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Post Post #29650 (ISO) » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:30 pm

Post by MrZepher »

Saki's basically right. If you take ignite and go even then you wasted a summoner spell.
Barrier's going to do more for you later than ignite unless you're fighting drain/regen tanks.

Effective health op.
Kazekirimaru wrote:Attention all Master Yis

Stop backdooring my inhibs

love, Kaze
If you're in this position then your team needs to push out the lanes and group.
Then, if you see Yi in another lane pushing, you immediately engage and win a teamfight; send somebody to deal with Yi if he's still pushing while your team takes objectives. If he just goes to take the inhib while he has no minions then you go win a teamfight and end the game since he's fucking retarded.

If you're losing to split pushers your team is not doing one of three things:
1. Grouping as 5 to take objectives
2. Fighting when you have a numbers advantage
3. Being in a position where you can win a teamfight 5v4

If you're getting pressured in multiple lanes and your team isn't strong enough to do anything about it then the game is basically over (unless you do some over-the-top desperation play).
or something like that....
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Post Post #29651 (ISO) » Thu Mar 13, 2014 9:33 pm

Post by JasonWazza »

In post 29645, animorpherv1 wrote:So... Kassadin isn't any good any more. Like not at all - I've seen him lose all of the recent games he's been in.
I would gamble this is more him not seeing any play then not being good, his ban rate is too high for anyone to get a decent amount of games under there belt.
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Post Post #29652 (ISO) » Thu Mar 13, 2014 10:43 pm

Post by MrZepher »

No he's actually not any good.
he was literally nerfed into a bad place
it was an entirely intentional move from Riot to make him that way.

reading patch notes OP
or something like that....
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Post Post #29653 (ISO) » Thu Mar 13, 2014 11:01 pm

Post by JasonWazza »

Oh i didn't realize the nerf had happened already.
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Post Post #29654 (ISO) » Thu Mar 13, 2014 11:06 pm

Post by Saki »

So, team builder hits KR

and team builder's matchmaking is god-damn-awful

In my last game I was able to 1v5 and kill four as Irelia and that should not happen
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Post Post #29655 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 12:05 am

Post by MrZepher »

It has its own MMR right? So aren't you basically just pumbstomping?

or does it take your normal mmr...
or something like that....
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Post Post #29656 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 12:17 am

Post by RayFrost »

It definitely doesn't take normal mmr.

I got paired with a diamond, plat, gold, plat, silver team against all bronze / unranked in my first match. Definitely has its own mmr.
don't you feel silly now?
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Post Post #29657 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 12:21 am

Post by JasonWazza »

In post 29656, RayFrost wrote:Definitely has its own mmr.
Until my last match in it the ranks were pretty accurate, the last one was extremely fucked.
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Post Post #29658 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:06 am

Post by chesskid3 »

So taric is still in a damn good place despite nerfs
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Post Post #29659 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:40 am

Post by Iecerint »

Guys I jungled and it wasn't terrible.

Yay!
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Post Post #29660 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:57 am

Post by MrZepher »

In post 29658, chesskid3 wrote:So taric is still in a damn good place despite nerfs
He's not bad, he's just not a utility bomb like Leona or Thresh so he doesn't get picked.
Really good vs bully lanes. Doesn't fair as well against poke.
or something like that....
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Post Post #29661 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 2:03 am

Post by GreyICE »

In post 29648, DeathNote wrote:I just can't figure out how to play naut effectively. I may just have to give up on him.
He's probably my favorite jungler (note: not best jungler). Skill W first, pop it at 1:50 (it lasts 10 seconds). You need an okay leash for blue or it'll be a long jungle, but your AOE clear is enormous. Just don't bother with wight, 'tis a stupid camp.

Basically you either want to hard farm until 4 (W>E>W>Q) or 3 (W>E>Q) and then start ganking as much as possible. Nautilus ganks are TERRIFYING. Your general combo is Anchor - AA (roots them), when root falls off E. If you have R, you can use it in there, R just makes them die. They usually can't escape without flash or fairly ridiculous gap creators.

With Naut you want to gank high damage lanes. Bot and mid are usually your choices, top lane counter ganks can be good, but generally you just don't bring a pile of damage to a fight. Your utility is all in how insanely irritating you can be. I mean W means you can do some unexpected extra damage on autos, but it's nothing to write home about.

Mid-late game, you're transitioning into a peel/initiator. Your initiate is R. Try and land it on whoever looks like the biggest coward in the carries - you can chain it through the entire team. If you have anyone who leaps in, time your target with their leap (tell them in chat). I've seen a katarina evaporate a Jayce+Ashe before they landed from the depth charge.

After that, you are a bodyguard. You are zoning for the carries. Your AA roots, use that on any idiots who dive in (rooting a diver right near the ADC+APC can often just result in them dying). You can follow up the root by walking PAST the target, then use Q to drag them back away from the carries. Finally E can be used to allow kiting (they really should be out of gap closers).

Stats, prioritize CDR and the usual tank items. If you're getting kills or getting ahead, grab Locket or Face of the Mountain. Nautilus is impossible to build damage on, so those two items will give him some utility. Randuins, SV, obvious pickups. Don't overthink the "Bonus health" think on shield, it scales better on Armor/MR than on health, so don't go buying Warmogs.

If you can hit 40% CDR with him it's obviously amazing, but you usually need Locket or Face to do that, so you have to be ahead (screw you SV changes).
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Post Post #29662 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 2:25 am

Post by MrZepher »

witt's end isn't a bad buy on naut either if you're playing vs double APs
or something like that....
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Post Post #29663 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 2:26 am

Post by JasonWazza »

In post 29661, GreyICE wrote:If you have R, you can use it in there, R just makes them die. They usually can't escape without flash or fairly ridiculous gap creators.
Wait that actually has a range?

I thought it would chase forever.
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Post Post #29664 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 2:40 am

Post by MrZepher »

i think he means escape the initial cast. I don't think there are any targeted abilities that have a finite chase range.
or something like that....
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Post Post #29665 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 2:53 am

Post by GreyICE »

Well R does have a max range (it's long, but if you happen to depth charge them right as they're porting back, it will fade before it travels. I think it's like 2000 or 3000 or so). But it's rarely enough to kill them, so if they flash they can often be safely knocked up deep under turret (since it gives them additional time to run). If it's being used as an execute though, they're probably dead regardless, but that honestly rarely happens (and shouldn't! Gold on Naut is worse than gold on the laners)

Wits end is alright, but honestly I'd have to be rofl far ahead. I think Locket would do a lot more to ensure your team won teamfights.

Note: you have to skip your spirit stone item to buy Face. I think Ancient Golem sucks post-nerf, but I haven't fucked around with Naut enough to figure out what to do with him this patch. They killed Ancient Golem and Mobi boots, which were his two cores.
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Post Post #29666 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:05 am

Post by vezokpiraka »

In post 29650, MrZepher wrote:
Kazekirimaru wrote:Attention all Master Yis

Stop backdooring my inhibs

love, Kaze
If you're in this position then your team needs to push out the lanes and group.
Then, if you see Yi in another lane pushing, you immediately engage and win a teamfight; send somebody to deal with Yi if he's still pushing while your team takes objectives. If he just goes to take the inhib while he has no minions then you go win a teamfight and end the game since he's fucking retarded.

If you're losing to split pushers your team is not doing one of three things:
1. Grouping as 5 to take objectives
2. Fighting when you have a numbers advantage
3. Being in a position where you can win a teamfight 5v4

If you're getting pressured in multiple lanes and your team isn't strong enough to do anything about it then the game is basically over (unless you do some over-the-top desperation play).
What can I do if 3. happens? What is the best way to go about it?
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Post Post #29667 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:26 am

Post by RayFrost »

Be so fed that you walk up to yi and he screams like a little girl and runs.

Now split push because you're the biggest motherfucker in the game.

Win.
don't you feel silly now?
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Post Post #29668 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:33 am

Post by MrZepher »

I'm not digging Heroes of the Storm.

it doesn't matter how much better you are than anybody else in the game because there's no individual snowballing. You snowball as a team or not at all.
champions are randomly grouped together based on a match rating system that you can't see. You pick your champion before you queue so there's no champ select phase.
there are no items at all. You can't really make up for what your champion is bad at or make him more effective at what he's good at.
Teams level up together. Exp is split globally across your whole team, so one person who has no idea what they're doing and losing hard means the whole team loses.

Winning requires that everyone understands the most optimal ways of achieving objectives, which because there are multiple game modes won't happen for awhile.
I also don't like that you don't know what map you're queueing into. You're thrown into a random team on a random map w/ random map objectives.
Also if there aren't enough people in queue (which happens a lot because lol Alpha test phase) the game replaces player slots with AI bots. If Awesomenauts is any indication of how awful a mechanic this is I probably won't play HotS (heart of the swarm? really blizzard?) just based on this.

The game's in alpha but there are some overall design decisions that i straight up don't agree with. I don't think people who want a skillbased experience will enjoy the game very much.
Silver/bronze players who want an excuse to blame their team are going to love the fuck out of this game though.
vezokpiraka wrote:What can I do if 3. happens? What is the best way to go about it?
Surrender.

But seriously, there are a bunch of reasons why that could be an issue. It's usually pretty obvious what the problem is if that's what's happening.
If the enemy team is just stronger then you need more defensive items on your team or you need to go for picks (ward the fuck out of everything and try to catch one person out).
or something like that....
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Post Post #29669 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 5:51 am

Post by vezokpiraka »

I just had three AFK in ranked. My duo was the only one not AFK.
I want to lay down and cry/
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Post Post #29670 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 7:05 am

Post by Ser Arthur Dayne »

So... anyone have a good current build for eve?

I'm currently going Elder Lizard -> Botrk -> Sunfire <-> Banshee's -> Some random item if the game gets that far, with Merc boots.
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Post Post #29671 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 7:07 am

Post by AngryPidgeon »

My company has a team that plays in this corporate league. They added me on as top recently (certainly not my best role, but eh) so I've been practicing lots of random top champs in our ranked 5s practice games.

Holy crap, Trundle is pretty op. Apparently his Q works on turrets now (I thought it didnt used to?). He shreds turrets, sustains pretty well, and last hits like a boss.
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Post Post #29672 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 7:53 am

Post by quadz08 »

trundle pretty gud
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Post Post #29673 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 8:01 am

Post by mykonian »

In post 29670, Ser Arthur Dayne wrote:So... anyone have a good current build for eve?

I'm currently going Elder Lizard -> Botrk -> Sunfire <-> Banshee's -> Some random item if the game gets that far, with Merc boots.
aaaaaah

ok, elder lizard is a choice. Nothing particulary wrong with that, at that point you are still thriving off your high base damage. Building a full on botrk from the jungle on a innately squishy champ is simply not going to do. If you are winning hard, you might build a cutlass for the slow, but that's already awkward. It's a luxury item, lifesteal doesn't do a thing for you. People have heard about "botrk eve" and think they have to build it. When it got build, it got build
after
BV and randuins were either half build up or completed, just to increase escapability, sticking power and a little bit of burst. But it's not your core, at all.

Don't build sunfire. It's a midgame item, esspecially not that late. It doesn't do anything special for eve either. The armor item you want is randuins. You are already diving into their team initiating with your ult, might as slow them all again and get their attackspeed shot. You are getting focussed as well, so your passive gets in for some work. This is what makes tank eve as strong, the simple fact that randuins is a beast of an item if you are in their team. Banshee veil is your item of choice, it has nice interaction with your stealth and it's nice to eat the first burst that's coming onto you when you initiate on your shield. Basically you are making an early game champ useful by making it a projectile for your lategame god item (randuins).

Diamondprox's philosophy seems to be to extend his early game dominance via mid tier efficient items. Hexdrinker, armguard, cowl, wardens. They are cheap, they give clean stats that you can use, they are efficient. Basically, you want things that give armor, mr, health, ad, ap, but no pen or stuff like that. Cdr isn't the best, spellvamp-lifesteal are probably useless, you don't want mana or mana regen, that's easy enough to manage. Otherwise, have some common sense.
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Post Post #29674 (ISO) » Fri Mar 14, 2014 5:52 pm

Post by DeathNote »

Hey, I can't log into league and I can't even see their web page. Anyone else having problems or just me?
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