Mewbie 1442 the second -- Game over

[Nachomamma8]

Why are you pressuring me for my vote, are you getting nervous?

I do have a series of scenarios each with their own scumreads, the posts I am waiting for should help to narrow it down before it's time to commit my vote.

Why on earth would I be getting nervous in waiting for you to put down your vote? Why do you have to "commit" to a vote, why can't you just put a vote down and switch it where you please?

[CrisP]

Excellent BW, I was waiting for RM too (you bad town lurker), but after the last Nacho and jmo interaction I honestly think the game is over.

First of all let me explain the reason for my vote delay.

After I wrote in post 181:

I like where we are going now because I can clearly see two factions emerging with JM and Nacho (btw Nacho kindly answer the open questions we have for you) on one side and GM and BR on the other.

My biggest worry was the outside chance that both these two "factions" are townies going against each other, and that mafia are the quiet lurkers, i.e. RM BW and/or Angel. If they were mafia, then they would have 0 interest in posting at this time, let the confused town lynch each other and if necessery throw in votes seperately to hide in one of the two bandwagons in order to get someone lynched.

The fact that BW has given some of his reads at this time, all original content which I sometimes strongly disagree with but which you can clearly see has been reasoned out and is not a spur of the moment thing, also the nature of these reads which partially clear both GM and jmo, clears him as town for me, as a mafia he would almost have to say one of these two is scummy, it's too convinient an opportunity to pass. I already had a town read on DC and AA taking the time to read instead of just going with the flow and voting someone is also nice, albeit much softer evidence, like in RM's case.

So now that I'm pretty confident mafia is in one of these two groups, GM and BR vs jmo and Nacho, the question remains which of these two and who of the pair to start lynching.

The answer is, I'm pretty sure jmo is scum, here are my reasons.

1. He sheeps Nacho in post 31 on the GM vote and never explains why he thinks she is scum or why he decided to sheep. So a clear connection with Nacho is established from the get go, also starting with a RVS is fine and dandy, but neither he nor nacho have changed their stance at all from the start of the game, other than to try and trick more people into voting for GM, this strikes me as peculiar to say the least, for instance I changed my reads at least 3 times thanks to new information being factored in, why are they not doing it? Probably because the lynch on GM was decided, as she herself said in post 164 to try and get rid of a potentially dangerous player and no amount of new information could possibly change that unless some other poor townie slipped up in a drammatic way, see for instance Nacho's post where he says I'm on to something about the IamDr thing, that was convincing enough for him to prepare the ground for a future lynch.

2. He has been trying too hard to be seen as town, see 157 and 176

3. The nail in the coffin for me was his reply, post 182, to my conclusion that it was either him and Nacho or GM and BR, look at GM's reaction to the post, she went and answered giving her POV as a town would, she doesn't know if my post was spot on or a misguided town speaking, jmo instead reacted as mafia, he knows his buddy and that in my post I was pretty correct so his natural reaction was to say: well fuck, this guy got it.

Nacho noticed this and after this post tried to rescue his buddy, see post 185 where he defends him more than once in the same post, not something a clueless town would do without very strong evidence, which he did not provide in the slightest. He also prodded me for my vote cause he knows if they can't convince me they are the two town they are in bad shape and have to resort to some other trick like making me look scummy or finding someone else to focus our attention on or PR claiming. Note also how jmo16mla followed up on Nacho's line to try and pressure me, as only true buddies do

In reply to your post 200 Nacho, once I give my reads, given most people think I'm town, I think there will be an automatic bias on what we will talk about and I wanted to be relatively sure before I "commited" to it. I like the why on earth in your post by the way, makes it look genuine if I were only looking at that post.

VOTE: jmo16mla

Now given this is a game of incomplete information, there is always the possibility of me being wrong, I like my lynch here even if that remote circumstance where to occur because jmo16mla is such a controversial figure at the moment, that knowing his alignment would really help us to figure out who the other scums are, so you might say I also have a contingency plan.

In conclusion, if you believe my reasoning I urge you to vote jmo16mla

[Nachomamma8]

So now that I'm pretty confident mafia is in one of these two groups, GM and BR vs jmo and Nacho, the question remains which of these two and who of the pair to start lynching.

My preferred scumteam is RM and Brian, not GM and Brian.

He sheeps Nacho in post 31 on the GM vote and never explains why he thinks she is scum or why he decided to sheep. So a clear connection with Nacho is established from the get go,

Why is scum more likely to sheep their buddy?

but neither he nor nacho have changed their stance at all from the start of the game,

I'm voting RachMarie now, in case you hadn't noticed.

see post 185 where he defends him more than once in the same post, not something a clueless town would do without very strong evidence, which he did not provide in the slightest. He also prodded me for my vote cause he knows if they can't convince me they are the two town they are in bad shape and have to resort to some other trick like making me look scummy or finding someone else to focus our attention on or PR claiming.

I don't mind defending people who don't feel scummy. JMO doesn't feel scummy; tunneling isn't a scumtell and his recent posting hasn't been particularly dooming whereas I have meta on RachMarie and experience with reading her and this current play screams scum.

[CrisP]

1. Yes I noticed Nacho, that was your "town" post which came out conveniently when suspicion was starting to mount up on you. You're a good enough player you could make that switch and the reasons you give for the RM lynch are again unverifiable, that's also one of the reasons I'm tentatively clearing RM without hearing from her. In general your whole playstyle day one has been trying to give as few information as possible to the rest of us while still telling us what you wanted town to do, there can be different reasons for doing this but mafia is definetely one of them.

2. Because scum have a common interest, whereas townies don't know each other, sheeping at the start of the game might be coincidence or someone playing à là GIF, trying to get reactions, but sticking to that target like jmo did without convicing reasons just doesn't add up, you have also been budding up all game which is very wierd.

3. I have noticed, that's why you are not my number 1 lynch and instead my number 2.

4. This goes above and beyond duty, once again I point out you are defending jmo16mla just based on a feeling. If you really were town wouldn't you want to see what he has to say? Maybe it would help your read or you could point out that this or that part of the defense sounded genuine to you, or you might change your mind and think like I do that jmo is scummy, instead you are just giving him a free pass, in my mind because you already know his alignment, based on two day 1 reads which, at least so far as you have communicated, seem pretty weak and totally don't warrant this kind of defense.

There are also points about why I think jmo is scummy that you don't address, so you are also selectively defending him, another thing I would find strange in a townie.

[Nachomamma8]

In general your whole playstyle day one has been trying to give as few information as possible to the rest of us while still telling us what you wanted town to do, there can be different reasons for doing this but mafia is definetely one of them.

Where is this coming from?

2. Because scum have a common interest, whereas townies don't know each other, sheeping at the start of the game might be coincidence or someone playing à là GIF, trying to get reactions, but sticking to that target like jmo did without convicing reasons just doesn't add up, you have also been budding up all game which is very wierd.

I've been buddying up to my townreads all game, which include you, jmo, GiF, Buckwild (who I was intervening for against GiF earlier). Why is jmo special?

If you really were town wouldn't you want to see what he has to say? Maybe it would help your read or you could point out that this or that part of the defense sounded genuine to you, or you might change your mind and think like I do that jmo is scummy, instead you are just giving him a free pass, in my mind because you already know his alignment, based on two day 1 reads which, at least so far as you have communicated, seem pretty weak and totally don't warrant this kind of defense.

Sure. I don't see how my defense of him means that he gets a free pass to not respond to anything, though.

There are also points about why I think jmo is scummy that you don't address, so you are also selectively defending him, another thing I would find strange in a townie.

I've been drinking a bit, so I probably skipped over them. Quote them again for convenience's sake?

[jmo16mla]

It's anti town to not use your vote...

who said anything about not using it, I said I'm going to give it after a few key people post. Why are you misrepresenting?

I'm not you god damn two year old. I was making a statement. YOU ARENT VOTING ANYONE. NOT USING YOUR VOTE IS ANTITOWN. WHERE THE HELL DID I MISREP YOU? I'm so fucking tired of people whining about misrepping. Shut up about it.

[CrisP]

@ jmo Lol? Please try to avoid insults or personal comments. If that was the statement you wanted to make then I say I completely disagree with it, using your vote in the best way possible is town, I clearly explained why I did not want to vote at that time, and honestly why should I listen to you on when to vote? I did vote more than once during the game and then unvoted when I thought it was appropriate, or are you stating that if you want to be town you have to vote someone at all times? really?

@Nacho I'll post what you asked for in a while, collecting the info.

[CrisP]

So here it is Nacho:

On the first point:

Post 16: vote for GIF, no reasons given

Post 130: comment on DC, no reasons given

post 161: very synthetic reply to the question

post 185: again very little in the way of reasoning is given

Compare it to my answers and you will see a big difference in how we answer questions, I try to show what I am thinking as much as possible, so it should be easy for you to get a read on me (that's why most guys here have a town read on me), whereas you provide in my opinion very little information, unless someone directly asks you to clarify and even then sometimes you deflect.

on 2.

If you prefer then, you have been budding to a much higher degree than anyone else has with jmo16mla, I don't see the same pattern with other people you read as town.

on 3.

It doesn't to me or to who believes I'm onto something, but it shows it does to you, the normal reaction when you are not sure is to question, not to jump to someone's defence, and again, where does your confidence come from, you haven't shared it with us other than saying he is earnest in the way he talks.

on 4.

- He has been trying too hard to be seen as town, see 157 and 176.

- His reaction to post 182 is abnormal, compare it to GM's reaction.

- After his reaction to post 182 he went into panic mode, see posts 197 and 205

[goodmorning]

Are you saying he looks to you like the kind of person who would early bus?

The answer I expected was something along the lines of "of course I'm not going to assume that you're bussing me because I'm town, what the hell are you thinking?".

I've had bad experiences with that sort of phrasing in the past. I tend not to call myself Town anymore.

Are you kidding me? That question and the thought processes that it's coming from (that you can even see being worked out in the latter half of the question) come from a very towny place.

I want real reasoning :/
Don't just tell me it's coming from a townie place, I could infer that already. Tell me why it's coming from a townie place.

Why it's coming from a townie place? Maybe because he's Town?
In all seriousness, it's his open processing: why did GIF vote? why did jmo vote? and he explores from the Town POV.
And after exploring, he doesn't just go "well jmo's vote seems weird to me", he uses that weirdness to try to explain his thoughts and maybe even push a smidgen of case.

GM: Starts off attacking me for my post then jumps to crisp, both null moves. He gets an early townread on both GIF and DC. Both of them were voting me at the time, yet GM does not vote me?

I don't sheep for the sake of sheeping.
In fact, I don't sheep at all.
Townreads can be wrong.
The reads of my townreads can also be wrong.

At present, what's on my mind:
Nacho. I can't get a read on him.
On the one hand I didn't really like his earlier posts. On the other hand, 191.

[Brian Skies]

Oh god. There's a lot of content. I'm just dodging a prod right now (or at least I think I am). I'll address things in the morning.

[CrisP]

I'd like to hear from the following people since we are getting close to the end of day 1.

GIF: your V/LA ended yesterday, I'd like your input.

BW: I'd like the rest of your reads and any other comments you have

RM: Please post something, your contribution to this game has been really bad.

Brian: Is it morning where you are at yet?

After giving the guys I think are mafia a day here's what happened:

- jmo16mla's defence is not to defend himself, he was online so he had the time to read the accusations. Probably since he knows it's not a defensible position he is hoping to hide it under the carpet

-Nacho's defence is that the mafia are the two lurker slots, Brian and RM. Now RM if you are mafia and SE in a new game and are using the medical excuse for your lurking, shame on you madam, I don't think so though especially because Brian's post also points to jmo's inconsistencies and Nacho's mafia pair is conveniently a group of people we cannot really analyze, it's a play to remove attention from himself and cast doubt more than an actual read and that's why I find it false.

Also don't let the fact that nobody is hurring to hammer om jmo16mla escape your notice, I think I have built up a compelling case and if I am wrong and say GIF and RM are the mafia they could easily come in and finish him off and blame it on me tomorrow.

[jmo16mla]

im not even sure what im being accused of.. so yeah.

[CrisP]

You are being accused of being mafia because:

- You put pressure on GM and tried to lynch her never changing your target or explaining why you were doing so, the accusation is you are mafia and decided together with your buddy to lynch a possibly dangerous player.

Spoiler: Evidence

Confirm.

That was interesting.

VOTE: goodmorning

People, vote goodmorning.

In serious as hell about my vote on GM though.

youre scum.

It served its point.

VOTE: gm

Its got something to do with me continually calling you scum? because that's just about all i can remember doing in this game. Posts 164 and 165 may also be pertinent

The absence of any kind of accusation during the whole day, other than saying GM is scum, should also be considered as evidence

- You tried too hard to appear town or to spoon feed other people in order for them to call you town, the accusation is you are mafia and were trying to buddy up with townies

Spoiler: Evidence

So you think im town?

A LOT of those post show me creating discussion... typically indicative of town players..

- You have been thinking more like a mafia than like town, the accusation is you are mafia hence your reasoning patterns reflect that

Spoiler: Evidence

Newb scum like to unvote quickly when they realize they're wrong. Typically they don't move their vote to someone

shit, i dont think we should even vote. sounds like a good plan?

Why can't I be scum with you, bussing you?

- You reacted very unnaturally after a post where I called you part of a mafia group, the accusation is you are mafia and have more information than the rest of us, so your reaction which appears strange as a townie is instead perfectly natural as a mafia and you slipped up

Spoiler: Evidence

Chrisp must be a damn mastermind.

- You have been defended all game by Nacho, without him giving us any serious reason why he decided to defend you, a very strange behaviour on his part were he town, the accusation is Nacho is your mafia buddy and was trying to clear you before and is trying to rescue you now

Spoiler: Evidence

If you need evidence for this you really need to spend some time reading this thread, the last 20 posts or so have been a buddy fest between Nacho and jmo

- You reacted very poorly after my accusations and tried to pressure me in order for me to disclose whom I was voting for, the accusation is you realized you were in trouble and went into panic mode as mafia, you also needed that information to try and save yourself.

Spoiler: Evidence

It's anti town to not use your vote...

I'm not you god damn two year old. I was making a statement. YOU ARENT VOTING ANYONE. NOT USING YOUR VOTE IS ANTITOWN. WHERE THE HELL DID I MISREP YOU? I'm so fucking tired of people whining about misrepping. Shut up about it.

[jmo16mla]

I don't react poorly. Never. Once you have played so many games you know exactly how to react if you want to be seen as town, scum, someone who is really into the game. Its really not difficult at all to manipulate how you type to explain how you react to something..

I really with I had the want to defend your accusations.. I'm going to call you town since you're trying so hard to call me scum.

Okay, fine. I'll go through it :/

I wanted to pressure GM because of her intro posts. they seemed rather gay. Almost falsified. Not necessarily a scum play, but the worst that can come out of it is create discussion.. which it did. SO.

I wasnt trying to get people to call me town. I wanted to know what their opinion of me was. All they had to say was yes or no...

Not sure how youre saying that i have been thinking more like mafia then town. 95 was pure bull shit sarcasm.. sorry I guess I'm too good at it. GM didnt state that I could have been her scum partner, so i wanted to make that situation aware.

yes, GM I have bussed rather early in a game before, cant remember the name.. It was the one DoesBoKnow hosted.

61 is true. I mean, ive caught scum like that before. Not sure why thats sucm like thinking.

post 182. Nothing new for me. Also, sarcasm. Again. sorry it's apparent I'm too good at sarcasm and I shouldn't use it anymore.

Meh, not sure why Ive been defended by nacho all game. I kinda like it. I like being called town.. But that doesnt make him any more town. He could be scum calling me town because he knows i am town. OR he could be my scum partner. you know.

I don't pannic. I go bat shit crazy some times. Not trying to save myself by any means. I'm not in any danger of being lynched.

WOO

[CrisP]

Circumstantial evidence that does not depend directly on Jmo16mla

Mafia is not hammering what I consider an easy lynch, so you townies have to assume one of the following if you think jmo16mla is not mafia:

• - Mafia is already voting for jmo16mla
  - This is not an easy lynch / my case against jm016mla is not convicing
  - Mafia is stupid or afk, always a bad assumption to make but never to be discounted

Nacho's reads, which try to absolve jmo16mla, are people which conveniently can't be proven innocent because they have either been lurking or are replacement for lurking slots. if you think jmo16mla is not mafia you have to assume

• - Nacho's reads are geniune but unfortunately they point to lurkeres
  and
  he is also correct that jmo16mla is town

After having investiged her a lot, I think GM is town, so attacking her looks bad to me, you townies have to assume one of the following if you think jmo16mla is not mafia:

• - My read (and some other people's read) on GM is wrong and she is mafia, jmo16mla picked up on this and is part of an unfortunate minority.
  - jmo16mla is wrong about tunnelling on GM but is still town

[jmo16mla]

I only have two votes on me...

Hmph. guess i should re read this game.

[CrisP]

You have 3, my vote hasn't been factored in yet.

[jmo16mla]

Didnt know you voted me.. So uh, who was your other person you were debating on voting?

[jmo16mla]

chrisp, im town. Please, remove your vote and move your focus in another direction. thanks.

[CrisP]

I see 3 main scenarios, it's either you and Nacho, GM and Brian, or some of the lurkers either together or maybe in combination with one of the other suspects two suspects (GM and Brian), that's why Nacho's reads were so convenient as mafia, they create doubt while being impossible to dispute. So if I weren't voting you I would have to go for a RL on a lurker or for GM, but at the moment I'm 70% on you 20% on a RL and 10% on GM so if you are town you should convince the rest you are town or if as you say you have no fear of being lynched then you can also do nothing

[Brian Skies]

Good for you, please post a link to the game in question.

The first time I ever played Mafia was at a house party and I managed to convince the town to lynch most of the quiet players. I was the Day 1 policy lynch in my second game because none of my friends trusted me.

I can't say I come close to understanding why you voted JMO (#61? Why does that make him more likely to be scum?)

It's the difference between what he does and what he says. In 61 he says voting and quickly unvoting when a person realizes a mistake is a scum-tell. But when Buck did it in 27, Jmo doesn't even question it. Instead he votes for GM because...? As a result, his reasoning for voting Crisp looks more like an afterthought than a legitimate concern. Both of Jmo's votes on GM look opportunistic and out-of-place.

Buck's early play regarding whether or not a vote is real feels awkward and like he's trying to look busy. The interactions between Jmo and Buck (or lack of pressure from the former onto the latter) raises a small red flag for me. Buck's most recent post is slightly better in terms of content, but if Jmo flips scum, I think Buck would be a good place to look.

My preferred scumteam is RM and Brian, not GM and Brian.

I hope this has to do with more than inactivity.

Brian: Is it morning where you are at yet?

If you consider that I just woke up like an hour and a half ago, then sure.

Regarding Nacho and Crisp: Crisp feels very town because of the way he's trying to piece together this game. He's pressuring people, generating content, and trying to sniff out the scum-team. The one thing I am worried about is the many associative tells he's throwing around. Lining up lynches is scummy as hell. Nacho is slightly town because I am getting similar vibes from my Newbie game (post-Bert) and Rows and Columns. I also remember notscience saying Nacho is very robotic when he plays scum.

Regarding buddying and defending: Town can defend their townreads. I chainsawed and white-knighted two of my town reads in Rows and Columns before I became the night 1 kill.

[CrisP]

Town can defend their townreads. I chainsawed and white-knighted two of my town reads in Rows and Columns before I became the night 1 kill.

It's not so much the defending part which is bothersome, it's the degree to which he goes, the person he chooses to defend and the reasons he gives for defending him which I find questionable. If you are going to white-knight someone day 1 you better have a strong reason for doing so.

I also dispute that Nacho is robotic as mafia, just check out the newbie game 1438 that just ended.

The one thing I am worried about is the many associative tells he's throwing around

As to lining up lynches, I am giving town information on the possible mafia teams, given the connections I saw, on one side Nacho and Jmo budding up, on the other you and GM voting for the same guy, in your case of the bat in your very first meaningful post, and lastly that if you're both townie groups going against each other then mafia must be inside the lurking pool of people. Mafia might also line up people to lynch to push an agenda, but I think the reasons I give justify my behaviour.

On another note I really think RM should be removed from this game, maybe she hasn't technically gone over the time limit but all she has produced were posts full of fluff to avoid the removal right when it was due, not only that but she behaved the same way in the first game we had to lock, so I am really having a bad experience with her as an SE, I'm really sorry on a personal level if this is due to medical conditions, but I want to win...

[Nachomamma8]

Post 16: vote for GIF, no reasons given

I generally RVS with people that I'm familiar with in order to gauge how comfortable they are in the early game. I think I mentioned this or at least alluded to it somewhere.

Post 130: comment on DC, no reasons given

You're correct, I didn't give a reason. I was commenting on him being less town than last game because he was very town last game very early.

post 161: very synthetic reply to the question

Synthetic? What was I supposed to say?

post 185: again very little in the way of reasoning is given

There wasn't much reasoning in my read on jmo before. Sometimes there are good, logical reasons to call someone town. Sometimes you call someone town because of their associations with scum. Othertimes, someone just seems genuine or feels genuine. I'll give the nice good reasoning when I have it, but that doesn't mean that I'm going to discount my feelings entirely.

You also miss that we have differences in playstyles. My general playstyle addresses a wide variety of things in what is small, easily readable chunks. The majority of my posts are meant to be one on one interactions; usually, when I respond to a quote someone made, I expect that person to read and respond, but it isn't necessary for other people. When I find a smoking gun or something cool, they usually come in the form of small posts or larger case posts; these are the types of things that I expect everyone to read. Your style offers more transparency, which is fine, but I don't mind exchanging transparency for the sake of readability and ease of posting. It also usually takes a while for me to reach my conclusions; a lot of my thought in games are thinking on things, and I don't see the use of posting these rants in thread for the sake of looking town when most people will be able to read me as town of their own accord.

If you prefer then, you have been budding to a much higher degree than anyone else has with jmo16mla, I don't see the same pattern with other people you read as town.

You'll also notice that the townread on jmo has been questioned more than my townreads on anyone else. There hasn't been much direct interaction between jmo and I, but there has been a lot of me defending him because I've been questioned about him a lot. I'm not sure why you call that buddying, and I'm not sure why I'd choose to buddy with jmo as scum.

It doesn't to me or to who believes I'm onto something, but it shows it does to you, the normal reaction when you are not sure is to question, not to jump to someone's defence, and again, where does your confidence come from, you haven't shared it with us other than saying he is earnest in the way he talks.

It comes from his earnestness and the fact that he's been tunneling on the IC who is not at all an easy target. JMO as scum has motive to get a mislynch without looking too scummy; it doesn't make that much sense for him to expend all of his effort trying to get someone mislynched who will, in all likelihood, not get mislynched. This could mean that he's tunneling GM for the very reason that it's an unlikely scum move, but his earnestness makes me lean against that possibility.

- He has been trying too hard to be seen as town, see 157 and 176.

- His reaction to post 182 is abnormal, compare it to GM's reaction.

- After his reaction to post 182 he went into panic mode, see posts 197 and 205

-This is a poor point. "Trying too hard to be town" is a nebulous point and can mean that he's posting too much, it could mean that his posts are too long, it could mean that he's doing too many protown things... all of these things are stylistic points and usually not alignment relevant. I don't understand why 157 and 176 are special, though.
-Why does abnromal mean scum?
-"Panic mode" isn't a legitimate scumtell for me. Especially when "panic mode" is criticizing you for not placing down a vote (site meta has most people voting all the time unless they're lurking like crazy).

In all seriousness, it's his open processing: why did GIF vote? why did jmo vote? and he explores from the Town POV.
And after exploring, he doesn't just go "well jmo's vote seems weird to me", he uses that weirdness to try to explain his thoughts and maybe even push a smidgen of case.

OK.

- Mafia is already voting for jmo16mla
- This is not an easy lynch / my case against jm016mla is not convicing
- Mafia is stupid or afk, always a bad assumption to make but never to be discounted

Usually the scumteam doesn't quickhammer townies the moment they reach L-2 because that's sort of obvious.

if you think jmo16mla is not mafia you have to assume
-

Nacho's reads are geniune but unfortunately they point to lurkeres and

he is also correct that jmo16mla is town

If jmo is town, that does not mean that my scumreads are right. In fact, with Brian's latest post, I'm starting to think that Diamond and Rach make up the scumteam.

I hope this has to do with more than inactivity.

It does!

[Nachomamma8]

On another note I really think RM should be removed from this game, maybe she hasn't technically gone over the time limit but all she has produced were posts full of fluff to avoid the removal right when it was due, not only that but she behaved the same way in the first game we had to lock, so I am really having a bad experience with her as an SE, I'm really sorry on a personal level if this is due to medical conditions, but I want to win...

Rach can be inactive as town, but there are decent differences between her play last game and her play this game. You also can't really count on everyone being active all the time; people do have different playstyles, after all, and sometimes the content you lift from their post isn't as clear cut as the content you lift from your posts.

[CrisP]

It comes from his earnestness and the fact that he's been tunneling on the IC who is not at all an easy target. JMO as scum has motive to get a mislynch without looking too scummy; it doesn't make that much sense for him to expend all of his effort trying to get someone mislynched who will, in all likelihood, not get mislynched. This could mean that he's tunneling GM for the very reason that it's an unlikely scum move, but his earnestness makes me lean against that possibility.

Very well, I like this piece of information you are giving because it is something that might justify your read and you also allueded to it before:

Why do you think he's pushing on you so hard as scum right now?

I'm not sure why I'd choose to buddy with jmo as scum.

you would almost have to, if town lynches a mafia day 1 then you're looking at 6:1 odds.

I don't understand why 157 and 176 are special, though.

Because they look like fishing expeditions to be called town, as opposed to someone trying to show he is.

Why does abnromal mean scum?

It does not, but if you approach it from a mafia POV / mindset, it then makes perfect sense -> occam's razor

site meta has most people voting all the time unless they're lurking like crazy

This thread then is not indicative of site meta, I'm also used to IRL mafia where you do not vote until someone calls a formal so maybe that's a thing, but I still don't like that interaction.

Usually the scumteam doesn't quickhammer townies the moment they reach L-2 because that's sort of obvious.

clearly not, but it's easy to prepare the ground for the lynch if a misguided town already built the case for you, and I see no attempts of doing that.

If jmo is town, that does not mean that my scumreads are right. In fact, with Brian's latest post, I'm starting to think that Diamond and Rach make up the scumteam.

This is true.

I'm feeling a bit better about Nacho, but I'm still on JM's case.

I also really don't like JM's defense, basically what his defence comes down to is that his sarcasm, which he is really good at he might add, has been misinterpreted, all in the same sentence where he just stated that he can easily manipulate how people feel from reading his posts by the way he types. Inconsistent some?

Nacho, if you think I'm town, you are changing your mind on Brian and you also said at a certain point that GM looks town, why are we all voting JM an why isn't mafia helping us along?