Newbie 1419 - GAME OVER

[Titus]

No. I wanted to be sure. I knew the scums knew. I am the type as doctor who would have gone for the less obvious. If both town knew, knowledge was not a slip. That is what I was thinking.

Of course, I could be the real doctor healing you.

[Brian Skies]

You would've claimed yesterday and lynched me.

Anyhow, we should both read through the game again and compare thoughts. I don't really have the time today, so I'll post something tomorrow or the next day.

[Amrun]

VC 4.1

(1) notscience - Shiidaji
(1) Shiidaji - notscience

With 4 alive, it takes 3 to lynch.

Not Voting: Titus, Brian Skies

V/LA:

Deadline: Tuesday, October 22 12pm EDT

Spoiler: Vote History

Shiidaji

- notscience

Brian Skies

-

Titus

-

notscience

- Shiidaji

If you spot any mistakes, please let me know.

EDIT: All flavor is irrelevant to the game.

EDIT: I somehow messed up the deadline, above is correct deadline sry

[Brian Skies]

I feel like the mod is insinuating something about me and Titus. It kind of hurts.

[Titus]

I am thinking Shii is the last scum. Look at his interactions with phokdapolice

[Shiidaji]

Feel free to point anything specific out and I'll be sure to ease your suspicion
(Refer to 478 in the meantime I'm still totally booked)

[Titus]

Rereading the last few pages I'm feeling better about Titus, some of my problems with him earlier could have been attributed to playstyle in retrospect and I'm picking up on some townvibes now, plus Verbs/JKM atp both being on him gives me willies.
-
Flammus replacing Mail doesn't place him high from the beginning but I'm reserving judgement until I see more of his thoughts.
-
Brian's 231 is basically where I'm at with a lot of people, more nulltown on nacho but other than that his stances mirror mine closely, he describes my Titus feeling perfectly, and describes how I feel about Gaiden's activity.

I'll give my opinion on the gambit. M M didn't seem like the most expierenced of players. I doubt that he could've pulled a scum self-vote out. It attracts attention and the spotlight to himself, which goes against the general mindset of newbies which is "please don't notice. Please don't ask me any questions".

I think his train of thought was "if I self-vote and show the town how I like to move out of RVS, then I'll get town reads."

Now I can just hear someone saying "get town reads? WTF! Why would a town need town reads? Obviously it's scum needing to avoid suspicion." But it's not just scum who need to be recognized by town. The whole town all bandwagoning a town player does no good for the overall town game.
This whole post problaby made no sense, but I'm tired. I don't know why exactly he used that gambit, and all we can do is speculate. My point is, usually a self-vote should be a red flag. But in a newbie game, where he said (I'm pretty sure he said this) that he played on other websites, then it might be an acceptable strategy there. He problaby didn't know the negativity it would bring him, but it DID get the game rolling.

That's the clincher though, after Mail self-voted, he didn't deliver on content before replacing out, which goes against this notion of him being town-who-knew-what-he-was-doing.
Flammus's 'I'll give my opinion' on his previous slot does give me some feelings of 'Hi, I'm town and let me tell you guys what I feel my predecessor was thinking' vibes, which comforts me.
-
Verbs's Gaiden vote is ok? It makes sense, but the tiny case could've been produced by either alignment without much effort, in general feels very lazy.

I don't like Flammus coming in on defending Verbs. Let players speak for themselves.

While I don't agree that it's defending, the foreign justification feels like something a buddy could do, revisiting if either flips red.

phok's reads and rationale matching mine are reassuring, just like Flammus I'm reserving judgement here because he might've just replaced someone who didn't know what they were doing.

Vote: Verbs

This in hindsight is not reassuring at all.

[notscience]

It's not like Shii just said he's more worried about easing your suspicion rather than point to reasons why I could be scum or anything

[Brian Skies]

@Brian, read everything the slot has done (just remember reads aren't necessarily the same)

And shii is meh

JKM's reason for subbing looks pro-town imo

You still need to explain this.

Once you do that, I can attack Shii. I've kind of disillusioned myself a bit. Titus isn't helping that much though.

[Brian Skies]

I've developed a case against Shii, I just don't want to share it yet.

[notscience]

There's a difference between a replace on a blank slot and already used slot.

JKM's looked pro-town.

Shii's was just a flaker.

[Brian Skies]

I'm asking you why you thought JKM was town at that point but not Shii.

[notscience]

I literally just explained it.

It was the replace out, scum wouldn't give a shit about being useless.

[Titus]

Not always true ns. If you are useless to your faction, suboutm

[notscience]

Is useless how you would define your consistent townread before today?

[Titus]

Rephrase please. I don't understand.

[notscience]

Rephrase please. I don't understand.

You say someone useless would have to shed the suspicions.

Would you classify Shii's play that you townread him for as useless?

[Brian Skies]

@Shiidaji:

Okay, here are the issues I have with your play this game. You can explain it however you wish, just know that I may feel the need to push your lynch.

Day 1: You push a Verbs lynch over a quantification post. You claim Verbs was pushing suspicion onto M-M as scum even though he was voting for Titus. I told you he was just working through a problem Nacho created for him. However, when it comes around time to hammer your scumread, you aren't on the wagon (which was bad but not for the reasons notscience said it was). Instead, you say you would love to hammer but want more information out of the day. Why does this seem mostly like an attempt at towncred? Also, your argument against Verbs feels wrong.

Day 2: Bert is killed night 1. You immediately bring up notscience as a possible suspect and use Bert's death as a possible reason notscience could be scum. "notscience already has a townread from Bert, so why keep him around?" It looks like you're lining up notscience's lynch. You use the wagon argument against ns in 478. However, you were also not on the wagon. Using the "one scum is likely to be off the wagon" argument, both of you fit the bill.

Day 3:

For someone who was so adamant as scum, they spent a lot of time not voting me.

Hell, I was Shii's top scumread in D1+D2.

AT ONE POINT, SHII EVEN SAYS IF IT ISNT TITUS THEN IT IS ME Yet, D3 Shii doesn't try to lynch me, nor does Shii try late-D2. Instead, Shii sees the perfect opportunity to push Nacho out because Shii knows he won't win a lylo 1v1 against Nacho.

I know I'm being redundant here, but it really feels like you were lining up ns's lynch. Day 3 feels wrong to me because of the way you were only trying to scumread Nacho. It also feels like reaching. It feels extremely different from Day 2 where you were sure if it wasn't Titus, then it was notscience.

There are other problems I've noticed, but that involves some serious nitpicking. And I don't really feel like doing that at the moment.

Also, explain this post:

unvote

He was acting suspiciously at the beginning of Day 2.

Elaborate.

Verbs, check me or Brian. If Flammus isn't scum ns-scum or nacho-scum would become pretty evident after a while.

[Brian Skies]

@Shiidaji: Do you have any recent completed scum-games or town-games I can look through?

[Amrun]

Shiidaji has been prodded.

[notscience]

Place your bets on how many he gets before the game is over.

[notscience]

He's not even engaged in the game.

[Titus]

Apathy can come from town or scum ns.

[notscience]

Oh, yes.

But apathy combined with coming in to ease suspicions?

[Brian Skies]

VOTE: notscience

@Titus: If you have something to say, say it now. If you want to vote Shii, let me know why. If you want us to try again at lylo (in which case there is only one of us but we may get another chance to address Shii), then feel free to not vote.

If you're wondering why I'm voting notscience, it's because of the extreme lengths I have to go to to read Shii as scum. I can see Shii as scum (but I can paint anyone as scum when looking at the right angles), but Shii has given me several town tells throughout the game.