A uPick of Ice & Fire - Day 12 - #REKT?

[Tierce]

I didn't think it was

that

confusing.

It means that StupendousMan is too concerned about making friends, which he admits is, for him, beneficial for scum.

With Cephrir, the impression I get is that he's buddying up to me.

Travel safe!

[Thor665]

Oh, sure, but only because the setup was already conveniently there from Zdenek's language, which is pretty benign. It's a harmless, no-cost question and one that I don't think requires any level of actually caring about the answer to ask (indeed, the fact that we can see him not caring earlier implies that he still doesn't care this time, he just wanted to be seen to ask).

So you think he's scum capable of asking lazy interest questions, but was unable to ask lazy interest questions in his first push...I dunno, that still feels ganky to me.
I agree with you that both individual moments can be looked upon as scummy, but I feel the combination of them weakens the overall scum case.
Basically, he is either a scum who will do lazy questions, or a scum who won't care to ask questions...the combo...feels forced. If he is scum I don't think he's scum for the case you're pushing there and it feels like you're trying to overamp the case because you're scum, or it feels like you're town who has started to tunnel.
Want to try to adjust either of those or explain why I'm wrong here?

Thor- the tone is different then the completed town game

Can you link the completed town game for the lazy amongst us, and maybe explain the tonal difference?
I'm pretty sure I was in a game with him where he was town and I don't feel a difference yet, albeit I haven't seen much from him, but besides him acting polite (like Tierce is noting) I don't see anything really clicking as different to me. Help clue me in here, your case needs sheep, so you need to herd if you believe in it at all.

I do not do all the stuff folks here do.

I guage by reactions, tones and other elements that I will not explain

. Some I really cannot even fully put to words anyway as it is a general sense. Here, he comes off as forced. That is my reaction

We already have Mollie in this game...
Hint: it's not pro-town when she does it either.
Additional Hint: when a scumhunting "style" is described as "unexplainable" I always translate that to "illogical and should be ignored because they're making gak up and lack the grapefruits to just say so either to others, and possibly themselves."

Not

that

new. Newer than most people here, sure, but don't use that as an excuse. With that said, I believe that slot is Town, but the over-politeness is somewhat concerning.

Why call him town and ding him again on the over politeness?
I actually agree that it is weird coming from him, and also agree some of the people handing you pro-town oomph are being odd in general as I haven't seen anything of the sort yet.
I feel like this post is exceedingly fence-sitty and now support the idea of lynching you.
Whassup?

[Goat on a Raft]

So you think he's scum capable of asking lazy interest questions, but was unable to ask lazy interest questions in his first push...I dunno, that still feels ganky to me.
I agree with you that both individual moments can be looked upon as scummy, but I feel the combination of them weakens the overall scum case.
Basically, he is either a scum who will do lazy questions, or a scum who won't care to ask questions...the combo...feels forced. If he is scum I don't think he's scum for the case you're pushing there and it feels like you're trying to overamp the case because you're scum, or it feels like you're town who has started to tunnel.
Want to try to adjust either of those or explain why I'm wrong here?

Hmm, that's an interesting way of looking at it and you may have a point. This head developed the read by reading through the game from the start and noting down individual posts that appeared scummy - it's possible that, in seeing two notes about Stupendous posts when we were done, we have assumed that they can coexist as scumtells.

And we were so pleased to finally have a legit scumread...

[Goat on a Raft]

Let's try:

UNVOTE: StupendousMan
VOTE: SafetyDance

[Tierce]

Not

that

new. Newer than most people here, sure, but don't use that as an excuse. With that said, I believe that slot is Town, but the over-politeness is somewhat concerning.

Why call him town and ding him again on the over politeness?
I actually agree that it is weird coming from him, and also agree some of the people handing you pro-town oomph are being odd in general as I haven't seen anything of the sort yet.
I feel like this post is exceedingly fence-sitty and now support the idea of lynching you.
Whassup?

So I can't be wary and want to be damn sure of who I call Town, especially in a game that is likely multiball and probably has something like 6-8 scum? Good to know. ^__^

The things he is hitting seem Town. The way he's going at it seems too overly cautious/polite.

This worries me

. But I guess you can't see it~

As for

you

noticing proTown oomph, :hitoshrug:. You couldn't see it if it was a puppy riding an 18-wheeler with the word TOWN written in golden glittery paint on all sides.

But don't worry, in the future I will keep all my musings in private and only voice Sure Certainties in-thread. We wouldn't want the mighty Thor to think I am being fencesitting scum for thinking things through where others can see it.

tl;dr You wouldn't read me correctly if my role PM was posted in-thread.

[Shadoweh]

TIERCE I asked you something and you're ignoring me, it is hurting me in the Feels! Specifically about Benmage and Thor and whether you think there's actually something to worry about there. I asked when you mentioned Benmage could be having irl issues and be null so at least it was topical back then.

Goat: Maybe you'd be able to read me better if you'd stop rolling scum in the games we're in together. That goes for both of your heads!

[Tierce]

I didn't even see that post, I think? Hang on a moment.

[Eddard Stark]

- Kelly C and her dragons.

Day 1, Vc 30

PrideandJoy (1) -

Amrun

kanyeknowsbest (2) -

AGar, ooba

ooba (3) -

Alfred Borden, quadz08, PrideandJoy

StupendousMan (5)-

Tammy, Messiah Complex, Nautilius, Cephrir, PeaceBringer

Thor665 (2) -

Benmage, elleheathen

Cephrir (2) -

Garruk Relentless, Shadoweh

Goat on a Raft (1) -

Zdenek

AGar (1) -

kanyeknowsbest

Zdenek (1) -

StupendousMan

Garruk Relentless (1) -

SafetyDance

SafetyDance (3) -

Tierce, Syryana, Goat on a Raft

Amrun (2) -

Thor665, macmollie

Not voting (0)

- --

With 24 alive it takes 13 votes to lynch

• Deadline Date: 1st of October at 17:05 EDT
  
• Deadline Countdown: (expired on 2013-10-01 17:05:01)
  
• Thor and Benmage are V/la

[Tierce]

While I agree with the above and I

hate

to use this reasoning, the fact that Benmage is going through difficult stuff IRL may also influence how much of his mood is passing on to his posts, regardless of alignment.

I don't think so. When The Wire and Yoloville were going on at the same time, Benmage was working hard in Wire despite the circumstances that were making him /effort in Yoloville. I guess it's early to say it for sure but language-wise I'd be surprised if he was scum anything.

Do you think the whole Thor/Benmage thing is something besides two strong ego's butting heads?

Yeah, I'm not worried about Benmage at the moment.

As for Thor, I'm fairly sure he can believe the bullshit he says as scum without a problem--you only need to see his scum QTs to see how he apparently

actually believes

a lot of the stuff he says as scum, which is pretty baffling but essentially boils down to me completely disagreeing with a lot of his Mafia theory handling. /tangent
So while I didn't actually read it that closely yet and forgot most of what I did read, I think that that stuff is very little alignment-relevant for Thor. For Benmage, a bit more so do to his attitude.


Have your posts be more entertaining in the future and I might notice them sooner!

[PeaceBringer]

Can you link the completed town game for the lazy amongst us, and maybe explain the tonal difference?
I'm pretty sure I was in a game with him where he was town and I don't feel a difference yet, albeit I haven't seen much from him, but besides him acting polite (like Tierce is noting) I don't see anything really clicking as different to me. Help clue me in here, your case needs sheep, so you need to herd if you believe in it at all.

it is in his wiki, so no I am not going to link it. And no, I am not going to explain my thinking further.

[Thor665]

So I can't be wary and want to be damn sure of who I call Town, especially in a game that is likely multiball and probably has something like 6-8 scum? Good to know. ^__^

If I said that it would be sorta odd, wouldn't it? Good thing I didn't.
Don't you have issue with me "misrepping" all the time? What do you call this? I don't call it a misrep, i call it an extreme take of a conclusion drawn from what I said...but ten I think that's fine to do in a game in order to see reactions from it. What's your call on this strategy, and if it's not what you're doing here...what are you doing here?

The things he is hitting seem Town. The way he's going at it seems too overly cautious/polite.

This worries me

. But I guess you can't see it~

I can understand if it worries you. But why defend him and then condone him?
If you're unsure of him...why defend?
If you want to defend...why condone?
If your read is truly mixed, why jump into the conversation with "as regards this point you raised that no one asked me about...I have no idea at all!"
I hav no idea or opinion about stuff *all the time*. I don't share it with everyone.
What it felt like was a defense post with an excuse to vote later built it - hence fence-sitty.
Do you not see fence-sitting as scummy...or do you not think what you did was fence sitting - clarify either way pl0x!

[Thor665]

Oh, and as for inability to read you...i wasn't aware I ever claimed to be good at it. So...sure?

[Tierce]

So I can't be wary and want to be damn sure of who I call Town, especially in a game that is likely multiball and probably has something like 6-8 scum? Good to know. ^__^

If I said that it would be sorta odd, wouldn't it? Good thing I didn't.
Don't you have issue with me "misrepping" all the time? What do you call this? I don't call it a misrep, i call it an extreme take of a conclusion drawn from what I said...but ten I think that's fine to do in a game in order to see reactions from it. What's your call on this strategy, and if it's not what you're doing here...what are you doing here?

The things he is hitting seem Town. The way he's going at it seems too overly cautious/polite.

This worries me

. But I guess you can't see it~

I can understand if it worries you. But why defend him and then condone him?
If you're unsure of him...why defend?
If you want to defend...why condone?
If your read is truly mixed, why jump into the conversation with "as regards this point you raised that no one asked me about...I have no idea at all!"
I hav no idea or opinion about stuff *all the time*. I don't share it with everyone.
What it felt like was a defense post with an excuse to vote later built it - hence fence-sitty.
Do you not see fence-sitting as scummy...or do you not think what you did was fence sitting - clarify either way pl0x!

You're accusing me of scummy fencesitting for voicing that indecision. So no, I am not misrepresenting your position, because even if you did not word it that way on the first line, the whole post had certainly implied it, as you "now support a lynch" on me for voicing doubts on a Townread.

You might not share things with everyone all the time. Neither do I, but I

do

like to discuss them from time to time--and doesn't it seem like a logical thing to do

when you're not sure

? This game is rife with people I work well with and their input on my musings is extremely welcome. If and when I see the need to vote someone, I will do so. Having misgivings on a read and voicing them is perfectly legitimate; I was already looking for word from StupendousMan, so that beautifully-styled fence of mine is older than you think and you didn't seem to have a problem with it then.

[Thor665]

You're accusing me of scummy fencesitting for voicing that indecision. So no, I am not misrepresenting your position, because even if you did not word it that way on the first line, the whole post had certainly implied it, as you "now support a lynch" on me for voicing doubts on a Townread.

You might not share things with everyone all the time. Neither do I, but I

do

like to discuss them from time to time--and doesn't it seem like a logical thing to do

when you're not sure

?

WHy not ask a question about your read then, try to start a dialogue about it?
You didn't feel like you were questing for truth - you felt like you were setting yourself up to come down (pardon the extension of the allusion) on either side of the fence as needed.

I was already looking for word from StupendousMan, so that beautifully-styled fence of mine is older than you think and you didn't seem to have a problem with it then.

I'll guess it was because it was made as an accusation or question, as opposed to a defense post with a 'but' attached.
You can quote it if you want to prove me wrong, but I suspect I'm right.

[PeaceBringer]

We already have Mollie in this game...
Hint: it's not pro-town when she does it either.
Additional Hint: when a scumhunting "style" is described as "unexplainable" I always translate that to "illogical and should be ignored because they're making gak up and lack the grapefruits to just say so either to others, and possibly themselves."

Bullshit- crap like this is why I am a fish outta water here- sorry to flake but

REPLACE OUT

[Eddard Stark]

Searching for PeaceBringer replacement

[Shadoweh]

You know, maybe mafia isn't for you Peacebringer. <.<
Tierce, sorry I'm not being interesting, it turns out being serious makes me boring. I'm saving the fluent cosplaying fanfiction for when there's less people and they're more likely to read it. I figured that would be your answer.

[Syryana]

it turns out being serious makes me boring

You should have married the troll.

[Shadoweh]

Is having 2 wives illegal in Westeros? Maybe we could still work something out..

[Eddard Stark]

displaced replaces PeaceBringer. Thank you!

[Nautilius]

Eh, honestly, I think your reasons for reading Andy as town are naive. I mean, even when he was scum in The Game That Shall Not Be Mentioned, he seemed to be "having fun" (at least on the surface anyway - we're talking stuff like jovial tone, etc.) and I can see him doing the fake PR thing as either alignment really. Not really concerned about his activity because I know what's going on with him but I just want to see readable content from him and I don't have that yet and I'm not going to give him a pass for it.

notable thing is that the theory under the sea is thrown out due to the replace out
andrius is back on the list

Oh and I forgot, Nacho, I just looked at your second PoE list again to compare where we're at, and you need to cross Tierce off of it on the double mister. Do you remember what I said about my expertise? This shit is non-negotiable.

she's not scum, but i'm keeping her on the poe list out of spite

no time today, but i've read through and elli has been prodded

[Benmage]

There's 2 people voting off it... not very impressed with it either.. but why the Deflection?
-As for theory, I know as scum I love drawing town connections to my scum partners, so yeah if a flip does happen you can paint someone else negatively.
--Especially since its Smurfy reasoning to suspect Safety, but if Safety does flip scum for other reasoning... trying to draw this as a connective tell is simply Smurf.

Well...I did the deflection because I think it is a quite reasonable question. I had committed the least "crime" of your stated issue...yet was the only one attacked. Why not just answer why this was as opposed to deflecting my question by accusing me of deflection

Functionally you just did as much connection between me and him as I did between Nacho and him...so why is what I did an issue?

I agree that I don't like the case...that said, my connective tell was not based on the name thing, rather it was based on their reaction to the name thing. I made that fairly clear I thought. Does your issue with me work with that, or are you taking my stance as totally different?

Thank you for yielding your scummy ways.

In what capacity did I not answer your question?

-I wholly disagree with your drastic conclusion that what you said and what I said are anywhere near similar.
As far as I was concerned, you connected a "slip" as a scum read, and wanted to lynch the person the slip is about as the next lynch if the first were to flip scum. I said the first may flip scum, but such a flip would have no reflection upon the second person, whom you wanted to see hung.... Whats the word...

'lining up lynches'

if you will.

So since I seem to be confused by which connective tell you were using, please quote for me the Naut post you had issues with, and break down why this gave you a connective scum tell for me... as if I were a 5 year old (I simply hate ambiguity, see above confusion). Thank you.

[Amrun]

Forget to tell mod v/la over (every) weekend, my bad

[Cephrir]

I didn't think it was

that

confusing.

It means that StupendousMan is too concerned about making friends, which he admits is, for him, beneficial for scum.

With Cephrir, the impression I get is that he's buddying up to me.

Travel safe!

Remind me to address this when an ongoing game ends in the very near future. For now, let's just say this is not a strange thing for me to do.

[Messiah Complex]

{cephrir, zdenek, stupendous, garruk} is our conslidated lynchpool at the moment.

Cephrir - Continually puts down our case on Stupendous yet sheeps it. I don't see any of his own reasoning for Stupendous being his "top suspect," at least. Also reminiscent of his interactions with Elle and Thor during their argument, where he attacked Thor for not engaging with topics of discussion that Cephrir himself later admits aren't any good. Especially given he had already pledged to ignore Thor prior to. He's playing both sides on a lot of issues and it's super scummy.

zdenek - Zdenek's Goat push is really bad:

UNVOTE: StupendousMan, VOTE: Cephrir

Cephrir could have joined kanye in getting the game started. He didn't.

Why are you focussing on Cephir here?

When you consider that Zdenek was one of the people who didn't join Kanye in getting the game started:

Vote: Benmage

Obviously.

I'd also echo Stupendous' 811, and Zdenek's handling of Thor's claim doesn't show much town thought process either.

Garruk I leave to formerfish--I suspect he can have that case up by late tonight.

---------------

Why do you care what it can accomplish?

When you ask something that accomplishes nothing you are doing nothing to contribute and are either fluff posting or scum. Since it seems like mollie's playstyle involves a decent amount of fluff, I'm going to consider it null.

Yeah but you're the one who decided that mollie's question wasn't accomplishing anything.

Why so eager to defend yourself?

You don't let someone off the hook when they provide no reasoning for their suspicion.

Desp, I admire your efforts to put a reasonable case together, but I think you can do much better.

@ macmollie: the safetydance wagon is totally whack, I agree. What're you seeing with Stup? Is it because the wagon's been a little too easy? Because I feel like Nautilus, Cephrir, and Goat all basically just sheeped it and it's making me uneasy. And who are you looking at if not them?

@ Nautilus: why are you resorting to Stup already after you said you wanted to give them some room?