Left 4 Dead Mafia! (Game Over!)

[Nero Cain]

Nero and rubi, what do you guys think about vezok?

I don't really see him as all that scummy.

[dopog]

@Bulb

What don't you like about semi-jokey posts, especially in the early game?

Why would I follow up on an RVS vote?

Semi-jokey posts seem kind of like a nice sweetspot for scum earlygame imo, because I think people try to evaluate joke posts and the real content that opens up the game with a bit of a spotlight, whereas semi-jokey stuff doesn't get picked up and it let's mafians not have to generate a real read. Obviously heaps of people can do that - but your posts sounded as if you were kind of guaging - trying to see where people are at without making a big deal of anything.
Yeah and about the vote I guess looking at the flow of the game it seemed somewhat serious to me - like you asked him two questions (albeit one joking) and then vote him. Also I read your vote and then this;

How can you have a gut townread of a player that hasn't posted yet?

So I was like "yeah maybe that could be serious" cause that sounded accusatory and then you just left it.
I guess that's a kind of take it or leave it thing.

@Nero

I've barely posted and what I have hasn't always been serious so what is making you feel so good about me? Do you a have a crush on me?

Hahah nooo: I enjoyed your answers in the back and forth with BBmolla. Pretty much I don't see scum saying "probs" in that moment responding to him if you want me to pinpoint something.

yeah

[Nero Cain]

Maaaaaaaaaybe toog too.

I actually do not like Toog.

As for the mechanic, it's my opinion that if you are a VT,

just submit your own choices and screw what everyone else thinks.

Only town has control of the mechanic, so to try and take control of it from those people means you don't trust them and are willing to allow scum to influence their choices.

I'm not really a big fan of the bolded 'cause like if town aren't sending in similar lists then certain people have less and less chance of getting horde killed.

You are reading the mod's info in the most rose-colored way possible if you believe scum won't be given at least one if not more tools to influence the horde.

There is no indication what so ever that scum would have any influence.

First off, people with the Horde Mentality have to pick three names. Of these three names, the host randomly ousts two of them. Then he tallies the names up and the one with the most gets killed. It's practically random in and of itself.

Everyone with the Horde Mentality could put "Toogeloo" down as one of their choices

, but if I get ousted from every list, I am not dying. It's just too random of a situation to think that scum would have a power to influence it at this stage.

And furthermore, even if you believe that scum have a way to manipulate the horde, why are you condoning actually giving them more information to work with in order to better utilize said ability?

This is also super yuck, it could be that me and Thor played in TWD and scum DID have a role that controlled the herd but beyond that, Venmar isn't exactly a spring chicken wen it comes to modding so him doing a mechanic over which scum has no control/say seems p naïve.

I also think we should listen to him and do the bolded!

[Thor665]

I think you just ended up describing a good reason Toog is likely town and then advocated killing him.

[Nero Cain]

Why would that make Toog likely town?

[pidgey]

I apperantly suck at reading.

Anyway why do you have a crush at Nero dopog? o.O

Also,isnt semijoke RVS shit done irrelevantly as scum or town by people and is more of a non tell and irrelevant? Don't like making a deal of any RVS bullshit.

[Nero Cain]

You mean you don't have a crush on me, Pid?!?

[Aegor]

I disagree with toog but am not getting the scummy vibes. Nero's case on bulb is a huge stretch.

[Nero Cain]

I have a case on Bulb?

[Aegor]

*dopog's case.

[Nero Cain]

OH THAT CASE

Bulb's ava is super lame and he doesn't have a rockin beard like Thor. So he's prob scum.

[Nero Cain]

would have been funnier if Aegor didn't post but meh...

[Aegor]

My bad.

[Bulbazak]

How can you have a gut townread of a player that hasn't posted yet?

So I was like "yeah maybe that could be serious" cause that sounded accusatory and then you just left it.

It seemed like a strange thing to say, so I asked her about it.

Bulb's ava is super lame and he doesn't have a rockin beard like Thor. So he's prob scum.

So that's what I'm missing...

[Nero Cain]

Also Pid, you said Toog was maybe town. What do you think of 302?

[BBmolla]

@BBMolla: What do you think of PV, AP and Zdenek?

Scummy, I always think he's town so idk, Town

[AngryPidgeon]

@Molla: Have I ever been scum in a game with you?

@Thor: Thoughts on Aegor? I may have missed them if you did post them.
Also, thoughts on Dan?

Actually I think I see that post of Toog's you are talking about as likely from town. I alsol iked his RVs. He posted something I disliked, but I can't remember what so meh. I'll call him null null-town for now.

[BBmolla]

No, don't think so

[AngryPidgeon]

Also Pid, you said Toog was maybe town. What do you think of 302?

Im sheeping Thor here.

[vezokpiraka]

mastin seems mastin to me at the moment, dunno why everyone is afraid when mastin mastins. Its annoying yes, but not necessary scum at the moment.

Hi thor.

##vote: vezok

Some of his comments strike me the wrong way and his vote on rubicon seems weak

Where are you AP ;_;

My vote feels weak?
That is like the best thing I heard all day. Next time I'll do a case from only RVS posts.

Hey!

I'm feeling g about nero, guyinfreezer and toog.

@Bulba

What don't you like?

Eh kinda the early posts reads as if you are mafia trying to wade into the game with kinda semi-jokey posts;

Why so serious?

Vote Mastin2

The whody what now?

Crippling insecurities.

Especially the first one cause you don't really seem to want to follow up on the vote.

But then pretty sure #174 is geniune - regarding it: thinking over whether that actually is indicitave of alignment or not just because seen people get burned by the "I'm not happy with my game" card.

unvote
vote PeregrineV

@Rubicon: Ok cause I just don't get it: Why #108? ...

@BBMolla: What do you think of PV, AP and Zdenek?

Cya later

This guy is town.

[mastin2]

Thats a shitty reason to get a scum read on me
VOTE: Bulba

And yet, you randomly choose to ignore it, and instead vote Bulb.

Vote: SweatingChessball

Because based on my last 2 games with you both, you probably won't be around tomorrow.
If you somehow are, we may revisit this.

This type of insane troll logic is basically something I can only see coming from a town-Peregrine.

VOTE: Vezok

Did I mention that Sven's scum with Rubicon?

...Yeah, well, Sven's scum with Rubicon. In this case, blatantly chainsaw defending Rubicon and starting a counter-wagon to Rubicon.

Your "but then" and "of course this blah blah id possible" kinda posts ring town to me.

You mean the elements of my posting

most

like my null-normal self?

The clincher IMO is this snippet about dopog

Because by numbers alone, he's likely to be town. Because by the players in this game, he's likely to end up mislynched because he's not as intertwined. Because of my gut. And most importantly of all...because I said so.

You mean the elements of my play

second

-most like my null-normal self, perhaps arguably even *the* most like my normal null self? You're townreading me for THAT?

You guys, Mastin just posted but ignored EVERYTHING about me calling her scum.

Umm...no I didn't?

I am not. I repeat. NOT. Accepting townreads on me, when I've specifically gone out of my way to weird players out. Like...

Nero's response is probably from town.

That, I'd expect.

Do you want me to count the reasons why?

Yes.

Also, Thor's pretty likely town. His stances are reasonable and well-backed. I really like his approach to the game so far. Pretty much the only thing not to like is the DrippingChesskid vote, and even then, that's strongly Thor being Thor, not Thor being scum or Thor being town.

I am also thinking Bulbazak is town, though I'm not entirely sure. The change in Bulbazak seems really legitimate, and I of all people know what it's like to be down on your luck as town. Basically, it's not something I see as being a likely scum approach. While there are theoretically advantages to doing so (helps justify 'off' play, helps keep his options open, and such), it just seems, well, like something that he simply wouldn't do as scum. It'd be all too easy to just be his normal arrogant self as scum; why this game of all games to be humble? Far more likely than not, it's from town.

Mastin demanding that people explain their town read on her doesn't seem genuine. She often gets town reads on people for fairly weak reasons, and kind of doubt that she didn't understand why SNK would have a town read on her.

Normally, yes. But normally, I am my normal self during the game. Normally, there are things in my posting that I know are town and I know people will pick up as being town.

...I specifically went out of my way to

avoid

doing those things. I specifically went out of my way to do things that I knew would freak people out who know me. Which is why people like Nero and Thor are town: because they're reacting how I expected of someone seeing that. I get townreads on me for reasons that might seem weak, but have legitimate bases. This game, I've gotten townreads on me that

are

weak, with absolutely none. I should be null to nullscum to them. That I'm not is quite frankly deeply concerning.

All of the following posts are sketch and trying too hard:

Why are mine not among them? I was being sketch and trying too hard more than any other player. Heck, I still am.

Would also lynch Thor or Rubicon.

Rubicon it is, then.
VOTE: Rubicon.

Vezok is town, the counter-wagon to the scum-Rubicon.

/Through 9.

[Rubicon]

@Rubicon: Ok cause I just don't get it: Why #108? ...

...I feel like just asking "why?" implies that I would automatically know what you didn't like about it. What part don't you get?

[Rubicon]

I just do. Or did, anyway. Less sure now.

What changed? Because prior to this you were defending them from me, so I'm guessing something had to shift.

Seeing several of my town reads in her scum pile was the wake up call I needed to realize her true nature.

[Rubicon]

@ Nero:

And furthermore, even if you believe that scum have a way to manipulate the horde, why are you condoning actually giving them more information to work with in order to better utilize said ability?

This feels like a town response, agree/disagree?

[mastin2]

Mastin I don't think Im willing to call you a scumread yet, but you are par for the course with this wall alone.

See this?

This

is what I expected from a town player reading me. THIS is a town reaction to seeing me post what I did. AP is town.

I'm also thinking BBMolla's town, too. I asked him to obvtown himself, and he delivered, in his own unique charming way.

[4] Rubicon: Vezokpiraka, PeregrineV, Zdenek, Toogeloo
[4] Vezokpiraka: Svenskt Stal, Aegor, pidgey, AngryPidgeon

Seriously, Vezok's the town counter-wagon to the scum Rubicon-wagon.

Forgot to mention it, even though it's kinda clear. Aegor's in fact a decently-strong townread of mine, and Zdenek is also a very strong townread, because Zed's (ha!) posting pretty similarly to Thor, in that all of his posts are strongly-reasoned and seem highly, HIGHLY town-oriented in their thought process.

Vezok IS a Rubicon buddy.

Well, then, you won't mind lynching Rubicon first, now, will you?

Also, I change my mind: dopog's ridiculously town. Never lynch this guy. He is town, through-and-through. This one, I'm having a bit of trouble explaining right here and now (which is bad; I'm specifically trying to break that habit this game), but it is towntowntowntowntown.