Mini 1525: Tales of The Abyss Mafia GAME OVER!

[TheFuzzylogic99]

@ Hana
That was interesting. The first thing i noticed is that in the STD game he tended to asks question along side of making his cases. He also tended to interact and tried to bounce cases off other players, He also seemed less aggressive and less defensive in his action and tone than here. In this game he seems to be all about building cases . Not sure if STD is his normal town game but there is def a difference between the two games.

[Kazekirimaru]

@ kaze
how sure are you about your scum read on Myko

Very. Not that it matters atm since nobody will listen. Except I guess you.

meow meow meow

im a cat

[Tammy]

I'm about to get prodded. I'll post here later after I get some papers graded.

[Nachomamma8]

Thinking about it he hasn't talked with me about anything game related, hasn't let me in on any reads or anything and now i'm here while he's on V/LA (and im supposed to be V/LA too but taking the chance that my boss is around).

Non rufflig thoughts:
orc/kaze are town because i doubt scum would've made a confirmable fakeclaim like that, specially the "mod confirming kaze as town if orc is lynched"
Mara's AtE looked town, so im not buying Kaze's meta case on myko
Mac gut town
fuzzylogic is in the "dunno" realm, my read on him has been jumping up and down all day, the scum slips thingy seems decent but i trust my gut read on Rufflig more in this case.
You were town, but i dont like your reasoning on your push on me when you have knowledge of how i act in hydra (which is usually rely a lot on my other head and bounce reads off them, the issue here is that GiF doesnt talk at all so I have to guess :<)
SSK is... idk how to read him at all.
ffery/bork seem way to aggresive for what I remember of ffery or bork (tho the one game i played with bork was a long time ago)
prohawk is another gut scum read.

PEd: JEEZ IM TYPING

What scum slips thingy?
What's wrong with my push on you? The thing that differs in your individual to hydra play is your inactivity, which is not something I'm attacking you for.

I must admit you're looking town again though =\

if you think this why are you still voting them?

this game is stallin and we need a lynch. myko, SSK or pitoli for me. can we agree on someone?

I could agree with SSK at this point or maybe a Rufflig, but neither lynch gets my blood pumping. I want to get my blood pumping.

[Nachomamma8]

That's quite odd...

Nacho where are you, is fuzzy scum and Rufflig town? I'm kind of seeing tangents to his play on Stacking the Deck of power, where he seemed concerned about the newbies.

I don't think fuzzy is scum but Rufflig town terrifies me.

[Deacon Blues]

Because too many town?

[The Rufflig]

@Prohawk: Are you still scum reading Nachomamma8? If so, would you mind explaining why you feel Nacho is scum?

@MafiaSSK: A couple things struck me as off that I'm hoping you could expound on. Minami went from scum to less likely scum before her most recent reads post. I don't see why your read on her lessened while she was not doing anything? The second is that your scum read on me increased in that same period. Why didn't you apply pressure to me or switch your vote?

[Nachomamma8]

Because too many town?

Yes.

[mykonian]

which one is where you went wrong then?

[Tammy]

also, you obviously don't come from EM. aaaaaah

there's only one role in the whole game that simultaniously cares/thinks about investigations and wants to be investigated. It's scum.

This is not true.

[MafiaSSK]

@Prohawk: Are you still scum reading Nachomamma8? If so, would you mind explaining why you feel Nacho is scum?

@MafiaSSK: A couple things struck me as off that I'm hoping you could expound on. Minami went from scum to less likely scum before her most recent reads post. I don't see why your read on her lessened while she was not doing anything? The second is that your scum read on me increased in that same period. Why didn't you apply pressure to me or switch your vote?

My gut shifted a little on both accounts?
But if you want pressure shifted on to you. Here you go

Vote rufflig

[Tammy]

Nacho - my heart foes not skip with joy when you post, mostly it goes thud, thud, thud.

[Tammy]

*does not

[Tammy]

I have to go back to grading papers, but:

I still don't like rufflig, nacho doesn't feel town, pitoli is talking from the sidelines and I'm starting to see macs point, fuzzy doesn't make sense, myko just might be bad but he doesn't feel town either, and I'm left lukewarm by minaho.

[TheFuzzylogic99]

Town

Kaze
Orcinus
Mac
Nacho
Deacon

leaning town

Tammy'

Null

No Hana
Pro- Hawk

Leaning Scum

Pit-
MafiaSSK
Myko
Ruffling

I am certain that atleast 1 scum is on my scumlist......and all of them are on either on my null list or on my scum list.

[MafiaSSK]

Well, you do have half of the playerlist as either null or leaning scum. It's statistically probable that there's at least one scum there.

[The Rufflig]

@Prohawk: Are you still scum reading Nachomamma8? If so, would you mind explaining why you feel Nacho is scum?

@MafiaSSK: A couple things struck me as off that I'm hoping you could expound on. Minami went from scum to less likely scum before her most recent reads post. I don't see why your read on her lessened while she was not doing anything? The second is that your scum read on me increased in that same period. Why didn't you apply pressure to me or switch your vote?

My gut shifted a little on both accounts?
But if you want pressure shifted on to you. Here you go

Vote rufflig

So, your read changed on Minami because of "gut". I didn't ask why your read on me changed, but that too was "gut". Your reason for sitting on the sidelines and not pursuing your scum reads was "Dodge!". Thanks for clearing that all up for me.

If I'm not mistaken, your scum reads on Fuzzy and Orci were for low reasoning and going after easy targets. I'm certainly glad that the reasons for your reads are much better. Ok, fine - Orci isn't so easy currently. Picky, picky.

[TheFuzzylogic99]

@ Mafia
I did not say that one scum was there but ALL the scum are there. I am certain of my town reads.

Mafia-
Is a lurker which is not necessarily scummy. When she is active she tends to pick players that seem like easy target ie low hanging fruit. She jumped on the Mac wagon , than my wagon and than the Ruffling wagon. Seems like she is fishing for an easy lynch. She also seems to pick out points that she can easily twist to make the statements to look scummy.

Ruff-
His STD game and this game are starkly different. His defensiveness is a bit off putting. I would say he is one of my lower scum read

Pit- Totally agree with Macs points on him and I am tending to lean toward Mac's scum read of him

Myko- Where to start . He jumps in yelling scum without realy reading the game. His playing style this game seems very close to his scum game. When asked about this he gave a very dismissive answer. His rationale for going after me are bad.... very bad. sesms like he trying to force a scum read when there are zero there.


I am sure that either Mafia or Myko is scum ( if not both)

[TheFuzzylogic99]

VOTE: Mafia/vote]

Can i add your vote on Ruff seems so opportunistic!!!! When pressure starts to build on Ruff you happily jump on his wagon without much reason.

[TheFuzzylogic99]

VOTE: MafiaSSK

[ProHawk]

Not fair to expect 100% accuracy.

I would agree with you except, he presents it as such, which contributed heavily to us both losing that particular game. I am not sure how much his stance has changed at this point.

Rufflig, basically boiling down to him undermining my credibility/poisoning the well. I felt like some aspects of his push on me were fake. His talking about scum-day-chat was interesting, but not completely sure if it was a slip or not.

Rufflig, prohawk, fuzzylogic (oh wait that's you). In order of preference.

How exactly do you come up with these reads? Could you explain to me where or why you feel like I am bussing my "partner"?

[mykonian]

you take it as such as well. idk. There was a time where if you didn't put your reads strongly, you'd be seen as scum. It's a habit for me as well, I think.

And I don't know what it is lately, but I don't get people's reads. There are more people than there can be scum that have reads completely opposite to me in big lines. I do not understand why or how, it's not how it used to be and it's a bit frustrating.

[Kazekirimaru]

Three days to deadline.

This game is hardcore stagnating.

[Deacon Blues]

I'm starting 10 pages back because I feel like it was about that far back that I lost the big picture. Bear with me please.

pitoli

i voted you with no conviction
you voted me because i had no conviction
i say i have no conviction
you say why vote with no conviction
i say because i want a momentum change

i guess what i'm saying is that we're going literally nowhere

Do you still feel we're going nowhere?

strong townread on nacho.

the interactions weren't good. she didn't come off great to me from voting for nacho instead of asking. i felt like she was trying to look like doing something but it didn't really work. "omgus can get you places" was terrible reasoning, too.

would say townssk this game.

I could lynch pitoli today.

I'd really rather not lynch Rufflig today.

I'm having trouble reading SSK, myself.

I'm not reading Nacho as town atm.

(My thoughts as of the last couple pages.)

Talk about your Rufflig read?

@ Myko
As somebody once said in a movie...." if we were in different circumstances we might of been friends. "Maybe one day we can play on a town team together . It just happened that you landed a scum slot

is this really goddamn forced or is it just me

It does seem forced, yes.

@Myko Can you give some examples of him playing the newb card?

@Fuzzy, is English your first language?

Is played. Not him playing it. There have been a couple of instances of people saying he was a badly writing town. And that's a bad sentence but I don't know how to say it neater right now. Maybe tomorrow when I've slept.

He's not a newb. That's why I was wondering. His writing style comes of unnatural to me, but I saw that in town games as well as the scum game. I'm going to reread his scum game tonight to see if I think its becoming more of a match with this game.

I just did a cursory metadive on Myko to see if I'm on the right track about this push. Checked out Micro 233, TM2102, and Newbie 1310 among others.

Myko posts quite often as town, usually being the most active/2nd. most active in the game, even in games where he replaces in halfway/has large gaps of inactivity. This is partially due to his tendency to post multiple times in a row as town. ScumMyko is significantly less active, preferring to quote-stripe rather than reply in multiple posts. TownMyko generally has a cheery disposition, often speaking pleasantries to people he's familiar with, happily fluffing on occasion. ScumMyko is much more serious and terse, getting down to business as soon as he hits the thread. TownMyko also appears to frequently use Smilies whereas ScumMyko almost never uses them. TownMyko also appears to reach out a bit for support on wagons/opinions on other players a bit more than ScumMyko does - ScumMyko rather takes a more "My reads are better than yours so follow me you derp" attitude. That's not to say he doesn't do this as both alignments, just far more as Scum than Town.

I'm by no means fantastic at Meta-reading, nor am I willing to base an entire read around Meta, but considering that Myko appears to be playing to his scum meta(along with the fact that Mara was scumming up the slot beforehand) I'm feeling incredibly confident about this push now.

So, yeah. Lynch him.

I'm finally getting to this meta, too. But your comments about his pleasantries could be player list dependent. My style of play in the Space game was more serious and reserved than I typically play, for instance, because I had never played a game with most of the player list.

Sadly my first language is English. Sometimes my brain goes faster than my hands so I don't always type the exact way I am thinking....My better posts is when i slow down and makes sure I am saying exactly what I am thinking.
I can see how some might mistake this for being a little scummy.

@ Orcinus

- I did not like how he came in and started to yell scum without reading everything. I also stated that what i saw from his town meta that this is not a town Myko as far as I could tell

- His reason for wanting me lynched were weak and a stretch.I would also say forced. For example he said I was scum bc I said sorry in one post. I have seen other players say sorry in their posts and no one yelled scum. It is clear by the context that I was trying to be polite. Even if it was not if you check my explanation with the post it pretty clear that the reason I give matches up with the stated post. The second reason given is that I asked questions instead of just blasting out accusation. He is basically basing me being scum based on a play style. I have been pretty consistent with the way I have played. I asked question and based on the answers I decided whether or not I should peruse a case against someone. I have tried to make cases against people I thought were scummy. He said my post are scummy but does not says how. What about my post that makes them scummy.
I admit I am awkward but this is normal for me. I even admitted this before. Maybe it is just me but it seems that he knows I am awkward and hopes to get an easy lynch by taking my words out of context or trying to portray my awkwardness as scummy

- My problem with Mara was that she was not only defensive and stand-offish but was excessively so.

Have you played with her before, that you can judge this was excessive?

- She admit lurking which is not scummy per-say but tried to frame her lurking as being okay but No Hana as scummy

Can you link to what you are talking about here?

- Her vote on Ornicus really seems like a OMGUS or perhaps a way to take attention away from herself.( I am talking pre meltdown)

I only see the one vote, and it looks like the "meltdown" followed shortly thereafter.

-I do not know what to make of her meltdown since I seen both scum and tell meltdown before. I am guessing it was a scum meltdown since I believe with my heart

What leads you to believe this? Is it based on other games with her?

Also if the cop wants to investigate me I am fine with that. I welcome it.

What makes you think the game set up includes a cop?

@ Myko
why is it a weird explanation?Funny i give you a rope to possible crawl out of the hole that you dug and you want to hang me with it. As far as Kaze's meta dive you have not shown why we should believe this is not the norm for your scum game, If you want to show that he is wrong I know I would be open to listen. Post a scum game where you acted differently.

You shouldn't trust someone else's meta report, even if you think they are town, unless you know they are talking about experiential meta. Research the linked threads for yourself and see if you agree. Wanting to lynch someone on the basis of a meta report you haven't verified? Not good.

I'm rounding up my town block. My vote on pitoli was a reach out in and of itself. You also know that I don't obviously build town blocks I'm every game

What are your thoughts about pitoli post reach-out? Are you thinking she's town? You moved your vote, but you moved it off ruffling mostly on the basis of uncertainty, I think.

I think I want to work with SSK town based on his reads list. He misses a lot yes, but I think scum partners would probably fill him in on Orc claim.

This is a good point.

I agree that I gave him too much credit for his early posting, which is something I discovered last night while looking for alternatives. I don't like that Sakura sheeped me after voting me; it felt like if she was concerned about Nachoscum, then she probably wouldn't have been so immediately reassured by me. She is not the type of player who dances with me or challenges me to dance with her, she usually just follows along with my initial pushes. If she's paranoid of me, she's usually clearly and obviously paranoid of me, not this strange middle ground where she's kind of paranoid of me but not really. So I feel like she's sorting me out because she thinks that's the type of thing I would townread from her, but not showing actual signs of sorting me out because she's not actually town.

Yeah. I liked the way she reacted to my vote a while back, but I don't like that she's not trying to figure me out. She's just called that vote unusual aggression. it's not, really. It was totally based on my asking them for their reads and getting an outdated list that contained no reasoning. At the time I didn't know that was Sakura. I thought GiF was being flippant.

Pitoli town based on interactions and a level of ballsiness required to be coming from pitoli scum that I don't think she possesses.
Marangal meltdown makes myko town, don't really give a shit what he posts although moving away from the norm in a significant way is something that comes from myko town more often than myko scum.
Tammy deacon town.
MafiaSSK gets two points based on what I assume scumbuddies would have filled him in on. If scumteam is prohawk/gif though, maybe not. Otherwise would prefer not to kill him based on townreads elsewhere (head can be cut off today).
Ruffling trust of me is weird and I am suspicious as all hell, but not sure he is best flip for today. Look into again later.
Prohawk still scummy. Conviction in response to me was good, follow up responses were not. Current line on ruffling is concerning if ruffling town.
Mac town.
Fuzzy most likely town, although I have paranoid flashes now and then.
Kaze also most likely town although I have similar paranoid flashes on him.
Minami good bet for scum.

Does scum-Nacho typically provide so many town reads?

If anything, scum-Nacho's reads lists are more detailed. But, so are town-Nacho's reads list when he has access to a computer.

Really...... bc unless I am a Godfather there is no reason I would want to be investigated. I am doubting there is a Godfather role in a mini game.Plus this is nonsense bc I have seen plenty of time where townies ask to be investigated. I would be surprised if you have not seen that also. I am really confused by your logic.

I've seen it a couple of times. Last time was pitoli. And I've seen it work a couple of times. I think it works more often then the average amount of scum in a game.

in pitoli's case she responded to a joke, and I failed to understand that properly, it didnt make sense to me at that moment. Your mention of it is completely out of the blue. Pitoli had 2 reasons to be town and think about cops (one person was joking about it towards her, and she was a cop variant herself). I don't see that counting for you here.

And you aren't confused.

AH HA! So we have played before.

That nacho suggestion looked like it implied the knowledge of a scum encryptor

I'm going to go with mod meta here and say that there's a good chance that the game design may include day chat without it being tied to an encryptor. Cabd loves day chat as scum. This could be a site meta thing, but especially in theme games I don't assume that scum are restricted to night chat only.

That nacho suggestion looked like it implied the knowledge of a scum encryptor

Pretty much my point...

Would you agree with what I said just above re Cabd and scum chat?

ffery/bork seem way to aggresive for what I remember of ffery or bork (tho the one game i played with bork was a long time ago)

Are you talking about something besides my voting you here? The games we've played where I was scum, I was way less aggressive than I typically am is town. This characterization feels wrong. I'm not sure if it's town-wrong. :/

One instance also doesn't disprove an entire school of thought, hawkie.

Actually, it does only take one instance to prove a school of absolute thought wrong. Something can't be true when its not...

But its beside the point, saying that Rufflig is a weak lynch because I/we/he don't have game experience together is not true in the least. I could fight against the majority and push for your lynch, but I actually think he has a greater chance of flipping scum than you do at this point, and it wouldn't get me anywhere to tunnel on you all day long when I don't see many others wanting to lynch you at this point.

Are you leaning town on GifSakura?

[mykonian]

Yes, we played. You've had the (questionable) luck to see me in one of my better town games. With some ups and downs.