and given the town meta that Emp provided I find that problematic.

[Empire]

Huh? Have you done this meta-dive yet that you just pretty much promised us?

"YALL SHOULD MOVE TO GAIDEN, HE'S ON MY SCUMLIST, but you know maybe you shouldn't because I need to compare how he/she is as both alignments"

Please do better than this....

Uh, that's not even remotely what I said. If you'd actually taken the time to read my post more closely, you'd see that the bottom half of it was a preview edit directed to the post above me from Desperado talking about Generic. I said I wanted to look into his meta because I could see a lot of the issues I'm having with his play being largely playstyle related and not alignment related. The first half of it was talking about Gaiden. I never once even implied I was waiting on a meta dive w.r.t. Gaiden.

On point 2 first, you got that wrong. My scum read on nacho incorporated a point that HE flipped from a scum read on you to a town read on you after just a prod dodge post. I never called you town during that entire event.

I don't think you understood what I was getting at. Of course you didn't explicitly call me town. But you did bring up an argument that presumes I am town. In #170, you said you think Nacho is trying to suck up to me so I vote the way he wants me to. The only way that makes any sense is if Nacho's scum and I'm town; otherwise, he would have no motivation to suck up to me in that way to influence my vote. I want to know why you made this argument then if you still have me as a null-read.

---

@Desperado:

1) From what I've seen of Shadoweh in other games, she's usually a lot more self-assured/"meaner" as town and that's how she came across to me in her interactions with Generic. As scum, she tends to play a lot more reserved with her emotions and often plays up the "cutesiness" factor. I linked Yoloville as the was the most recent experience I had with her and I just generally see a lot more of the former here.
2) As far as the circumstances of this game being different goes, #258 is the kind of response I was expecting from her mostly because it's the same way I've been feeling about the game. Aside from Gaiden and possibly Generic, most of the people posting look pretty town to me so it's hard to find other suspects I'd feel confident in. Judging from that post, it seems like Shadoweh feels the same way (as an aside, I do think Shadoweh is perfectly capable of manufacturing reasons to vote people as scum and would have done so here if she were scum).

@Nacho:

Really interested in seeing what you've got from that other site. I'll probably be registering myself soon enough but I'd much rather get through Generic's meta here as I feel that's the most relevant seeing as other site's play the game differently.

@Bert:

You have a lot of suspects, but is there anyone you are reading as town? If so, who?

[Generic]

Oh I see what you mean now empire, and that's a good point.
But my arguement there is that as a null read you could be either, and with the speed at which nacho changed his opinion on you (can't really go heavily into things due to ongoing games being the example) it gave me pause to believe it was nacho sucking up to a town player to influence their bias in favour of who he is railing on.

If the arguement is that mara wouldn't put herself on the line whereby my flip makes her whole arguement a joke then so be it, even if that is wifom territory.
Nacho on the other hand I cannot justify his actions as reading anything but full of agenda.

unvote, vote nachomamma

[Ms Marangal]

On point 1, I suspected mara FIRST, so her OMGUS wouldn't correlate fairly in that comment.

So, Your RVS vote was legit Suspicion?

because before my vote, that's the only indication you had of suspicion towards my direction

and I already stated that My vote was not OMGUS, you're just trying to make it sound like it's one.

What dirty tactics is Nacho using?

Why have you yet to explain why me using Colo Meta is bullshit, when it's the most relevant thing I have?

Why are you playing the apathy/sympathy card after calling me out as scummy for "Using AtE?"

Why the fuck did you claim?

[Generic]

What sympathy card did I play?

And if you point to my need to go v/la for personal issues I will quit this game now. You can ducking call that AtE too if you like, cos I'm not playing that shit after the two days I've had.

As for the RVS, I referenced you without naming names when I commented on those attacking nacho.

And considering I've just been through the points about sucking up to some, flipping reads at nothing and projecting things he has done in this game into my play and then labelling those actions scummy.

Why does it matter when I claimed, I got pushed into having to discuss my personal life and have lost all enjoyment for the game. Have another stick to beat me with and see how creative you can get over that information.

[Bert]

@Bert:

You have a lot of suspects, but is there anyone you are reading as town? If so, who?

Give me 1 more day to get a feel/rhythm for everyone. I have gone over the game a few times, but not enough yet. It's like walking into a dead conversation, and you know, you feeling like they have already been through a war and you're walking in all innocent.

That's how I feel.

Tammy and Mara are town town town. Everyone else I'm on the fence about...give me one more day.

[Bert]

EBWOP: I'm not a fan of how Generic claimed - timing, etc., screamed scum scum scum - but that last post #282...meh the "discussing my personal life, lost all enjoyment part" is...meh. Not sure.

The Mara-Generic thing as I've been reconsidering this morning, it just looks like a ton of meta-noise. And the fact is I have not accessed whatever databank they are drawing from. I'm actually agreeable with Tammy now that the two playing against each other kinda distracts from the game.

It is best summed up like this:

Mara: "IM SOOOO SURE YOURE SCUM, YOURE SCUM"

Generic: "Im the victim, get offa me"

[Generic]

Vote for me bert. Then you are rid of me from the game. I asked for that and got told I shouldn't be doing that.

I get asked for a claim, so I gsve it and that's now scummy to.

Confbias, just finish the wagon, see my flip, and get on with everyone else a town member down.

After mara wants to fucking accuse me of using the suit I'm going through as AtE.

vote generic

That's how ticking angry I am right now, I hate self voting but I refuse to let someone else have to inherit the shitstorm. Fuck it.

[Bert]

Unvote

No.

What are your town/scum reads?

[Generic]

unvote

why should I let to of my principles because of the ignorance of others.

Tried to come back to this and try, even though its a chore just to read it let alone analyse it. But clearly whatever I write is going to be called scummy, so fuck it.

Pedit: I will need to calm down first bert, my mind frame right now is shot to shit...

[TheGarantula]

Vote for me bert. Then you are rid of me from the game. I asked for that and got told I shouldn't be doing that.

I get asked for a claim, so I gsve it and that's now scummy to.

Confbias, just finish the wagon, see my flip, and get on with everyone else a town member down.

After mara wants to fucking accuse me of using the suit I'm going through as AtE.

vote generic

That's how ticking angry I am right now, I hate self voting but I refuse to let someone else have to inherit the shitstorm. Fuck it.

This post gave me cancer.
You are using AtE all over the place; don't deny it. I don't think it's necessarily scummy, but it is distracting and annoying. Please stop.

EBWOP: I'm not a fan of how Generic claimed - timing, etc., screamed scum scum scum - but that last post #282...meh the "discussing my personal life, lost all enjoyment part" is...meh. Not sure.

Could you elaborate on why the claim was scummy?

I don't like Shadoweh so far

Why not?

On point 1, I suspected mara FIRST, so her OMGUS wouldn't correlate fairly in that comment

No you didn't. All you had on her was a random vote. Why are you lying?

[TheGarantula]

When you spend a lot of time trying to discredit someone's viewpoint as he did with a fullblown OMGUS and references to past meta regarding relationships and other things it is suspect.

Isn't this also what Ms Marangal was doing? Do you suspect her was well?

[Empire]

Tammy, whenever you get a chance, would like to hear your thoughts on Bert specifically.

[Generic]

How is it an appeal to emotion when I'm NOT APPEALING my lynch?

It's perfectly acceptable for someone to accuse me of ducking trying to alter the events of a fucking game by bringing my personal life into it? That would sit right with you would it?
And your flippant remark about cancer was a out as no Iso as eating vomit.
I would have forced a mod kill if it wasnt for bad sportsmanship and the last lingering shred of pride I want to hold onto (and its bad enough I'm ruining fakegods game as I am without making it worse for him)...

And I just said I referenced mara even if not by name in post 63. To me that's not lying, just because you didn't pick up on her voting for nacho and me referencing those attacking nacho doesn't mean it didn't happen.

[Bert]

Tammy, whenever you get a chance, would like to hear your thoughts on Bert specifically.

Woah, woah. Why are you asking Tammy about me? Why don't you make some of your own comments first.

Could you elaborate on why the claim was scummy?

He was at lynch -3. Not lynch -2. Not lynch -1. Lynch -3. And he was not obligated to claim under the circumstances.

[Bert]

EBWOP: Generic, since you're here and back, I hope you put together your best possible outlined case against Nacho, as you voted for him an hour ago but quickly rescinded your vote.

[Empire]

Woah, woah. Why are you asking Tammy about me? Why don't you make some of your own comments first.

The question has less to do with you and more to do with her. Of course I have my own opinion and I'll make my own comments when I feel ready.

[Generic]

Rescinded as in votes for me?

Easily remedied,

vote nacho

Iso my posts, if that's not good enough for what I said against nacho come back to me.

[Bert]

Nacho, love, please come reach out to Pappa.

I don't feel the love yet.

Vote: Nachomamma

[Ms Marangal]

It's a shame you are deciding I'm wrong without actually reading what I'm saying. Not a lot else I can say back to that.

If its gonna be me who is lynched through this nacho, can you promise me something? When I flip town revisit lynching mara.

Cos her whole arguement falls on its arse when I flip town.

These two points are, definitely AtE

Your claim also had some AtE in it.

as for your IRL issues, I don't know whats going on, and I'm sorry for whatever is happening to you, but I'm not using that against you. I never was, and I don't want to use that as fuel against you. In that same token, I don't think it's fair for you to expect us to know whats going on, expect us to know how bad your problems IRL are. I have my own share of problems that I'm not bringing into the game, because the game isn't the place for that kind of thing.

No one pushed you to claim what it was you were exactly going through IRL

and even without your IRL issues, You have been playing the "Victim" card, Bert even brought it up. I'm not the only one who's noticed and yet, you havn't admitted to that.

You still havn't answered

I'll take the Post 63 comment. It's something decent, and one of the best, most legit, things you have stated all day.

You didn't answer the Dirty tactics Nacho is using, I want an answer to that because I don't see it

and you still don't tell me why me Using colo-stuff is Bullshit when you yourself was planning to do it because, it is the only relevant thing we have. This is our first game here, I havn't followed most of your games to closely, and even if I did I can't back anything up because there isn't any proof there. the statements I have made can be backed up if people are willing to sign-up and take a look at the games I linked, because I linked every single game we played in together.

I also didn't call you claiming scummy, I just asked why You claimed.

[Bert]

Mara do you think Nacho is town here

[Generic]

It's a shame you are deciding I'm wrong without actually reading what I'm saying. Not a lot else I can say back to that.

If its gonna be me who is lynched through this nacho, can you promise me something? When I flip town revisit lynching mara.

Cos her whole arguement falls on its arse when I flip town.

These two points are, definitely AtE

Your claim also had some AtE in it.

as for your IRL issues, I don't know whats going on, and I'm sorry for whatever is happening to you, but I'm not using that against you. I never was, and I don't want to use that as fuel against you. In that same token, I don't think it's fair for you to expect us to know whats going on, expect us to know how bad your problems IRL are. I have my own share of problems that I'm not bringing into the game, because the game isn't the place for that kind of thing.

No one pushed you to claim what it was you were exactly going through IRL

and even without your IRL issues, You have been playing the "Victim" card, Bert even brought it up. I'm not the only one who's noticed and yet, you havn't admitted to that.

You still havn't answered

I'll take the Post 63 comment. It's something decent, and one of the best, most legit, things you have stated all day.

You didn't answer the Dirty tactics Nacho is using, I want an answer to that because I don't see it

and you still don't tell me why me Using colo-stuff is Bullshit when you yourself was planning to do it because, it is the only relevant thing we have. This is our first game here, I havn't followed most of your games to closely, and even if I did I can't back anything up because there isn't any proof there. the statements I have made can be backed up if people are willing to sign-up and take a look at the games I linked, because I linked every single game we played in together.

I also didn't call you claiming scummy, I just asked why You claimed.

It's a shame you are deciding I'm wrong without actually reading what I'm saying. Not a lot else I can say back to that.

If its gonna be me who is lynched through this nacho, can you promise me something? When I flip town revisit lynching mara.

Cos her whole arguement falls on its arse when I flip town.

These two points are, definitely AtE

Your claim also had some AtE in it.

as for your IRL issues, I don't know whats going on, and I'm sorry for whatever is happening to you, but I'm not using that against you. I never was, and I don't want to use that as fuel against you. In that same token, I don't think it's fair for you to expect us to know whats going on, expect us to know how bad your problems IRL are. I have my own share of problems that I'm not bringing into the game, because the game isn't the place for that kind of thing.

No one pushed you to claim what it was you were exactly going through IRL

and even without your IRL issues, You have been playing the "Victim" card, Bert even brought it up. I'm not the only one who's noticed and yet, you havn't admitted to that.

You still havn't answered

I'll take the Post 63 comment. It's something decent, and one of the best, most legit, things you have stated all day.

You didn't answer the Dirty tactics Nacho is using, I want an answer to that because I don't see it

and you still don't tell me why me Using colo-stuff is Bullshit when you yourself was planning to do it because, it is the only relevant thing we have. This is our first game here, I havn't followed most of your games to closely, and even if I did I can't back anything up because there isn't any proof there. the statements I have made can be backed up if people are willing to sign-up and take a look at the games I linked, because I linked every single game we played in together.

I also didn't call you claiming scummy, I just asked why You claimed.

When your situations relate to your marriage, health of your children and work all in the same week then you can tell me how I should react. But if you were not referencing that I apologise for my reaction to you.
Again I restate, I don't see how it can be AtE when I am not obstructing my own lynch. And if you believe I'm scum my comment to nacho earlier is surely empty because I won't flip town, you guaranteed it.

As for not answering about nacho

And considering I've just been through the points about sucking up to some, flipping reads at nothing and projecting things he has done in this game into my play and then labelling those actions scummy.

I did answer. If the answer wasnt full enough that's a different comment, but don't make out I ignored you. I'm working off a phone hence the grammar being crap.

And why not call the use of colo meta bullshit. You claim to have never been wrong when you accused me of scum, I call it bullshit to leverage that against me when I'm town here. I honestly don't remember you EVER leading a lynch on me, correct me if I'm wrong, so are you now hiding behind calling me scum and sitting on your hands?
I also don't think it's true that you have never read me as scum when I was town cos I reckon you still hedged your bets and again sat on your hands.

But it's all words. I can access colo anymore. If nacho brings vs I hard evidence from colo that you pushed hard on me only as scum every single time then what will it prove? I've said lynch me and then your record will be a joke anyway, are you gonna accept being lynched as a result?
Of course not, yet the bulk of your early arguement was 'trust me I'm ways right in his scum game'. It takes my life going to shit for you to get more ammo to fire, well congratulations.

Do whatever the hell you want. I really don't care. Out of courtesy to the game I have bombed I am trying to respond and keep it on topic. But I do not care.
Call this my escape... While here I don't have to bother with out there.