Newbie 1436 ~ Game Over

[Wisdom]

It looked like he was just faking it to me. He dropped the gambit after everyone except agi had posted without counterclaiming.

[Wisdom]

But sakura, apart from that. Cabd is not an emotional player, the only reason he keeps ate'ing this hard is to appeal to you. He knows very well that it's something you do as town and that it will make you keep believing he's town. You can't possibly tell me that you don't see this.

[Sakura Hana]

the only reason he keeps ate'ing this hard is to appeal to you.

Why would he need to do that? I already said I'm never voting him.

On other news I think my vote is gonna head here now:

Vote: notscience

If you're really the doc then help me find the roleblocker so that our cop lives tonight.

[Wisdom]

Because you're his only chance to survive. Bert already stated he might sheep you and agi might also do.

[Sakura Hana]

Am I? I think I've said enough why Cabd is super town because of my gambit. Why did he fake a cop inno on me to protect me from a NK if that would put him on hot waters if the real cop came and claimed, assuming he did know I wasn't the cop.

[Wisdom]

You're still not seeing this from scum PoV. It's far more important to Cabd to get the town cred that he got from that gambit (especially if he is the roleblocker) AND learn who the actual PRs are (if someone counterclaimed him, he could just argue he was gambitting, like he did when he dropped the gambit) than it is to simply push a lynch on you which wasn't even guaranteed to succeed. Even more so if the person he uses the gambit on is someone he can manipulate.

[Bert]

Bert already stated he might sheep you

I may have said I *might*, but then this morning while catching up I see Sakura saying Cabd is a strong townread...so yeah...thanks but no thanks

what does give me hesitance is that doc claim, and that being what Sakura just did in her last newbie which led to Grimmy being lynched in LYLO. So yeah, that does give me pause, don't get me wrong

but seriously, that "I'll self hammer in 2 days" thing is exactly what JasonWazza did as scum in 1415, Ffery, to try to get me to lay off him. Not cool, and makes you look worse

OK, catching up fully now

[Bert]

So ffery, what's the difference between town-flail and scum-flail? I've never quite understood how it's different or what you do to discern between the two... also, what do you think of Cabd's flailing thus far? Wisdom, you can answer too

My first impression is there's potential scum motivation as that kind of AtE (specifically, the style) is what superficially appeals to notscience, me, and Sakura (and agi102 who is new)

[Bert]

EBWOP: My last thought before I head out is that Cabd's reads on me have felt forced in this game, not following really a natural flow progressing in figuring me out. So there's that.

Really, the gambit for Cabd is not a plus for him, no matter how hard he tries to make it seem like it makes him town

There, now you know what I'm thinking.

[Wisdom]

Bert what's with the fencesitting? On one line you state you don't like Sakura's Cabd townread and in the other you say you don't like my claim. Clarify your stance.

pedit: I answered that already. Cabd is not an emotional player, the sole purpose is to appeal to Sakura who is an emotional player and flails similarly. Possibly to agi too, yes.

[Sakura Hana]

Also, Wisdom, I'm just 1 person, he doesn't need to appeal to me, im not even voting him and already stated that I will never vote him.

[fferyllt]

Bert what's with the fencesitting? On one line you state you don't like Sakura's Cabd townread and in the other you say you don't like my claim. Clarify your stance.

pedit: I answered that already. Cabd is not an emotional player, the sole purpose is to appeal to Sakura who is an emotional player and flails similarly. Possibly to agi too, yes.

I'm pretty sure it's meant to shake me as well.

[Wisdom]

ffery, you know him more than we do. Is it logical for him to flail like that?

[Wisdom]

Also, Wisdom, I'm just 1 person, he doesn't need to appeal to me, im not even voting him and already stated that I will never vote him.

There was nothing else he could do though, and he had to try something as a last resort. He knows he can't deal with me (last time I pegged him he went all apathetic about the game) so he tried to appeal to you to convince the others.

[Bert]

Bert what's with the fencesitting? On one line you state you don't like Sakura's Cabd townread and in the other you say you don't like my claim. Clarify your stance.

pedit: I answered that already. Cabd is not an emotional player, the sole purpose is to appeal to Sakura who is an emotional player and flails similarly. Possibly to agi too, yes.

Your claim makes me paranoid. It's hard to shake that off when Sakura just did that in her last game. Same play, same scenario. Can you see that from my POV?

Sorry about my stance not being clear. VOTE is going CABD's way. NOT moving, never ever ever ever

That emotional manipulation is just too blatant and I don't trust him with a ten-foot pole. Add onto that his play in this game I can't see as town. The gambit, the weird tension-filled "reads" on me.

BUT, there is a part inside me that is paranoid about this being one of those fake doc claims. Also, I do not have confidence in reading you. You skated by in 1402 during my one day there. Add to that the fact that I haven't liked Kaze at all since Day 1 and was on that wagon.

But there was no momentum on Cabd and I didn't think it possible to lynch him, what with Sakura's hard-defending, etc., etc. and them saying that the game is an auto-win as Cabd, Sakura, agi102 are conftown. That stuff resonantes with me still.

I *think* Cabd is scum. And I think the AtE is a load of bull and should be disregarded.

Ffery/cabd as a team? ffery/kaze? What throws me off is she has come in expressing willingness to hammer *both.* I have had Ffery as town but I've also been paranoid because I haven't seen her as scum and she has fooled Cabd several times before.

[Bert]

So, in other words:

1) Telling us we will lose (manipulation)
2) self-hammering thing in 48 hours (which would end the day early)
3) telling us he will rub this in our face after the game (???)
4) gambit and him saying it makes him conftown (double ?????)
5) toeing the line by saying if avi bets were allowed, he would do so

The desperation doesn't seem genuine, coming from someone like him. That is all.

[Sakura Hana]

Considering I was the main actor fo that fake claim consider how I feel, but it's a different scenario, back then I had no way of knowing for certain there was a cop, but I had a feeling pieguy was one, in this game there's a claimed cop, so it's easy for scum to fakeclaim.

[Cabd]

I'm rubbing this townflip in your face postgame too, bert.

(BTW in case anyone hadn't noticed, I've already accepted my lynch and I'm just emotionally trolling everyone until notsci gets here)

[fferyllt]

So ffery, what's the difference between town-flail and scum-flail? I've never quite understood how it's different or what you do to discern between the two... also, what do you think of Cabd's flailing thus far? Wisdom, you can answer too

My first impression is there's potential scum motivation as that kind of AtE (specifically, the style) is what superficially appeals to notscience, me, and Sakura (and agi102 who is new)

It's player specific. In general, scum focus on what's wrong with the argument being made. Town tend to get more self righteous because the thing that's wrong with the argument is that it's fundamentally wrong - they're town, not scum.

I feel like he's kind of mirroring back my flail in the paradox prime game, tbh. I expected to be lynched, was pissy about it, insulted players, especially players I thought were scum, and tried to stay focused on improving town's chances after my flip. I got myself into the situation where my lynch made sense, though, and I owned that. I wasn't lynched that day because of a Cabd gambit. He faked a cop innocent result on me.

Fatalism is a flaw in my game though. Not so much with Cabd. As town, when he does look toward being lynched IME he's seeing it as part of a strategy to win the game by eliminating an unknown that can't otherwise be clarified.

Chef mafia game, where he was lynched on day 3: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=30901 Town was in an autowin situation, though.

[Bert]

What I'm trying to say is, I felt in a rut where Kaze, notscience, and myself were the only lynch choices, and none of them felt *right.* Kaze was the scummiest out of all of them, but Kaze-notscience as a *team* if Ffery is really town, with Cabd-agi-Sakura claiming to be conftown with Ffery???

That was insinuating an easy "lynch two out of Bert-Kaze-notscience" in two days and cruise to a win. It had that written all over it. I can't shake off that feeling of hopelessness that if Kaze and notscience are town (I *think* ns's blatant aggressiveness tunnely thing is not being emulated) then we're in deep trouble.

[Sakura Hana]

I didnt say ffery was conftown, she's just a very strong townread of mine.

[Sakura Hana]

Also her latest posts just make her even more town in my eyes.

[Bert]

I'm rubbing this townflip in your face postgame too, bert.

(BTW in case anyone hadn't noticed, I've already accepted my lynch and I'm just emotionally trolling everyone until notsci gets here)

Ffery and agi102 haven't decided yet. They're the factor now that determines whether you live...

not notscience, not me, not Wisdom

Sakura won't vote you, so it's up to you with only (2) votes at the moment to cast on others, to convince agi102 and Ffery

why are you giving up so easily??

[Cabd]

Because i'm the shoe in lynch at LYLO. And that will lose the game. It's better to lynch me now (hurry the fuck up notscience) and go from there tomorrow.

[Bert]

I didnt say ffery was conftown, she's just a very strong townread of mine.

I see. my bad.

But Cabd and you were implying that you had three conftowns in you, Agi102, and cabd, and then Cabd said that Ffery can be added into the conftown (4) leading to an auto-win.

That kinda confidence scared me big-time. The "game's over, we got this." That does not sit well with me.

P-edit: Cabd, you're at LYNCH -1 and notscience is ALREADY voting you. Only Ffery and agi102 are likely to hammer, and we have several days left to discuss this. What is the rush, my good sir