Micro 252: There Is No Doctor - END

[Bulbazak]

Why am I not an easy person to develop a read on? I find it a rather odd comment considering my scum play and town play are very different.

I have very limited experience with you, but I find your scum play and your town play to be very similar. You are very logical in both and will even go so far as to present meta cases on the players. There

are

very subtle differences, but I would need more time to make sure that I'm not seeing false positives.

You are using a very weak RVS-POE reason this late into the game.

This is still relatively early, and I felt that it would help in finding scum.

It was an RVS-wagon.

It's an RVS wagon now? That's funny. You seemed to have treated it fairly seriously for it to be random. In fact, I'd say that if any vote on that wagon was not random, it was yours.

I don't think scum would particularly care that they are on the same wagon.

Especially with an easy mislynch giftwrapped for them? I suppose you're right.

It bothers me that you are hedging on me. You seem to be aware that I might end up being a "default" wagon for everyone to move their votes to, and so you decline to give a read on me in order to later vote me as a compromise. This lets other players like ETL take the brunt of the responsbility for my lynch absolving you of any.

I wouldn't say that I'm hedging. Are you a priority to figure out? No. If it came down to deadline and I needed to compromise, would I vote you? Yes. Would I be absolved of responsibility should you flip town? Heck, no! I would naturally imagine there would be questioning of the wagon the next day. Would I stand by my decision? Yes.

They asked you questions and pressed you for answers and you answered them.

That's normally how it works. If you have a question, ask me and I'll answer it. I'm not one to randomly spout out everything I'm thinking.

Why do you not care to read me or pay attention to me? I am a player in this game just like any other with just as much chance of being scum or town as any other player.

Because I know I'm going to have a harder time reading you early in the game, so I put you to the side and revisit you after I have more information. I do the same thing when I play with Nacho.

P-edit: Sangres, nothing much has stood out on the wagons so far. I'm typically not one for VCA.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Bulbazak, who are the scumteam? What are your reads on the people that you have developed reads on?

[Bulbazak]

Bulbazak, who are the scumteam?

Haven't figured that out yet. I have Pitoli and one of {you, Sangres, Chaos}. I hope to have it narrowed down by tomorrow.

What are your reads on the people that you have developed reads on?

Pitoli is scum. ETL and TIP are town. I'm also leaning town on Rose.

[pitoli]

VOTE: TheIrishPope

Why vote the innocent child?

You think that's RVS? With that tone?
And you don't need a vote on you to omgus someone

So you're telling me you had a sudden epiphany about a vote made on page 1?!? And instead of continuing to push a scumread, you decided to ~make a point~ about something long dead and gone?

I don't understand the question.

Why did post 24 warrant a vote so long after the fact?

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

So, you think Chaos came right out the gate accusing Pitoli of being GF? Why?

Why Sangres?

Why is TIP town?

[Bulbazak]

So, you think Chaos came right out the gate accusing Pitoli of being GF? Why?

You do understand that I put everyone that I didn't have a strong read on in the same category, right? I actually don't have a read on Chaos one way or the other, due to the fact that he hasn't post much. I did like his analysis on Pitoli in regards to her being possible GF, though.

Why Sangres?

Because Nacho hasn't made an impression on me so far. Therefore, although I've put the hydra to the side to sort later, I'm still wary of them.

Why is TIP town?

His play here reminds me of NY165. He was town in that game.

[ChaosOmega]

Bulbazak, I can't believe that you have no read on me - at all. I have made plenty of posts, pushed at scumreads, defended townreads really hard and have been one of the most active players in the game.

Did anyone else find this odd?

Yes. It reads artificial as fuck. "Guys, I've done all the things I'm supposed to do, you HAVE to think I'm town now!"

oh, why is that a good thing?

That was a serious question, I'd love to get an answer.

These were about this quote by TIP:

Good thing there's no Doctor huh

Why was that a serious question? I'm hoping your plan wasn't for him to admit he was scum there. You're trying to look town in the easiest and least-useful way possible. "Guys, not having a doctor is bad, I'm town, doctors are good, yay!"

The whole refusing to give an explanation of her read is off. I don't see the town motivation behind not pushing for the lynch of a player you think is scum. Is it that you were ashamed of your reasoning, because after being hounded about it for a bit, all you could muster was:

I didn't like TIPs reactions, and that started as soon as post 14.

Alright TIP, time to string you up, one player does not like your banter and replies to other people. You don't even give examples. No semblance of a case. Do you actually want him lynched? Because you're not making any fucking show of it.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Yes. It reads artificial as fuck. "Guys, I've done all the things I'm supposed to do, you HAVE to think I'm town now!"

Read it in context. Bulbazak's read on me depends on his read of Pitoli which makes no sense given what I have done. I could understand if Bulbazak scumreads me for my actions or stances in this game. But the fact is that I have taken plenty of stances and it makes no sense to read me based on Pitoli's flip. I am not saying he "has" to think I am town, I'd have been okay even if he read me as scum as long as he read

me

and not Pitoli.

Also, your read on TPR is bad. You are re-phrasing what he/she said to give them a scum twist. You did the same with my quotes.

Why no follow up about my reaction to your case on Pitoli?

[pitoli]

Read it in context. Bulbazak's read on me depends on his read of Pitoli which makes no sense given what I have done. I could understand if Bulbazak scumreads me for my actions or stances in this game. But the fact is that I have taken plenty of stances and it makes no sense to read me based on Pitoli's flip. I am not saying he "has" to think I am town, I'd have been okay even if he read me as scum as long as he read

me

and not Pitoli.

Actually, the fact that Bulbazak's read on you depends on my flip makes a lot of sense. Considering the stance you have taken towards me today.

[pitoli]

I'm skimming through the game and I'm realizing that I'm playing a pretty self-centered game this time around - sorry about that. I'm going to try to do some homework and widen my scope a bit.

[ChaosOmega]

Why no follow up about my reaction to your case on Pitoli?

Because I don't really care what you think. What I've gotten from my read of you is that I think you're a bad player and I'm not inclined to try and change your mind on anything.

Read it in context.

It doesn't need to be. I don't care what context it is in, there is literally no reason for a town player to say "I have made plenty of posts, pushed at scumreads, defended townreads really hard and have been one of the most active players in the game." It reads like you selling somebody on your towniness, and feel free to spout off more theory bullshit that I don't care about, but town's job is not to look town, it is to find scum.

[Bulbazak]

I am not saying he "has" to think I am town, I'd have been okay even if he read me as scum as long as he read

me

and not Pitoli.

Why do I HAVE to read you and

not

Pitoli?

[pitoli]

To anyone who can answer: does F-16 usually insist on the "I'm so town, look at me" approach as town?

[Bulbazak]

does F-16 usually insist on the "I'm so town, look at me" approach as town?

Idk. Nacho might know. I just know that he's more erratic in this game than I'm used to seeing him.

[pitoli]

I don't mind when a player brazenly projects "I'm so town" in one way or another; sometimes if it's accompanied with enough attitude, it's enough for me to actually townsort them that way. But I don't think I've seen it quite to this extent, which has actually pushed F-16 to my scumpile for the time being.

[BBmolla]

goddamn i suck at bbcode.

BBmolla can you fix for me please? <3

I fixed the one I could.

[sangres]

Is there a reason you haven't decided to sync up with us?

I want to. In fact, the one thing that most excited me about this game was to be town in a game where you two are town. But I am bad at reading you and ffery's posts are terrible.

Why are ffery's posts terrible? I know that she's not taking the strong stance and leading the game like you expect her to if town, but "passive" doesn't quite equal horrible for me.

It's the same as your response to bulba's post about f-16. You say agree and then show you still don't get it. It's not particulary hard, we were hardly the only ones that got it, including f16 himself. But you are contrary there. It's the same around the tip case. You simply do not get the lines of thought. I think the thing that frustrates me when talking to you is that your mindset is different. You simply do not think as town.

I don't really understand how ETL not understanding things makes her scum.

Nacho, where are you at regarding your reads? Do you still think Pitoli is scum? If so why?

At first, I didn't really like pitoli because the only thing she was doing was defusing other people's reads and waffling hard (#32, #51), and I was hoping to draw out some sort of reaction with my "counterwagon!" vote. Her reaction was voting me for the

timing

of my vote, not the obviously flawed logic or the weirdness of it, which felt off to me. I could understand if she thought it was something that was strange coming from me or obviously scummy, but timing was an odd way to justify it. "It just didn't feel like you gave it that much thought" was the first part where I got an inkling of a townread on her, but the fact that the timing was the main thing that bothered her still bothered me. #159 was also weird because it didn't seem like she was particularly convinced that I was town (why would she be worried about me being convinced that she's scum when I'm the scummiest person on the wagon?), but her posting after that point is more along the lines of what I expect from pitoli town. Her push on TiP seemed pretty fucking genuine (#331 especially), and I think ffery's reasons for townreading her are also pretty fucking good.

Who are you and what have you done with Bulbazak?

I decided to try something different this game.

P-edit: ETL, settle down. You take this too seriously sometimes. Loosen up and have fun.

You're still tunneling like crazy

I have a feeling TPR might just be a cranky flower instead of scum.

Just a feeling, or do you maybe have something better?

Nacho, let me know a good time when you'll be on.

This weekend will probably be low access for me, but I'll probably be around pretty much all day Monday.

does F-16 usually insist on the "I'm so town, look at me" approach as town?

Idk. Nacho might know. I just know that he's more erratic in this game than I'm used to seeing him.

It's freaking ffery out a bit, but I think that it's something that's more likely to see in his scumgame as opposed to his towngame; it's a card people pull when they expect to be townread or when they're supposed to be expecting other people to townread them and I'm not sure F-16's scumgame has gotten to the point where he can pull off #2 yet, if that makes any sort of sense.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

UNVOTE:

I am not so sure atm. Some of Bulbazak's latest posts made sense while Chaos has been giving off scumvibes.

Pitoli, I have not said "I am so town, look at me." I don't care that you townread people who do it so brazenly. In fact, I'm sure both scum and town will do it. As I explained, I am insisting that Bulbazak read me without associative tells since I believe I've made enough of an impact on the game in order for him to read me that way.

I actually agree now that him attempting to make associative tells between us is not necessarily indicative of a scum thought process. My issue was that he was doing it since the beginning of the game even before I started hardcore defending you. I felt his reasoning there was weak.

Bulbazak, I am not saying you have to read me and not read Pitoli. Rather, I insisted for your read on me based on my actions in the game as opposed to Pitoli's.

Chaos, how do you expect to get your scumreads lynched if others read them as town and you are not inclined to change their mind?

385 is very dismissive and gives me the feeling that you are trying very hard to brush aside the conversation. For example, I've explained the intent behind my post and you've just dismissed it as "selling someone of your towniness" when I explained the entire context of the conversation.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Why are ffery's posts terrible? I know that she's not taking the strong stance and leading the game like you expect her to if town, but "passive" doesn't quite equal horrible for me.

Is there a single game as town that she hasn't done so as town? "Terrible" was a bad choice of a word, I am sorry. I meant "scummy," "scum-motivated," or "likely to come from scum."

It's freaking ffery out a bit, but I think that it's something that's more likely to see in his scumgame as opposed to his towngame; it's a card people pull when they expect to be townread or when they're supposed to be expecting other people to townread them and I'm not sure F-16's scumgame has gotten to the point where he can pull off #2 yet, if that makes any sort of sense.

I am not sure I follow this. You think it is more likely that it is coming from me as scum and ffery is "freaking out" over it, so you should both be scumreading me. But you say my scumgame hasn't got to that point which implies you are townreading me. So, which is it? What #2 are you referring to?

[Bulbazak]

You're still tunneling like crazy

Come on, Nacho. You know that this isn't the worst I've ever tunneled a read.

does F-16 usually insist on the "I'm so town, look at me" approach as town?

Idk. Nacho might know. I just know that he's more erratic in this game than I'm used to seeing him.

It's freaking ffery out a bit, but I think that it's something that's more likely to see in his scumgame as opposed to his towngame; it's a card people pull when they expect to be townread or when they're supposed to be expecting other people to townread them and I'm not sure F-16's scumgame has gotten to the point where he can pull off #2 yet, if that makes any sort of sense.

Okay, can you state this in simpler terms? Are you saying he's scum or town?

Bulbazak, I am not saying you have to read me and not read Pitoli. Rather, I insisted for your read on me based on my actions in the game as opposed to Pitoli's.

Ok.

Unvote

Vote F-16_Fighting_Falcon

[sangres]

I think it's more likely to be Pitoli, rather than F-16. F-16 looks like he's trying to figure things out, while all Pitoli wanted to do was wagon.

This was an extremely easy townread on F-16, which sort of creeps me out.

Neither do I. It's exciting, isn't it? But I'm pretty sure that Pitoli is scum. Vote her with me.

This sort of tunneling creeps me the hell out and looks scummy as fuck, but I've been burned quite a few times lately for getting after Bulbazak for tunneling, but the way he's going about it is a pretty much the opposite that he usually does as town, which creeps me the hell out a bit more.

Do you normally enter the game making wagons just for the sake of making wagons, especially when such a wagon would be an easy one to push that early?

This is a stupid reason for scumreading pitoli; people usually get out of RVS in different ways, so "wagonning for reactions" shouldn't be one that's so horrible where it's worthy of a deathtunnel.

His push on me started out fine but I don't like how he won't even

entertain

the thought of town-me

Scum never do like not being thought of as town.

I don't even know how this works; doesn't being tunneled with people not seeing any chance of being town frustrate the hell out of you as well?

Null/town, mostly due to PoE. I didn't care for his early game, but I really don't think he and Pitoli are scum together.

Why didn't you like his early game? You said you liked it when you were pushing him earlier.

Party pooper. With that, I have solid townreads on TIP and ETL.

Why?

ETL, to be perfectly honest, I think this fight between you and Rose is based on a series of misunderstandings, and because neither of you are really clarifying like you mean to or asking the questions you mean to, this feud keeps spiraling out of control. Now, can you please calm down, take a deep breath, and try to work together? And if you don't think you can do that, then start again from the beginning, try to be as clear as you both can, and don't resort to insults.

I will admit that I liked this quite a bit.

And that means what exactly? Am I town for it? Scum? Why are you so nervous about me playing differently than I normally do?

Why are you playing differently than you normally do?
It makes me nervous because you're pushing a shit case on pitoli, and just when I was starting to get some sort of grasp of your towngame, you change things up on me.

Because Nacho hasn't made an impression on me so far. Therefore, although I've put the hydra to the side to sort later, I'm still wary of them.

Why are you trying to read me over ffery?

[sangres]

Come on, Nacho. You know that this isn't the worst I've ever tunneled a read.

Not at all. What ended up changing your mind?

Okay, can you state this in simpler terms? Are you saying he's scum or town?

Town. Why do you disagree?

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Nacho, who are the scumteam?

[sangres]

Is there a single game as town that she hasn't done so as town? "Terrible" was a bad choice of a word, I am sorry. I meant "scummy," "scum-motivated," or "likely to come from scum."

We sure as hell didn't take control immediately in the Walking Dead until we synced up and got our mojo going. Ffery didn't take control in Chosen Mafia (Syr's one); I did.

I am not sure I follow this. You think it is more likely that it is coming from me as scum and ffery is "freaking out" over it, so you should both be scumreading me. But you say my scumgame hasn't got to that point which implies you are townreading me. So, which is it? What #2 are you referring to?

No, I think it's less likely coming from you as scum.

[sangres]

Bulbazak/CO seems particularly likely at the moment.