A uPick of Ice & Fire - Day 12 - #REKT?

[Titus]

I won't know that until the end of my read unless something specifically comes up. The comments about GR's vote pattern did stand out to me because GR said he never did anything inconsistent.

[Garruk Relentless]

That's my point. It's hardly even a theory, it's just a guess based off of incomplete information. And when you consider that they chose now, as the 7th vote on the Titus wagon, to whip out their supr sekrit gamebreaking theory stinks too.

- Des

I was actually planning on voting elle beforehand, but I'm willing to test my theory.

Speaking of elle.

Nah, I have a terribad memory. I looked back earlier to find my previous roll when making post 4103 to double check that it was at Thor and I noticed it.

My kanye read is out there. My Titus read is mostly just a continuation on my Zdenek read from the previous day, where my vote stayed. Not really sure that the overnight/explanation changes that, hence my vote there. Part of me agrees that it'd be weird of scum to choose to no kill last night just to try and earn Titus some obvious town-cred so that maybe she could clear some of them, too - but then idk, why not if they weren't expecting a vig kill - especially when their kills are getting blocked by something.

PrideandJoy is mostly gut and their weird pushes on me feel like scum baiting to see who bites - in combination with a lot of others points on PnJ that I've read recently, like Cephrir's 4089 that I kind of just nod along/agree with.

There were better reasons at some point - but they got washed up in my week+ of awayness - and again, terribad memory. I keep telling myself I'll go back and re-read but yeah, never do.

So, who are your scumreads and why?

This post is really weird.

[Cephrir]

- I think D3 established that SpyreX cannot be scumbuddies with Titus (Zed)
- AGar's reasoning on Titus seems to stem from a town mindset - I cant see scum going 1:1 so soon after Quadz tried it on D4
- Garruk's push on kanye and the three ability theory look like a paranoid townie mindset - not that difficult to fake though but leaning town

Which leaves TheAlch, elle and PnJ and all three of them have votes on town. I'd really like to vote TheAlchemist the most because
- there have been times, the other two, when I've felt town vibes from their post.
- PnJ's pushes and play seem more random than scum motivated; Also the quadz interaction - if it was bussing, was an awkward bus

Vote: TheAlchemist

Isn't the whole point to be looking for in a bus, "awkward bussing"? If it was a perfect bus it would be like what Naut did.

If you ask me it is!

VOTE: Titus.

I kinda feel like, given how much softclaiming is going on this game,

if someone really thought they had a reason for the N3 kill to not show up they might have said so by now

. Based just on inthread posting I think P&J and Garruk are still scummier, but this is fine.

I don't get how you can come to this conclusion at this time of posting. Agar had already posted about this before Day4 ended and when he came in today.

I meant if someone other than AGar had a contradicting explanation... hence why I voted Titus...

http://www.scribd.com/doc/184733391/SCA ... 4rqxfr78jl

Those are my notes so far. I'll try to finish the rest over the weekend. If you have any questions, feel free to ask as my handwriting is a bit hard to read at points (not due to quality of scan but due to my own writing. Generally {text} are my thoughts.

literally no one is going to read that shit summarize anything you feel is important mb

I'm probably going to read it

[elleheathen]

Speaking of elle.

Nah, I have a terribad memory. I looked back earlier to find my previous roll when making post 4103 to double check that it was at Thor and I noticed it.

My kanye read is out there. My Titus read is mostly just a continuation on my Zdenek read from the previous day, where my vote stayed. Not really sure that the overnight/explanation changes that, hence my vote there. Part of me agrees that it'd be weird of scum to choose to no kill last night just to try and earn Titus some obvious town-cred so that maybe she could clear some of them, too - but then idk, why not if they weren't expecting a vig kill - especially when their kills are getting blocked by something.

PrideandJoy is mostly gut and their weird pushes on me feel like scum baiting to see who bites - in combination with a lot of others points on PnJ that I've read recently, like Cephrir's 4089 that I kind of just nod along/agree with.

There were better reasons at some point - but they got washed up in my week+ of awayness - and again, terribad memory. I keep telling myself I'll go back and re-read but yeah, never do.

So, who are your scumreads and why?

This post is really weird.

lol. I get that a lot.
What's weird about it?

[The Alchemist]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: PrideAndJoy

[elleheathen]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/184733391/SCA ... 4rqxfr78jl

Those are my notes so far. I'll try to finish the rest over the weekend. If you have any questions, feel free to ask as my handwriting is a bit hard to read at points (not due to quality of scan but due to my own writing. Generally {text} are my thoughts.

lolol

All the "like wtf"s in those notes. But something about them made me feel better. I think. Maybe. Could be just the follow through on the promise (because I only scanned over it quick) but I'll bite.

VOTE: PrideandJoy

[Tammy]

Going back over some posts...

You mean besides me bleeding fucking town since page one? No, I don't have an idea.

Katsuki was a bad VIG kill. I wish I was around to try to talk some sense into that,

not that it would have mattered I'm like invisible thins game.

Just checking in. Get back to this tomorrow or next day, busy.

These two things are not unrelated. But it does seem to be the mindset of the day (apathy). Which is interesting considering the last two flips.

What?

No, really, what?

None of that points to apathy and I'll have to ask you why you're selectively reading shit.

The first one refers to Shadoweh abandoning me on Spyrex and not listening to me that I thought he was scum (and noone else but empire actually paying attention to my read on him), as well as a few other things I've said that have just been dismissed. It has nothing to do with apathy.

The second bolded also has nothing to do with apathy, it has to do with busy. I did not have free time to play mafia because I was busy working quite a few more than normal hours.

[Tammy]

can someone please explain why batshit theory = town?

because fuck that

- Des

Cephrir already said about how a convoluted theory sounds town, but they've already made clear they're not getting lynched today. Therefore, they're a bad person to push today anyway.

[Tammy]

Titus and Alchemist are definitely not partners. If one is scum, the other is definitely not.

[Tammy]

I guess third party could still apply, but they are absolutely not on the same team.

[Alfred Borden]

I do think that Nacho is a good addition. He definitely would bus two partners back to back if he wanted to and thought it would be fun to do, so that isn't a good reason to think he's town, but he feels town.

yeah but woudl he bus two partners after a lack of two night kills?

idk do you think im approaching this the werong way? i feel like scum would avoid bussing given their dire situation (though i stilol need to drive the conclusions from this).

(sober posting when I am aawake).

[Tammy]

Nacho might if he felt like it and thought it would be fun.

But, I don't think he did here.

[Tierce]

Nacho probably would've done so. Even being generally protective of seemingly weaker partners (see DeasVail), I think in a game this size Nacho probably wouldn't have an issue bussing quadz.

Titus: quick one-line reads on playerlist, please.

[ooba]

@SafetyDance
Regarding the Quadz-PnJ: It was just too odd an interaction. If either of them flip, that interaction screams "Bus" to the rest of the world. They are competent players - they wouldn't make it so obvious is my reasoning.

Regarding Garruk: I've been there with these crazy theories. I agree it's bad but I just don't see it coming from scum.

Regarding Shadow: By "Shadoweh softclaiming having a shadow" - do you mean the man she soft claimed she need to complete her kill? I view that as neutral. Not sure what you're referring to when you connect it to the last two scum flips?

---

UNVOTE:
VOTE: PrideAndJoy

http://www.scribd.com/doc/184733391/SCA ... 4rqxfr78jl

Those are my notes so far. I'll try to finish the rest over the weekend. If you have any questions, feel free to ask as my handwriting is a bit hard to read at points (not due to quality of scan but due to my own writing. Generally {text} are my thoughts.

lolol

All the "like wtf"s in those notes. But something about them made me feel better. I think. Maybe. Could be just the follow through on the promise (because I only scanned over it quick) but I'll bite.

VOTE: PrideandJoy

These two votes make me feel much better about avoiding the PnJ wagon.

[Tammy]

@SafetyDance
Regarding the Quadz-PnJ: It was just too odd an interaction. If either of them flip, that interaction screams "Bus" to the rest of the world. They are competent players - they wouldn't make it so obvious is my reasoning.

Have you ever seen chess kid scum? Awkward interactions with his scum partners? Kinda his forte.

[Tammy]

I do think that Nacho is a good addition. He definitely would bus two partners back to back if he wanted to and thought it would be fun to do, so that isn't a good reason to think he's town, but he feels town.

yeah but woudl he bus two partners after a lack of two night kills?

idk do you think im approaching this the werong way? i feel like scum would avoid bussing given their dire situation (though i stilol need to drive the conclusions from this).

(sober posting when I am aawake).

Oh but nacho-as-scum would only still be energetic if he thought he had a chance to win. If he thought his stock was sinking, he'd start being less motivated.

[PrideandJoy]

@SafetyDance
Regarding the Quadz-PnJ: It was just too odd an interaction. If either of them flip, that interaction screams "Bus" to the rest of the world. They are competent players - they wouldn't make it so obvious is my reasoning.

Have you ever seen chess kid scum? Awkward interactions with his scum partners? Kinda his forte.

Have

you

seen chess kid post? Because I haven't

[ActionDan]

Yes, because:

I'm Ygritte. Aligned with the realm.

Most important of my abilities: I'm a fixed and permanent roleblocker.

You know nothing.

Guess who I targetted?

Tierce.

Which was part of my disengaging - because it was in the last day that I saw Tierce as town.

You need to kill me.

@Elle

if your target dies, can you RB again?

Yes.

^^^ I want to know that as well.

I have never seen a permanent rber. It makes much more sense to include a vanillaizer than a permanent rber unless we are looking at a spree killer. Also why use it until you are convinced someone is not town aligned? Please don't take this as being hostile, I do believe the claim (can't see elle willing to be suicidal over it). Elle just makes sense as town. Were you compulsive n1 elle?

My role is all flavor - so it doesn't specifically say 'fixed and permanent roleblocker' but that was just what I associated it with based on what it does/what I know of roles. Wasn't familiar with a vanillaizer at the time, though I've wiki'ed it now. Vanillaizer makes sense since it didn't take effect until the following night. So idk?

I was about as convinced as Tierce scum on D1 as I could get - it didn't really change until mid D3. Yeah, I debated waiting until I was positive - but I also figured that if there was a reason that

I

was that positive on someone as scum, other people would be too and they'd just be lynched.

It was a risk - I took it.

How many abilities do you have total?

3

VOTE: Elle

We already have a town JOAT in safety dance.

other thoughts:

Overly dramatic willingness to die despite having two other abilities (notwithstanding them being 'useless').
And that question that Benmage asked: That might be an answer that faraday would give to a 'permanent fixed roleblocker' but hardly one he'd give to someone with 3 abilities and a shot of vanillizer. Think about it. Pretty sure it got lost in transition from one roleclaim to the next. That's not even considering that a description of the ability of a standard vanillize wouldn't lead someone to advertise themselves as a permanent fixed RBer even if they didn't know what a 'vanillizer' is. They'd detail the ability.

[PrideandJoy]

Yes, because:

I'm Ygritte. Aligned with the realm.

Most important of my abilities: I'm a fixed and permanent roleblocker.

You know nothing.

Guess who I targetted?

Tierce.

Which was part of my disengaging - because it was in the last day that I saw Tierce as town.

You need to kill me.

@Elle

if your target dies, can you RB again?

Yes.

^^^ I want to know that as well.

I have never seen a permanent rber. It makes much more sense to include a vanillaizer than a permanent rber unless we are looking at a spree killer. Also why use it until you are convinced someone is not town aligned? Please don't take this as being hostile, I do believe the claim (can't see elle willing to be suicidal over it). Elle just makes sense as town. Were you compulsive n1 elle?

My role is all flavor - so it doesn't specifically say 'fixed and permanent roleblocker' but that was just what I associated it with based on what it does/what I know of roles. Wasn't familiar with a vanillaizer at the time, though I've wiki'ed it now. Vanillaizer makes sense since it didn't take effect until the following night. So idk?

I was about as convinced as Tierce scum on D1 as I could get - it didn't really change until mid D3. Yeah, I debated waiting until I was positive - but I also figured that if there was a reason that

I

was that positive on someone as scum, other people would be too and they'd just be lynched.

It was a risk - I took it.

How many abilities do you have total?

3

VOTE: Elle

We already have a town JOAT in safety dance.

other thoughts:

Overly dramatic willingness to die despite having two other abilities (notwithstanding them being 'useless').
And that question that Benmage asked: That might be an answer that faraday would give to a 'permanent fixed roleblocker' but hardly one he'd give to someone with 3 abilities and a shot of vanillizer. Think about it. Pretty sure it got lost in transition from one roleclaim to the next. That's not even considering that a description of the ability of a standard vanillize wouldn't lead someone to advertise themselves as a permanent fixed RBer even if they didn't know what a 'vanillizer' is. They'd detail the ability.

^me

[Cephrir]

Yawn. All you can come up with are role related reasons, and they just happen to coalesce on the only other viable wagon. Meanwhile you don't have any actual scumspects? Yawn.

[Benmage]

Which leaves TheAlch, elle and PnJ

Vote PnJ, stop wasting time.

@ALl.... *yawn* lets do it it. PnJ will be todays lynch, stop twiddling.

[elleheathen]

VOTE: Elle

We already have a town JOAT in safety dance.

Having three abilities does not = JOAT claim. It = having 3 abilities, 2 of which are passive.

Overly dramatic willingness to die despite having two other abilities (notwithstanding them being 'useless').

Yes, when I was under the impression that Tierce wasn't a one-shot but a 3x shared BP that could protect herself and one other overnight. I took her gambit for fact.

And yes, useless. Because:

1) Vanillaizer - not only useless but detrimental to town given the above fact of who I used it on and what I thought their ability was.

2) Ability that lets me break rules because:

Kneeler laws don't apply to me.

This is the ability that allows me to use dice.

3) Ability that made me need 2 extra votes to be lynched up until Day 4 - because D3=Book 3, to say the least.

Not exactly a JOAT, is it?

That's not even considering that a description of the ability of a standard vanillize wouldn't lead someone to advertise themselves as a permanent fixed RBer even if they didn't know what a 'vanillizer' is. They'd detail the ability.

Actually, it would - because it

did.

And that was the best way I could describe it given my knowledge (or lackthereof) of roles and what the ability did without copying my role PM.

[Nautilius]

Why's it silly Tierce.

Because I have a different number than 3 abilities.

What brought you around?

Lack of other options.

Part of me agrees that it'd be weird of scum to choose to no kill last night just to try and earn Titus some obvious town-cred so that maybe she could clear some of them, too

I could see Titus telling the truth about her roleclaim without her partners' approval so that she might get confirmed as town. I can see her partners no killing and letting her use her ability because skipping a kill is worth her not instantly dying the next day after two partners down.

Naut has verified my ability went off as described. If you're pushing me as scum, Naut should also be required to be scum.

Ability =/= alignment.

[Nautilius]

the amount scum have to willingly give up for titus to be scum

talk to me about this

[PrideandJoy]

Yawn. All you can come up with are role related reasons, and they just happen to coalesce on the only other viable wagon. Meanwhile you don't have any actual scumspects? Yawn.

I have in the past voiced my suspicions of Elle regarding her handling of the Thor wagon. I am now voting based on stronger evidence.

@Cephir: You are scum voting us because you think you'll avoid egg-on-face when we flip town. re: Benmage's "Pnj is the lynch for today" to see someone with that attitude trying to coax people into a sheep mentality.

@Elle. jesus. you literally can't communicate worth a damn.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Cephir

Hard to say which one of you and Benmage I want to pulverize more. Eventually someone else will but their foot down and realize that the two of you are on cruise control