[OLD] Open Setup Ideas and Discussion

[BBmolla]

In the linked setup, not my setup.

It's a problem in the current existing setup that I sought to fix in my setup.

[Grimgroove]

Yes, but also in your set-up: what good is it for scum to know who the SK is, if they can't kill him (no NKs), and can't exposr him (because that way he exposes himself)?

[Cabd]

It forces scum to play like a cop that tries to get his guilty lynched without having to claim it?

[BBmolla]

To push his lynch?

If you're scum A wouldn't it help to know who scum B is?

It's there to give mafia a little bit of an upper hand, but to prevent immediate outing of the SK when he's found. Unless mafia are nuts and want to suicide which is totally possible.

Edit: Yeah what Cabd said.

[callforjudgement]

Scum could also out the SK in twilight if they were lynched.

I'm not sure if that's a good thing, though.

[Bicephalous Bob]

big post

This might actually be a somewhat interesting setup.

Big question for balance would be

1) When do spies get "called back" and how does that resolve with the investigate action
2) Can a spy re-goon themselves at night?

1) "Every night, the Goon(s) may call back one or more Spies. This turns them back into Mafia Goons at the start of the next day," so the cops get a negative result on a Spy who is called back that same night.
2) The original answer was: "A spy can't call himself back, but if I were scum in this game, I'd discuss breadcrumbs in pre-game chat," but then I realized the cops can claim when all Goons are dead. A nightless game is probably too harsh a punishment for the Mafia. Is this a good solution?

Gun Control

3 Mafia Goons/Spies
2 Gunsmiths
8 Vanilla Townies

Mechanics:

-Mafia Goons have daytalk.
-The Gunsmith's result is the number of guns the target has. Gunsmiths have three guns. A member of the Mafia has one gun by default.
-In pre-game chat, the Mafia decide which members give their guns to other members. Members with no guns flip as Mafia Spy, have no access to the factional quicktopic (the mod creates a new one for in-game chat) and can't perform the factional kill.
-Every night, Goons with multiple guns may give one or multiple Spies a gun. This turns them back into Mafia Goons at the start of the next day. Goons can't give all of their guns away after pre-game. Goons can give guns to each other.
-The first time all Goons are dead, each remaining Spy gets one shot at stealing a gun from someone. They can use this shot at any time, but the Mafia has no factional kill as long as it isn't armed. If a Gunsmith is targeted, the Spy turns into a Goon at the start of the next day. Nothing happens if the target is a Vanilla Townie. No-one is ever informed of the (attempted) theft.

[BBmolla]

Scum could also out the SK in twilight if they were lynched.

I'm not sure if that's a good thing, though.

Hrm, yeah.

Baby Enough Scum 8P

1 Mafia Doctor
1 Mafia Goon

1 Serial Killer

1 Jailkeeper
4 VTs

• Daystart
  
• The mafia team do not possess a nightkill
  
• FBI Agent only finds the Serial Killer
  
• Serial Killer wins 1-1-1 endgames and 1-1 endgames.

Maybe this?
More WIFOM when nobody dies. Gives Mafia a bit better of an advantage too.

[saulres]

There's... not actually an FBI Agent in that setup.

[Cabd]

That seams like the SK is at a disadvantage now. Three potential ways for his kill to be blocked in a night.

[BBmolla]

There's... not actually an FBI Agent in that setup.

Yeah yeah I forgot to remove it, bite me.

[JasonWazza]

1 Mafia Doctor
1 Mafia Goon

1 Serial Killer

1 Jailkeeper
4 VTs

The problem i see arising is this, Doctor is always going to protect the goon (why protect anyone else?)

Then we get down to the JK, if there is a no kill, the logical thing to do is for the JK to keep hitting the target they have hit (Either they hit the SK, meaning the SK can no longer kill and JK should claim or, the JK has hit the SK's Target in which case he should still keep hitting the same target, unless the JK was missed for the Doc.)

And we come to a point where it is likely that the JK will claim the target and have them lynched (actually this may be the one reason the mafia would benefit from using the Doctor elsewhere)

[BBmolla]

1 Mafia Doctor
1 Mafia Goon

1 Serial Killer

1 Jailkeeper
4 VTs

The problem i see arising is this, Doctor is always going to protect the goon (why protect anyone else?)

Then we get down to the JK, if there is a no kill, the logical thing to do is for the JK to keep hitting the target they have hit (Either they hit the SK, meaning the SK can no longer kill and JK should claim or, the JK has hit the SK's Target in which case he should still keep hitting the same target, unless the JK was missed for the Doc.)

And we come to a point where it is likely that the JK will claim the target and have them lynched (actually this may be the one reason the mafia would benefit from using the Doctor elsewhere)

The charm is that a no kill doesn't mean exactly what you think it means, it has various options. Except when the Mafia Doctor dies, then it narrows it down a bit.

[BBmolla]

Payback Nightless

6 Vanilla Townies

3 Mafia Vengefuls

• Nightless
  
• Mafia win if it is a 1:1 ratio

Does this exist already?

[callforjudgement]

It's pretty similar (identical?) to No Lynching Town. If it's different, the only difference is in the numbers.

[Toomai]

I probably have no idea what I'm doing, but this idea popped into my head, and I thought why not let other people tear it apart. No idea if anything similar has been tried before or not.

Leaky Windows

v1.0

Vanilla Townie x7

Mason x2

Town Eavesdropper x1

Mafia Goon x2

Traitor Eavesdropper x1

• Standard lynch rules and Mafia nightkill.
• Mafia cannot kill or recruit Traitor and does not know who they are. The Traitor knows who the Mafia are, cannot use scumchat, counts for endgaming, and inherits factional kill if both Goons die first.
• Eavesdroppers, at the end of each Night, are given a link to a censored version of a group's night chat.
  • Players' names are replaced with things such as "[player K]".
  • Post numbers are replaced with things like "[post BFWQ]".
• The Town Eavesdropper listens to the Mafia talk; the Traitor listens to the Masons.
• The Masons have a factional roleblock. Blocking an eavesdropper means they get nothing that night.
• Both the Masons and the Mafia have a 1-shot ability to accuse a player of eavesdropping during the day. This ability is sent to the mod in private so the user is unknown, but the target and result are announced publicly (e.g. "Player G has been accused of eavesdropping.").
  • If an eavesdropper has been identified, they die of shame. The Mafia can kill their Traitor this way.
  • If the wrong player has been accused, nothing happens to them or the accuser. The eavesdropper on the opposite faction of the accuser is emboldened and gets a 1-shot Cop (if town) or a 1-shot Rolecop (if scum); using this one night means they can't eavesdrop that night.
  • If both Goons die first, the Traitor inherits the accusation if still unused.

Looks like a bit of a headache for the mod at times, but could still be interesting to play?

[BBmolla]

Not really. Mafia and Town QT owners will just compensate by not talking. Plus, good luck getting the players to log in to these alternate QT accounts whenever they post for this game.

My 2 cents.

[LlamaFluff]

Problem with eavesdropper role is that you should be able to piece together who the scum is by wording and time of posts. Scum in this setup should just not talk until the eavesdropper is dead as they would have the advantage in the setup with roles stripped out.

[Cabd]

More easily worked scenario is to RNG and give the eavesdropper one post made in the qt that night randomly (with names stripped) to allow for masons and mafia to counter-measure each other with fakeouts.

[callforjudgement]

Or just spam 100 contentless posts between every real one (and annoy the QuickTopic admins while they're at it).

[BBmolla]

Hotline Mafia

6 Players:

1 Mafia Goon

1 Suicidal Mafia Goon

4 Vanilla Townies

• Suicidal goon dies night 1.
  
• If he is lynched day 1, no night occurs.

Not nightless.

Similar to scumhunters 8p, but different because you don't choose who dies, it's preselected.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

So, 6 players. If the goon is lynched, then a townie is nk'd and there are 4 players. Since it is not nightless, they will probably no lynch, and then it'll be LYLO. If the other scum is lynched, game over. If a townie is lynched, then the goon and another townie die, so it will be LYLO right away. It is basically like a vengeful but with 6 players and a few differences. I don't get the point of almost requiring a no lynch though because that's what will happen regardless if the goon is lynched day1.

[BBmolla]

If he is lynched day 1, no night occurs.

^

The "he" is the mafia suicidal goon

Lynching him day one gets town an extra mislynch.

[Whiskers]

If he is lynched day 1, no night occurs.

^

The "he" is the mafia suicidal goon

Lynching him day one gets town an extra mislynch.

Gonna go ahead and say, that sucks for whoever draws this role. In fact... why include it at all? Day 1 is least likely to result in an informed lynch, and the player dies anyway. Optimal play for this role is to just not talk-- ever. No association, no tells, no reads.

A better, more fun setup would be

Revengy Something

10 Players:

3 Mafia Goons

7 Vanilla Townies

Mafia faction only gets a Kill if a Goon was lynched the previous Day.
Not-Nightless, or Nightless and Enforced Lynching.
Mafia Daytalk.

Of course, Hotline Mafia might be OK, since it's such a small setup that why would anybody even play a six player game...

[EDIT]
And looking at Scumhunter's_Speed_8p, I've basically made that, except without the stupid white flag mechanic which I hate, and making the game a little longer. So... an improvement, IMO, but not enough of one to make a whole new setup for it. So nevermind.

Still, I wouldn't want to play Hotline Mafia. Being kicked out of the game for setup factors (instead of being chosen for lynch or nightkill, due to my play or meta) would really suck. It would take all of the fun out of it for me. Like, "Nothing you do can affect whether or not you die."

Idk. Maybe some people would like this, but I just plain wouldn't sign up for it.

[Whiskers]

Scalpel 13

3 Macho Mafia Goons

1 Doc SK

9 Vanilla Townies

Macho Mafia Goons:

Factional Night Talk
Factional Nightkill
Immune to Doctoring
Win when they are Majority.

Doctor Serial Killer:

Night-Doctoring
Nightkill
Can't Doc the same player consecutive Nights
Wins when the last man standing.

How does this look?

[BBmolla]

Gonna go ahead and say, that sucks for whoever draws this role. In fact... why include it at all? Day 1 is least likely to result in an informed lynch, and the player dies anyway. Optimal play for this role is to just not talk-- ever. No association, no tells, no reads.

If you do that, you get lynched and you fuck over your buddy because town has two chances instead of one to catch him. Why is that optimal?

Your setup removes the entire point of mine, the mafia have to try to set themselves up for a successful LYLO. So they both want to survive, and they don't want to look bad once the suicidal one dies.

There is also a lack of 6P setups, hence mine. Making it 10p goes against my original goal.