Mini 1531 ~ Mafia Pinnipedum (Game Over!)

[walked into a club]

...Just dawned on you right after I mentioned it specifically you mean, garmr?

Anyways there was no meta read, sorry-notsorry about that. I was looking more to dance with LLD on one of her townreads and to see how dedicated to said read she was.

[walked into a club]

L-1, I believe.

Correct. It was an unvote-revote.

[kanyeknowsbest]

VOTE: Smudger

Yeah, this is the play today.

Ehhhhh. The actually

might

both be scum; I was speaking mostly on odds. I tend to think of the odds of having two scum run up, and both at least L-2 simultaneously Day 1, as vanishingly low. Regardless. I want Smudger's blood.

regardless of the odds, like i expressed earlier smdgeos voting likely implies theyre not both scum. similarly im p sure smudger is the right call as well.

i kind of wanted to hear from nacho a little more on this but ill be hammering when i get home i thjink.

[Garmr]

...Just dawned on you right after I mentioned it specifically you mean, garmr?

Anyways there was no meta read, sorry-notsorry about that. I was looking more to dance with LLD on one of her townreads and to see how dedicated to said read she was.

Wait so you are saying you voted me to test LLD did you leave any hints you were doing this aka crumbs.

[walked into a club]

Wait so you are saying you voted me to test LLD did you leave any hints you were doing this aka crumbs.

Why would I? I know what crumbs are TYVM.

[Garmr]

So you actually have some evidence that you were doing a reaction test instead of leaving it for like 15 pages and then going oh forgot to tell you my vote was a reaction test when someone ask you to cough up the content. That's why you crumb at least something.

[walked into a club]

I can just link my wiki?

An abridged history of "Gambits and Shit Cabd has Pulled in Mafia"

Chapter One: As Town
-Fakeclaim psychologist in RVS to get the SK to claim
-Fake a cop innocent on a townread
-Fakeclaim nuetral survivor in 3-man lylo with the other two crossed to win the game
-Faked having a QT with a dead player
-Faked a posting restriction to fly under the radar
-Faked a cop guilty on a huge scumread (they flipped scum)

Chapter Two: As Scum
-Claimed scum to get a daykill
-Faked hours of metadiving
-Coasted on a hider claim to a perfect win (Three times now I think)
-Used dead people to leverage my case against another player
-Watcher-guiltied my own teammate in 6P MYLO to go on to win
-Pointed out my partner's scumslip on page one of a newbie
-Faked towntells
-

[walked into a club]

I can just link my wiki?

An abridged history of "Gambits and Shit Cabd has Pulled in Mafia"

Chapter One: As Town
-Fakeclaim psychologist in RVS to get the SK to claim
-Fake a cop innocent on a townread
-Fakeclaim nuetral survivor in 3-man lylo with the other two crossed to win the game
-Faked having a QT with a dead player
-Faked a posting restriction to fly under the radar
-Faked a cop guilty on a huge scumread (they flipped scum)

Chapter Two: As Scum
-Claimed scum to get a daykill
-Faked hours of metadiving
-Coasted on a hider claim to a perfect win (Three times now I think)
-Used dead people to leverage my case against another player
-Watcher-guiltied my own teammate in 6P MYLO to go on to win
-Pointed out my partner's scumslip on page one of a newbie
-Faked towntells
-

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Cabd

[Garmr]

Faked hours of metadiving is under scum
have you ever done it as town before?

[walked into a club]

Faked hours of metadiving is under scum
have you ever done it as town before?

The correct question is "Have you faked a read as a reaction test before as town" and my answer is "uh... duh"

[kanyeknowsbest]

aka Cabds excellent guide to thinking youre great at mafia but actuaklly just awful.

[Garmr]

That's not what I asked the reaction test isn't what you faked that what you are claiming. The meta diving is what you said you faked.

[Natirasha]

aka Cabds excellent guide to thinking youre great at mafia but actuaklly just awful.

+1

[penguin_alien]

Smudger, my scum read on you remains partially due to the self-consciousness I'm seeing in your early posts, and it doesn't abate later on. There's a lot of AtE in the whole 'I played badly, I deserve this lynch for dumb play' spiel, and I don't trust that either.

-snip-

Basically reasons for scumreading Smudger are self-consciousness and AtE, which is the type of reasoning that just hurts my insides. It also doesn't hurt that the scummiest people on the Smudger wagon were Kaze and penguin.

I saw that you later said you read Smudger's self-recrminiations as town; I disagree. I think he's putting on a show. The last part of this doesn't follow for me: you're saying that it doesn't hurt your argument for scum-me that I was among the scummiest people on the wagon?

Questions from Purple Plague I've missed, with apologies:

Garmr, as per your earlier post, if you think Smudger is scum, why would you worry about him self-hammering?

This question didn't impress me much. Where did it go? Why was it asked? The underlying talk behind it seems to be

why wouldnt you want to lynch scum???

which is one of those things scum ask when they are looking for an easy ass attack.

I've played a couple games recently where scum prevaricated around the L-1 vote. Not Garmr, but it's on my mind.

Purple Plague proposing a town block feels in character from Ms Marangal. And if I'm reading that right as Nacho nixing it, that also seems likely from town-Nacho, given I seem to recall some recently completed game where scum hung out in the town block for a good while.

Lady LambdaDelta reads town. In combination with Smudger griping about game length via referencing other people's posts, I'd like to see where his wagon goes.

VOTE: Smudger

Why?

I've never actually done that kinda thing before.

and, yes Nacho is nixing that block

Given the number of players here I think you've played with and my sense of you as a player, I would expect you to want to take advantage of your connections with people here. And by 'take advantage of' I don't mean prey on as scum; just that you'd want to capitalize on them.

So, my wagon at L-1:

Debonair Danny DiPietro, Natirasha, Smudger, The Purple Plague, Does Bo Know, Selkies

DDD: Normally I'd think that someone willing to start a wagon is likely town, but his Smudger town-read that he uses to dismiss the Smudger wagon and like a vote on me better isn't good. Here's what I have from his ISO prior to his vote on me concerning Smudger:

Bo. not really focused on him (DDD) or anyone else in particular at this moment. Nothing seems to be a stand out for me after reading through, why do you ask?

I'm his way of looking like he's doing something productive.

Easy interaction with Smudger

can someone ask me a question please..? I am feeling left out...

Why do people keep asking this?

Ugh, that’s brutal and I missed it on the first go around, exact same bullshit as Garmr.

Implies that Smudger was being scummy.

But then:

Feel like the Smudger wagon is on town, no interest in that.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: penguin_alien

Shuts down a Smudger wagon, easy vote on me. Cheerleads it along without doing much to add weight to the arguments.

Natirasha: First off my wagon once it hit L-1. Don't think scum would go after my defender before at least trying to squeeze a claim out of me.

Smudger: Happy to go with a counterwagon, not very influential in my scum read on him.

TPP: Based on my posting I'm not surprised these players were willing to lynch me. They've also been consistent with the read for a while before putting down the vote, so I'm less concerned with them being scum.

DBK: Casual disengagement also without any interest in looking for the claim. He stepped back and looked at the whole game state/vote count for analysis as well, and I actually like how he was willing to change his mind without tons of justification here:

That Penguin wagon happened way too fast, there's gotta be at least a scum on it.

VOTE: penguin_allen

I liked Plague's explanation of why PA can be scum.

Selkies: orcinus posts here:

I asked fery to catch me up in this game. Sorry for not paying too much attention.

I think at this point in time I agree with fery about Smudger being more than likely town. His wagon is driven on his snark to LLD (I think?) which in our experiences actually lean town more often than it leans scum.

Fery tihnks that the early reaction was pretty bad but given how the wagon is stagnating at L-1 he's had a much more towny vibe. I...agree with that, but would like to add that when wagons stagnate at L-1 it's much easier than when the wagon is actually building (for the scum player that is)

im ok with this vote

VOTE: penguin

Dismissing Smudger's wagon as a backlash against him being snarky with LLD is lousy. I'm also not seeing how him shifting over towards AtE when he hit L-1 is towny.

I'm also interested in the part where fferyllt asserts that she and Nacho know my scum game after NY 164 right after saying that I'm not easy to read despite that very same months-long game. The inconsistency doesn't follow.

[penguin_alien]

So, my wagon, as I'd order it town to scum:

Natirasha
Does Bo Know
The Purple Plague
Selkies
Debonair Danny DiPietro
Smudger

Also realized I forgot to check who, if anyone, jumped from Smudger to me or whether we have discrete wagons.

[Natirasha]

Anyone object to hammer? I want to lynch by page 30.

[Selkies]

Anyone object to hammer? I want to lynch by page 30.

I want to talk to PA for a bit.

[penguin_alien]

I'm still awake, hit me.

[Selkies]

I'm also interested in the part where fferyllt asserts that she and Nacho know my scum game after NY 164 right after saying that I'm not easy to read despite that very same months-long game. The inconsistency doesn't follow.

I'm not sure if this is an intentional misrepresentation or a misinterpretation.

I did say that I have difficulty reading you. I have some thoughts about what distinguishes your scum play from your town play but they are theories under refinement. And I am well aware that I carry around a ton of paranoia about you, and I find that I question myself a lot about whether something you do that alarms me is actually scummy. At one time, I thought I was pretty good at reading you because I was good at reading Ghostly Penguin. But, it's not you I read in that hydra. It's Ghostlin.

External points of confirmation help with sorting paranoia from reality. I wasn't sure what to make of your wagon before Nacho posted his quotestripe case.

What I actually asked Cabd was if he was asserting that Nacho and Mara can't read you after NY 164. Not me.

[penguin_alien]

...too many hydras. Yeah, I confused you and Mara there. And yes, Ghostlin was definitely the obv-town half in Death's Diner.

[penguin_alien]

I don't like the penguin wagon. Penguin tends to be the kind of player that gets wagoned easily for one or two posts based upon the way she approaches things and that's what this feels like. The choice between Smudger and Penguin is a no brainer.

I really don't like orcffery's vote there. At all. It's very shocking to see her scumreading penguin when she knows what actual scumpeng looks like.

I also dislike the fact that my absence means I never gave garmr the meta case he wanted and yet past the initial dig at me there was no followup at all about it. Seems he was content to take a potshot and leave it at that.

She's not easy for me to read despite playing that months-long game with scum-PA.

What part of Nacho's case do you disagree with?

Am I an easier target? You're attacking me/orcinus for the vote when Nacho is actually pushing her wagon. He and Mara don't know her scum game? After ny164?

OK, here's where I was mixing things up. But I'm not following how you figure Nacho and Mara know my scum game but you don't when you all basically saw the same things, and you were probably pushing my lynch more than Mara there.

[Smudger]

but I am a little worried about the read on him, and especially on how he isn't really trying to diffuse it himself.

I don't get this, well I think I do, are you saying I should be doing more to look town?

anyway can you hammer please. I have nothing more to say other than will l watch this game with no interest at all. I need to learn to play in the big pool before I swim with sharks...

[Smudger]

PA is Scum BTW undoubtedly in my mid, but then my opinion is worth shit....

[The Purple Plague]

Who are your scumreads?

I'm unsure if this was ever answered, sorry if I missed it in my initial skim.

[The Purple Plague]

So we have two imposing wagons one built up slow and incredibly hard to lynch, while the one fast but diffused just as fast as it built. This is interesting how the two contrast.

After taking a second look my town reads are pretty much split onto both wagons while my scum reads are focused on Penguin alien.

I'm going to retract my statement about PA being the preferred lynch because even through 543.

Also

VOTE: Smudge

that's l-1

This is what I have a problem with.

Peng wasn't a slow wagon. It built up incredibly fast.

Who the fuck cares about wagon speed anymore?