Newbie 1437 - Chocolate Fondue Mafia (Over)

[jmo16mla]

who?

[notscience]

Bane, do you think flay's attack on me was one coming from scum?

[The Acting Method]

Yes that will be an interesting answer to hear from you.

[jmo16mla]

um, sure thing.

TAM, any input?

[Mr. Flay]

I think the "he eats and sleeps like anyone else" also can serve to belittle me. If you're town it's fine, but if you're not it could be a way to put off any argument I make that you don't like.

[/quote]

Truthfully I didn't take this as an attempt to belittle you. I feel he was just trying to make me more relaxed playing with more experienced players.[/quote]
Are you saying you legitimately had some 'fear' of playing with experienced players?? Why?

Everyone but jmo and I should answer #48.

[Mr. Flay]

Bloody hell... not sure what happened there.

Truthfully I didn't take this as an attempt to belittle you. I feel he was just trying to make me more relaxed playing with more experienced players.

Are you saying you legitimately had some 'fear' of playing with experienced players?? Why?

Everyone but jmo and I should answer #48.

[Number_0ne]

I'm not all too familiar with the exact strategy and meta on this website, but I'll give my point of view on things.

So, if you don't want to use your random questions yet, how do you propose we are going to get the scumhunting started?

Through use of rvs. Which eventually lead to serious votes.

VOTE: jmo16mla - not random.

First he asked whether or not I had replaced out. Might mean he was worried about a longtime IC, but moreso it shows a lack of attention paid.

Not paying attention doesn't mean scum, although the 1st part is still valid.

When I replied, he said he would "run away" rather than be lynched.

He might have been joking, but I'm unsure of this one because I don't know how often people mess around on Day 1 on this website.

Now, and most significantly, he wants a RVS after RQS. Which is just delaying the onset of the proper game further. Hence a vote (which makes 3 on him, I believe). Time to pony up, kids. Who of the 8 that have showed up so far do you think is scummy? The game is afoot!

I did not see him suggesting to do an RVS after RQS. Also, from what I saw, RVS was already underway. While some people may say that RVS is already over at that point, either way, mafia doesn't 'go back' to RVS after the 1st time. People already have judgements about other players, and it's not really random.

mod, not science is also voting me,

Flay, your vote has put me at L-1 on page two. No one vote me. Kthanks.

I'm fine with that for now, unless a better candidate presents themselves.

Well, I can't see any reason for scum to put someone at L-1 right now. Because if he actually got lynched from that soon, it would mean 1 of 2 things.

Either the other partner hammers, which is stupid on day 1.
Or a townie hammers, which is stupid in general. No townie with a bit of common sense would hammer someone who has 75% RVS votes on them.

I think the "he eats and sleeps like anyone else" also can serve to belittle me. If you're town it's fine, but if you're not it could be a way to put off any argument I make that you don't like.

Not really. I don't think that it would hold up as reasoning later on, as it's an ad hominem to actually use that to refute suspicion/evidence.

Still, the biggest thing was trying to revert to RVS. That is not the mark of a strong player, particularly one who says they are good as town.

Same as before.

However, there is 1 thing that does bother me quite a bit. All of Mr. Flay's reasons for voting jmo16mla are things where he could easily say: "Oh, never mind, I misunderstood." and back out of his reasoning. I'm somewhat suspicious of Mr. Flay at this point. As for jmo, I don't see much that would make him scummy, unless he was afraid of ICs as scum.


I don't really see anything else right now, so...

Unvote
Vote: Mr. Flay

[The Acting Method]

I disagree Number. I see Flay's Attack on jmo being null.

My only real concern right now is that they could be scum distancing from each other.

[jmo16mla]

Damn that guy is good.^^^ :/

Who's missing?

[zakk]

Everyone but jmo and I should answer #48.

I don't think you're necessarily mafia for your attack on jmo16 itself. You could just be... well, wrong. However, the interesting part is that you seem to be fishing to get people to say exactly this, so in a broader sense, yes. That does raise my suspicion of you a little.

For the record, I too thought you had replaced out, and that singersigner had made a mistake inserting you into this game. So I can definitely see where he is coming from.

After reading jmo16's posts, I don't particularly feel that he is mafia, and here's why:

The typos in his first post (#8) are inconsistent with what I would expect from mafia who might be nervous about playing with someone else. I would expect them to be a little more careful with their first post in the game, and try to make a good impression. That's what I would do, anyway.

His statement that he'd run away if you voted him doesn't seem suspicious to me at all. It seems like townie-to-assumed-townie banter.

Wanting random voting in addition to random questions isn't suspicious I don't think. It's much better than answering the questions and then sitting around twiddling our thumbs. It shows that he's trying to promote activity at the very least. Anyway, we don't seem to be pressed for time and activity at this point. And since this is your most significant point, I can say that I firmly disagree with you that his actions have been overly suspicious thus far.

That said, I'm not saying he's not mafia. I'm just saying I don't see what you see.

And putting him at L-1 on page 2 is certainly in bad form, from what I have been led to expect. Especially in a game where everybody has not posted yet. What if somebody comes back and decides to jump on the bandwagon but then realizes they accidentally put the final vote down? Like Fart Bane (heh) said. It's just not smart. I would have unvoted too.

In any case, this discussion is probably going to lead to a net benefit for town, judging based on people's stances on things at this early state where we know relatively little.

[The-Duck]

How do people think that RQS could be good for scum? and which people think that?

I'm not saying I entirely believe it can be good for scum.... BAUT it can set off easy wagons with little thought fast at the start of games. Which more experienced scum will most likely lead, and get fast town-cred. (my two cents)

If I read the above correct, you are saying scum will be likely to lead an easy wagon out of RQS?
That is essentially saying that mr Flay is likely to be scum..
I'd also like to know how you think scum gets towncred for pushing some easy wagon?
Either the lynch doesn't go trough and it is more or less null, or the lynch goes trough and they have pushed a mislynch. How do they gain credit for that?

About Mr Flay's case on Jmo16mla:
I don't think the running away part meant anything. The part about flay being human was a logical response to Fart Bane's comment* (although not as nicely worded as could have been)
I was under the impression that RQS was used instead of RVS, so that argument could hold some water.
but by no means is that as scummy as putting someone to L-1 and not noting it (even falsely stating it was L-2, setting up for an easy "I agree with those points, lets put him at L-1, oh shit we killed him" vote.
Then again, I got the feeling this case was used as an demonstration of how to start the game properly, instead of actually doing some more RVS. So I'm not going to put too much weight in my read of this case.
TAM, don't you think that, if this was scum on scum, Mr. Flay would have stated it was L-1 to avoid an accidental lynch?

*The comment itself is kind of weird, there is only 1 scenario in which you have to be intimidated by a very experienced player. That's when you have different alignments. If you are both scum, there is no need to worry; If you are town, you don't need to worry yet, as probability indicates he's more likely town than scum. But if you are scum, you know he's of different alignment, and could be a little worried.

So, I'm very slightly suspicious of Mr Flay, Jmo16mla is still null.
I do want to hear more from Fart Bane, as he's read the case, but didn't comment on it properly.
UNVOTE: Zakk
VOTE: Fart Bane

[DeasVail]

Vote Count 1.02

jmo16mla (3)- The Acting Method, notscience, Mr. Flay
Fart Bane (2)- zakk, The-Duck
Mr. Flay(1)- Number_0ne
notscience (1)- jmo16mla

Not voting: Endernys, Fart Bane

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline

21st October, 3pm AEDT. This is in (expired on 2013-10-21 00:00:00)

[Endernys]

Hi everyone, just letting everyone know I exist and will make a proper post in about 3-4 hours, if everything goes as I've planned irl.

[The Acting Method]

Welcome Endernys.

And Zakk, sometimes questions are asked that should be asked to more than one person.

I probably would have suggested it myself frankly.

I don't consider that fishing I consider that being an IC.

Which it's why IC is one of the hardest jobs in n00b mafia.

[Endernys]

Alrighty, first I'll answer the questions.

1. What time zone are you in? GMT +2
2. How often do you expect to be on and posting? Once or twice every 24 hours.
3. How manygames have you played in? Two, but none in serious Mafia communities.
4. What is your opinion on Lynch all Lurkers/Liars? For the lurkers part, if there's not many scum compared to town, yeah, I'd lynch them. Not near the end of the game though, many town roles I've seen so far have played rather quietly and I don't think it's a risk we could take when a mislynch could be decisive. Liars: yep, in almost all cases you should lynch the liars. When you're town, I really don't see much reason to lie.
5. What side do you prefer playing as? Town. Funny thing is, I wasn't town in either of those previous two games I played.

Now, I honestly don't have any major suspicions right now, two people that seem more suspicious than others to me are Flay and Fart Bane. Flay for being aggressive at jmo, who isn't suspicious at all in my opinion and giving reasons that he can back out of easily. Fart Bane for what The Duck brought out. Of those two, Mr. Flay is more suspicious to me, but but I'm not giving in my vote yet, I wanna gather more than these rather light suspicions.

[Mr. Flay]

For those jumping on me for jumping on jmo: where are your suspects where are your cases? This is early game, a very Low Information phase (but not Zero Information, like RVS. So what are you doing to advance the game forward? We only have two weeks, less now that we had to wait on a replacement.

[notscience]

Do you need a case to jump on someone?

[The Acting Method]

No but it's generally appreciated. Number looks of interest to me. I will have to reveiw everyone to get a further idea.

[Fart Bane]

Truthfully I didn't take this as an attempt to belittle you. I feel he was just trying to make me more relaxed playing with more experienced players.

This.

Not trying to belittle anyone. Just calling you human. Its rather easy to spot scum coming out of RVS due to them not knowing exactly what to do and leaving them twiddling their thumbs. though.

Bane, try to keep the multi posts down. One concise post recognizing all of your points gets across far better than 4 or even 5 in a row.

Bane, do you think flay's attack on me was one coming from scum?

Sorry I will attempt to post less with more content. I sorta gotta rush now so I might have like three posts.... sorry.
I feel that flays attack on you was either just him personally feeling a bit frustrated (can' think of a better word then belittled). Or him just trying to get the game moving. Most likely a combination of both.

[Fart Bane]

Bloody hell... not sure what happened there.

Truthfully I didn't take this as an attempt to belittle you. I feel he was just trying to make me more relaxed playing with more experienced players.

Are you saying you legitimately had some 'fear' of playing with experienced players?? Why?

Everyone but jmo and I should answer #48.

I didn't have a fear of playing with experienced players but truthfully it is still a bit intimidating playing with the... (drum roll) megatron.

[Fart Bane]

How do people think that RQS could be good for scum? and which people think that?

I'm not saying I entirely believe it can be good for scum.... BAUT it can set off easy wagons with little thought fast at the start of games. Which more experienced scum will most likely lead, and get fast town-cred. (my two cents)

If I read the above correct, you are saying scum will be likely to lead an easy wagon out of RQS?
That is essentially saying that mr Flay is likely to be scum..
I'd also like to know how you think scum gets towncred for pushing some easy wagon?
Either the lynch doesn't go trough and it is more or less null, or the lynch goes trough and they have pushed a mislynch. How do they gain credit for that?

About Mr Flay's case on Jmo16mla:
I don't think the running away part meant anything. The part about flay being human was a logical response to Fart Bane's comment* (although not as nicely worded as could have been)
I was under the impression that RQS was used instead of RVS, so that argument could hold some water.
but by no means is that as scummy as putting someone to L-1 and not noting it (even falsely stating it was L-2, setting up for an easy "I agree with those points, lets put him at L-1, oh shit we killed him" vote.
Then again, I got the feeling this case was used as an demonstration of how to start the game properly, instead of actually doing some more RVS. So I'm not going to put too much weight in my read of this case.
TAM, don't you think that, if this was scum on scum, Mr. Flay would have stated it was L-1 to avoid an accidental lynch?

*The comment itself is kind of weird, there is only 1 scenario in which you have to be intimidated by a very experienced player. That's when you have different alignments. If you are both scum, there is no need to worry; If you are town, you don't need to worry yet, as probability indicates he's more likely town than scum. But if you are scum, you know he's of different alignment, and could be a little worried.

So, I'm very slightly suspicious of Mr Flay, Jmo16mla is still null.
I do want to hear more from Fart Bane, as he's read the case, but didn't comment on it properly.
UNVOTE: Zakk
VOTE: Fart Bane

Perhaps I wasn't being clear... BAUT what I meant is anyone can look town by pointing out things that look sketchy anywhere. Its just in RQS a lot of people are less cautious then normally posts. So people who jump on that fast get town vibes from most people throughout the game. Though I still only played one game so I don't have that much experience of what goes on around RQS and RVS

[Number_0ne]

but by no means is that as scummy as putting someone to L-1 and not noting it (even falsely stating it was L-2, setting up for an easy "I agree with those points, lets put him at L-1, oh shit we killed him" vote.


TAM, don't you think that, if this was scum on scum, Mr. Flay would have stated it was L-1 to avoid an accidental lynch?

i'm not entirely sure, but I think that the vote count had initially been off a bit, so it could have been because of that for stating it was L-2. That said, it could have also been deliberately been taking advantage of that discrepancy in the event that someone hammered, and blaming mod error.

Definitely agree with you about the last part.

Now, I honestly don't have any major suspicions right now, two people that seem more suspicious than others to me are Flay and Fart Bane. Flay for being aggressive at jmo, who isn't suspicious at all in my opinion and giving reasons that he can back out of easily. Fart Bane for what The Duck brought out. Of those two, Mr. Flay is more suspicious to me, but but I'm not giving in my vote yet, I wanna gather more than these rather light suspicions.

I'm now slightly suspicious of Endernys, because he seems to be regurgitating information and providing assent without actually voting.

[notscience]

That was a question towards Flay, TAM :/

[Mr. Flay]

I didn't have a fear of playing with experienced players but truthfully it is still a bit intimidating playing with the... (drum roll) megatron.

[offtopic]
It's Me

t

atron, not Me

g

atron. If I was Megatron in this game I'd have shot somebody by now.
[/offtopic]

Do you need a case to jump on someone?

I think so yes, otherwise what are you jumping on them for? Even gut would be better than nothing, but I am NOT a gut player. RVS is for scrubs.

I'll post more tonight or in the morning, gotta go to work. I can read the thread on my phone but only short posts during weekdays (and last night was my anniversary).

[Endernys]

Now, I honestly don't have any major suspicions right now, two people that seem more suspicious than others to me are Flay and Fart Bane. Flay for being aggressive at jmo, who isn't suspicious at all in my opinion and giving reasons that he can back out of easily. Fart Bane for what The Duck brought out. Of those two, Mr. Flay is more suspicious to me, but but I'm not giving in my vote yet, I wanna gather more than these rather light suspicions.

I'm now slightly suspicious of Endernys, because he seems to be regurgitating information and providing assent without actually voting.

I can see where you're coming from, but I simply don't have anything new to bring to the table right now, so I just stated what I thought at the moment.

On another note, I have a debating tournament tomorrow and on Sunday, so I probably will not post anything during those two days. Possibly on Sunday evening though.