Mini 1558 - VisCon: Crossroads [Game Over]

[Majiffy]

What's the discerning difference that makes you think Konowa's post is scum-motivated instead of town-motivated?

Because it doesn't feel like a pressure vote, it looks like a vote he can place and ride on for a while comfortably.

Majiffy, what do you think of Konowa besides that one post?

He has made little to no impact on the game and I think that's because he doesn't want to stir up the waters any more than he already did.

Note that he hasn't even addressed my vote on him or the reason.

[FakeGod]

Looking for kirroha's replacement.

[FakeGod]

VoteCount 1.4

notscience [1] - Who
pieguyn [3] - Kalimar, Bait, hiplop
Brian Skies [1] - kirroha
Konowa [3] - Majiffy, notscience, Desperado
Bait [1] - pieguyn
Desperado [1] - Konowa
SXTLHGaiden [1] - GuyInFreezer
hiplop [1] - Brian Skies

Not Voting [1]

- SXTLHGaiden

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch

.

Deadline is March 14, 2014, at 11:00 AM PST.
Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2014-03-14 13:00:00)

[FakeGod]

borkjerfkin replaces kirroha.

[borkjerfkin]

awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[notscience]

Bork

Your first test

Without reading anything but the votecount

Which wagon do you join

[borkjerfkin]

neither?

[notscience]

wrong you follow the flowchart

[borkjerfkin]

Unvote
Vote: Konowa

50% having the same reaction to #24 that Miffy did
30% flowchart
10% Counterwagoning Pie because he's probably town
10% Who couldn't even be bothered to grace our RVS wagon with a reaction and it was time to move on

Gut. Why is he scum?

Awkward series of posts.

The vote here is overexplained.

Majiffy buddying also seems out of place in this particular post (like I get early game flowchart jokes haha flowchart awesome [look at ns 132 for the correct version of this trope) but tonewise that isn't what this is; he's leveraging that into an actual reason here despite that 1) Majiffy's done really nothing to prove his alignment at this point in the game and 2) you're sheeping him off the analysis of one flimsy early game reaction test (which by the way PEOPLE SUCK AT ANALYZING GENERALLY but that's not really relevant to this post)

The "this is a counterwagon to pie" thing just gutwise pings badly to me. I'd probably be saying "btw pie is also probably town" and if I can't explain why, at least attempt to get pressure off him in that position...I certainly wouldn't be thinking that this makes my vote on pie's counterwagon any more likely to be on scum at this early point in the game. I only quoted the second post because I think the level of confidence that #45 seems to show in the pie read wouldn't make me jump to quoting it as a reason to counterwagon him. The mindset here just feels wrong.

VOTE: Desperado

[borkjerfkin]

Majiffy does look town via smell test through page 3.

[Desperado]

What happened on p3 that made Majiffy look town?

[borkjerfkin]

Weird that that's the one part of my post that you're willing to comment on.

Majiffy's found something that looks scummy (to him, I don't really agree with his wagon du jour) and is trying to kill the noise floating around it and waylay others from starting other wagons. That's about what I expect from his early town game.

[Majiffy]

I'll consider Desp.

I still want Konawa.

[Konowa]

Prod received. Will post tonight after work.

[borkjerfkin]

I'll consider Desp.

I still want Konawa.

I'm not hugely confident in your (or anyone's, it's not that it's you) ability to get that read right based on a reaction to a reaction test (pie's test having only moderate sarcastic overtones)

Seems like you've got really really wide error bars there.

But I feel like this happens every game with you and me; you develop a really early tunnel on someone, I am lukewarm about it, and then they flip whatever eventually.

[Majiffy]

Usually scum because Majiffy is always right.

[Majiffy]

But yes, that does seem to be a trend with us.

[borkjerfkin]

He has made little to no impact on the game and I think that's because he doesn't want to stir up the waters any more than he already did.

I really don't agree with this unless your reservation is that he lacks breadth.

[Majiffy]

My reservation is that he lacks anything.

[Majiffy]

Like show me a notable town post in his ISO.

[borkjerfkin]

First off, let's not move the goalposts here because 'game impact' is not even remotely synonymous with 'towntelling', which is not something I asserted he was doing; we're discussing the inverse, namely that you are asserting he is NOT having an impact on the game (and I am inferring that you are calling him scummy for that), which I agree might be scummy if that's what he were doing.

Broadly, he's pushing his few scumreads (desp, pie, possibly my slot?) and the loosest of loose meta on him suggests that this is his MO. There are plenty of slots 'not having an impact on the game' (hi gaiden) and I wouldn't put his in the top 3, especially considering the speed of this game (not very fast).

I'm not asserting your read is wrong, I'm asserting you're confbiasing and because of that I don't feel inclined to sheep you.

[Majiffy]

I'm calling him scummy for 24. I'm saying there's no reason to be renegging that read because of his lack of impact on the game, or any towntelling-attributes in his posts. Which, for what it's worth, would game-impacting. So your attempt to divide the two exclusively is kind of meh.

[borkjerfkin]

I'm calling him scummy for 24. I'm saying there's no reason to be renegging that read because of his lack of impact on the game, or any towntelling-attributes in his posts. Which, for what it's worth, would game-impacting. So your attempt to divide the two exclusively is kind of meh.

If I thought 24 was scummy, we'd be on the same page.

You can 'impact the game' (which is a bit loose of a definition anyway) without making your alignment really apparent. Sometimes scum have huge game presence. That's all I've been trying to say as to why I feel that I can see that his posts have game presence and still not necessarily have a good read on him yet.

Before this devolves into semantic wordplay: I'm not sold on that slot as scum at this point in the game.

[Majiffy]

If I thought 24 was scummy, we'd be on the same page.

No shit sherlock.

You can 'impact the game' (which is a bit loose of a definition anyway) without making your alignment really apparent.

Yeah but I was arguing from the other direction; a post that makes the alignment apparent is inherently game-impacting. Hence why I asked for townposting.

Before this devolves into semantic wordplay: I'm not sold on that slot as scum at this point in the game.

Not sold on scum =/= Town

So I don't know why we're even having this discussion. You seem to be approaching from a townread-mindset.

[borkjerfkin]

So I don't know why we're even having this discussion. You seem to be approaching from a townread-mindset.

Yeah, I did come off that way; gun to my head I'd probably call him town right now because we share the Desperado read.

It's more that I'm hoping that you and I can bounce shit off each other this game.