A uPick of Ice & Fire - Day 12 - #REKT?

[Titus]

So, are you saying that we have two fake claiiming idiots Magua?

[Magua]

Er, yes?

[Titus]

I can't go that far. Sorry. Benmage is scum.

[Magua]

I mean, one of them is now a mod-confirmed idiot. So.

The other one I have seen, as town:
1) Govern scum in order to lynch town,
2) As VT, breadcrumb a guilty and then later counterclaim a cop to get the cop lynched

My opinion of Benmage is not, it should be said, high.

But there was just little reason for him to do that as scum. Town's flapping around like a chicken without a head; why put your neck out there as scum? You don't need to.

[Titus]

Day 7, Vc 16

Alfred Borden (1) -

Shadoweh

The Alchemist (3) -

SafetyDance, Titus, Messiah Complex

kanyeknowsbest (8) -

Tierce, Garruk Relentless, elleheathen, ooba, Benmage, Cephrir, Alfred Borden, Nautilius

ooba (1) -

kanyeknowsbest

Not voting (2)

:The Alchemist, Tammy

With 15 alive it takes 8 votes to lynch

• Deadline Date: 8th of December 20:15 EST
  
• Deadline Countdown: (expired on 2013-12-08 19:30:00)
  
• Titus is V/la (or will be!)

Benmage opens the next day with a claimed guilty on Garruk. It serves to totally bury TA as a scum suspect. It works pretty damn well too. He has OMG! I'm an idiot to support his position. Frankly, I don't suffer idiots gladly.

[Magua]

Taking a page from Regfan:

Town (Strong to weak): Alfred, Titus, Benmage, and Alchemist

Scum (Strong to weak): Nautilus, Cephrir, SafetyDance, Shadoweh

PEdit:

Benmage opens the next day with a claimed guilty on Garruk. It serves to totally bury TA as a scum suspect. It works pretty damn well too. He has OMG! I'm an idiot to support his position. Frankly, I don't suffer idiots gladly.

...

Since we have ooba-town, counterpoint: Why would Benmage-scum not simply push for ooba-town to be lynched under lynch all liars?

Yeah, I get that you don't suffer idiots. If I'd known what a clusterfuck this was going to be, I wouldn't've joined, to be quite honest, but I'm here. And guess what? IDIOT DOES NOT MEAN SCUM.

I mean, I've got fucking history here with Benmage that just shows he's a colossal prick with complete disregard for how to play the game. BUT THAT DOESN'T MAKING HIM FUCKING SCUM NO MATTER HOW MUCH I WANT HIM TO BE.

[Magua]

Fuck, you've got ooba's flip staring you right in the face.

[Shadoweh]

lolokay vote me then suckah. Man your scumlist is bad. The kind of bad that scum have to push because they have no options.

[Shadoweh]

Oh yeah uhm with the traitor flip I think maybe I was being a little crazy yesterday and Cephrir probably isn't alt-scum and alt-scum probably don't exist. Pretend you totally never saw that happen okay

[Titus]

Benmage can't push for a lynch all liars policy lynch. Look at his meta. It would be hypocritical at best. Plus, lynching ooba might draw the attention away from TA for awhile, but Benmage can always come back with having "tracked" TA and TA not doing the kill.

[Titus]

Naut is my biggest townread Magua....

[Magua]

lolokay vote me then suckah. Man your scumlist is bad. The kind of bad that scum have to push because they have no options.

With the mod vote on Alfred, you're laying down a vote that, were you town, allows for a three-man scumteam to hammer.

In response to, from what I gather, is an action that failed last Night.

Before the person in question can even answer.

And you're calling me bad?

---

PEdit:

Naut is my biggest townread Magua....

Ok. Why?

[Shadoweh]

Oh you're right my bad, the horror there might be a three-man coordinated scum hammer in not-lylo, that would be so fucking terrible.

[Magua]

Ah, with Benmage being

a turd

a more polite way to say a turd, Shadoweh has Alfred at L-2 on the fifth post of the Day with three scum alive.

[Magua]

WHAT THE FUCK SHADOWEH

VOTE SHENANIGANS ARE PRESENT TODAY AND SO COULD BE FUCKING PRESENT TOMORROW

WHICH MEANS TODAY COULD BE LYLO

AND INSTEAD

YOU'RE ALL

"WELL FUCK LET'S PUT 'IM AT L-2 BECAUSE ITS NOT LIKE WE HAVE DIPSHITS IN THIS GAME WHO'LL QUICKHAMMER REGARDLESS OF ALIGNMENT OR ANYTHING"

[Shadoweh]

(pro-tip scum don't usually coordinate hammers on scum)
(Because Alfred is scum)
(it's SCIENCE)

[Shadoweh]

Hasn't it been pointed out multiple times that Alfred is the person whose been quickhammering the most anyways? I don't think you need to worry about him going crazy on himself!

[Titus]

Mass claiming isn't a horrible idea, either. I am sorry for my bits of shitty play so far, but I aim to make up some ground this day phase.

Let's take time to sort out this day phase, Titus. Voting can come when we've found our feet again.

You are correct there is too much confusion, and scum is going to jump on the town idiots as opposed to the blatant scum kiddies if things go quickly. Ooba, you need to drop the hell out of your two scumteam theory until evidence of it arises.

n1 elle had not killed anyone
n2 goat had not killed anyone
n3 quadz had not killed anyone
n4 pnj, resulted in "VICTARION"
n5 alfred had not killed anyone
n6 ceph had not killed anyone

Second piece of the case on him is this. Quadz, on N3, hadn't killed anyone. Now quadz on N3 hadn't under an approximate fuckton of pressure, but he wasn't at all in a better position than any of his other scumteam members. Zdenek? Ooba? Benmage? Cephrir? No, no, no. What would make sense is Alchemist submitting the kills because he's a ninja, and quadz not doing so as a result. This theory would make kkb's results useless, but I think it makes sense given the quadz result on N3 especially (and maybe even the alfred result for some of you for still suspect the hell out of him).

There is a hoop to jump through in order to believe Alchemist-scum that comes in the form of Tammy and "why give coin to town?", but let's talk about both of those things now. For one, immediately jumping out of the neighborhood with Tammy in order to be a useless shit and pretend to be not-Syryana is scummy. Why not use his free vig kill as an additional scumkill? Well, there is the matter of being neighborized by Tammy before he could even give it away, needing something to claim, and then not being able to make a magical kill appear without Tammy being dead. Scumteam might have had different priorities Night 1, didn't want to kill Tammy like that, so Syryana went for the towncred route. It's also a bit... strange? He waited so long to give his coin away/didn't look for someone to give his coin to? If town, he would be wanting to pass his coin off early and get a kill early, but talk of passing it off only came after he claimed, which again is strange.

In the end, we're looking at this game of Syryana's being the worst town game he's ever played (despite strong motivation on Day 1 + a playerlist where a large majority of them are sounding boards that should be working with him excellently). The fact that his coin wasn't used as a scumvig is a point to him being town that is explained by him being neighborized by Tammy so early and being expected to fullclaim quickly (in which case, saying that he was a ninja with a one-shot commute probably wouldn't cut it). I can't see him reacting the way he has a couple of ways as town, and I don't see why he wouldn't have hit his stride somewhere in this game, despite him finding a way to hit his stride in literally every other towngame ever.

Vote: The Alchemist

This is where I strongly feel we should go today.

First thing that concerns me about the Messiah Complex hydra is that they currently have less than a post per page and I can't remember anything that they've posted recently. The current people hitting less than a post per page are:

Alfred Borden (Empire/Llamarble) - Concerning, would be more concerning if Empire was still in the game. I can see Llamarble-town having trouble getting into a game where his partner who was doing the lion's share of the work abandoned him.
elleheathen Magua - elle flaked for a hell of a while, Magua is a replacement, not surprising.
Messiah Complex (Desperado/Formerfish)
ooba - generally a low rate poster, not a concern.
SafetyDance - generally a low rate poster, not a concern.
Shadoweh - I figured she would have more posts by now, but :hitoshrug:
The Alchemist - lurking scum which explains low postcount

Messiah Complex most likely shouldn't be close to this postrate. He should be a leader by now because the list is getting pretty fucking small and the game is getting pretty fucking close to the bad stages, but he's not. This is concerning. Not a smoking gun quite yet, but concerning in a bad way considering the last large games I remember him in he had postcounts like this and this (lurkfuck game) and this (incredibly lurky Desperado-town) and this, and I wouldn't expect him to lose an incredible amount of energy and good posting like he has lately.

Naut, your walls were TLDR. Where is your case on me again?

As for the two fake claimers, it doesn't make sense to fake claim cop right after another fake claimed cop. BM fullclaiming helps get into his head to see why or how hat happened. I am looking for a definite reason why Benmage is town, as a way of verifying my vote. If I don't get it. It's tunnel time.

Full claiming helps get in his head? How? It's a fake claim which means that it isn't based on role information, it's based on Benmage.

Fakeclaims don't make any fucking sense, but I'll ask again: why does one of them have to be scum? "because there were two of them" doesn't actually answer that question

Then there's the gambit Naut did at the end of Day 1.

These posts show a narrative, town leader mindset. Naut is trying to solve the game. His ISO reads like that. The 1 v 1 with GnR was shitty and caused me to suspect Naut for awhile but this is Naut town. Just look at that ISO.

[Titus]

WHAT THE FUCK SHADOWEH

VOTE SHENANIGANS ARE PRESENT TODAY AND SO COULD BE FUCKING PRESENT TOMORROW

WHICH MEANS TODAY COULD BE LYLO

AND INSTEAD

YOU'RE ALL

"WELL FUCK LET'S PUT 'IM AT L-2 BECAUSE ITS NOT LIKE WE HAVE DIPSHITS IN THIS GAME WHO'LL QUICKHAMMER REGARDLESS OF ALIGNMENT OR ANYTHING"

I don't think anyone is going to quickhammer here.

Under what theory is this lylo? I don't see lylo at all otherwise I wouldn't have voted at all.

[Shadoweh]

He is saying it could secretly be lylo because of scum vote manip that somehow Faraday wouldn't announce, which would make Faraday even more terrible then Benmage says he is. I guess he really doesn't want Alfred to get lynched for some reason :trollface:

[Titus]

I think the vote manip is MC being a restless spirit. It's the only role I've heard of that wasn't players voting.

To that end, I'm near certain we shouldn't lynch AB.

[Shadoweh]

Why do you think the restless spirit is MC?

[Magua]

Shadoweh, other scum besides Alfred.

PEdit: Titus.

I think massclaiming, especially in this setup, doesn't help town and only helps scum, and that tends to be the case in all Faraday setups.

It's easy to say and it doesn't cement you to any reads. Similarly, "Slow the fuck down guys," is a useful but contentless sentiment (and I say this with the full knowledge I say this all the time myself).

The best indication of Nautilus-town to me at this time would be his defense of Alfred Borden-town. The rest of what I've seen from him has been meh. Do not know the D1 thing you are referring to.

---

There are three scum alive, so normally 4:3 (7p) would be lylo. But if the scum can generate a vote, then today would be lylo if they are capable of generating the vote tomorrow as well.

And since there's no way to know whether the second part about being able to generate the vote tomorrow is true or not, better to play it safe.

PEdit:

because of scum vote manip that somehow Faraday wouldn't announce

Yeah. Like a vote from the mod in the vote count or anything unannounced like that.

[Magua]

I think the vote manip is MC being a restless spirit. It's the only role I've heard of that wasn't players voting.

To that end, I'm near certain we shouldn't lynch AB.

It's a common way of denoting that someone is publicly hated. I did the same thing in Paranoia Mafia.

[Cephrir]

My thought was that the mod vote is probably either ooba or MC. I imagine they can't change it, either way.

Here's my issue right now, before reviewing MC.

SD was insanely town around his claim and has the quadz thing in his favor.
Naut is trying really fucking hard and has been hyper town all damn game.
Alfred was the counterwagon to scum yesterday. And a counterwagon MC could not have pushed any harder; it nearly worked.
Benmage made a play that would just be retarded from scum. He could be scum, but he is definitely not my first pick.
I think Titus is town just on play and by comparison to my other game with her.

That leaves me Shadoweh, Alchemist, and Magua. If there aren't at least 2 scum in there I'll eat my detective hat. That's how I feel pre MC iso anyway, we'll see what happens.