NY 172: Another Large Normal (GAME OVER)

[Mister Rogers]

LOL. Man I want to so bad. Follow you there? Not so much.

You should be able to make your decisions on who to vote independently of what I might or mightn't do. Like I said anyway, if there's no sliver of doubt in your mind that I'm scum, you should be selling my scum-virtues to everyone else and asking them to vote me. I don't see that.

So you're in a position where you must doubt that one of Luca or I is scum, because if we're both scum, then you shouldn't have a problem helping me bus my buddy. Are you hesitating because you called everyone voting lurkers scum, so now that you're scum reading Luca you can't vote him because you know you'll be called a hypocrite for it?

Well since you are pushing this point, no I am hesitating because (and these are the thought processes that I am trying to disentangle atm) even though Luca is scum central and everything in me says lynch him immediately, he is also a lurker and I am simply wondering if the resulting wagon will be poor upon his death. He is in my scum list, I totally want to lynch him and right now BUT can we do better? The thought occurs to me that Luca might get sorted and we can focus elsewhere today.

Its true. I need someone to help me think that through. Because if we just base it on actions in-thread and think of nothing else, Luca needs speed lynching and I would of been on that wagon ahead of you (in this case).

@Talah: Why isn't Anx scum?

It may surprise you to know that I don't have a strong opinion one way or the other on 4nx. I voted him because I like Admiral for town, and LOL NO WAGONS

Well this is at least consistent with your previously stated game plan BUT why don't you care either way? I HET lynching town D1.

Why do we still have no wagons forming.

You were on a pretty nice sized wagon. Why did you just weaken it?

We need to get some *viable* wagons happening. It seems like there might be some consensus here.

I'm just going to be honest, that is exactly how I think as scum; I'm looking for the most lynchable target and I weigh the opinions of all the players to find consensus so I know who to lynch.

See as town, I'm like who is the scummiest player, THE VERY SCUMMIEST that I can be voting for AND THEN, if it is even appropriate to consider consensus, do I consider that.

Your mindset doesn't seem to be what I would consider town at all. It would fit better to explain someone that wants to get back to their scum Q/T instead.

Why don't you mention anything about who is scummier?

Dang Talah are you even scum hunting??

Not as much as I'd like to be. Quite a bit of my time has been spent trying to extricate myself from shitty pushes.

I HET this excuse. Do you see me caving under Nero pressure? Ok, can you explain your time pressure issues in ANY WAY?

I'm not sure if you're aware that you having three times the amount of posts than Zdenek, the next top poster, tends to make things incredibly hard to find a natural flow to. Especially when you appear to believe you're the "leader" and (possibly depending on your alignment) being very "pro-town" about it too.

I am not "the leader" except of myself. Everyone is the leader. Everyone has a keyboard and is logged into the forum.

You are blaming my posting volume on your lack of scum hunting?? Or no its all the attacks against you.

You need to be well dead long before we get anywhere near a lylo situation. For the record.

DANGIT. This takes the cake. NOW you're the EXPERT PLAYER judging who needs to be in LYLO. You can't scum hunt worth a dime. You whine about only having 8 games. You float from wagon to wagon without a care. You blame everyone and everything you possibly can. But you're an expert.

Seriously you need to check Wiki Rules 1-3 because you fit all of them to a T.

Follow you to Luca? No way.

[Mister Rogers]

I've never been so lost in a game of Mafia.

This is what we need in LYLO?

The truth is, I think Talah is more than competent. That's why this post and all the excuse making makes him scum. The cog-dis is just too much.

[Damon_Gant]

LOOK HOW MUCH FUN WE'RE HAVING!!!

Haha that is funny. You are coming across as town to me, as is Pisskop, so I will go ahead and UNVOTE: Pisskop

VOTE: 4nxi3ty

This seriously needs lynching. This is the best contribution he could come up with? Not to mention he said he wouldn't post reads until giving the thread his full attention. This does not look like the post of someone who has given the thread 15 minutes.

Snork is initially looking town in bjc's slot - but I'm never too keen to call someone town when almost literally every read they have is opposite to mine. That just worries me slightly.

[talah]

LOL. Man I want to so bad. Follow you there? Not so much.

You should be able to make your decisions on who to vote independently of what I might or mightn't do. Like I said anyway, if there's no sliver of doubt in your mind that I'm scum, you should be selling my scum-virtues to everyone else and asking them to vote me. I don't see that.

So you're in a position where you must doubt that one of Luca or I is scum, because if we're both scum, then you shouldn't have a problem helping me bus my buddy. Are you hesitating because you called everyone voting lurkers scum, so now that you're scum reading Luca you can't vote him because you know you'll be called a hypocrite for it?

Well since you are pushing this point, no I am hesitating because (and these are the thought processes that I am trying to disentangle atm) even though Luca is scum central and everything in me says lynch him immediately, he is also a lurker and I am simply wondering if the resulting wagon will be poor upon his death. He is in my scum list, I totally want to lynch him and right now BUT can we do better? The thought occurs to me that Luca might get sorted and we can focus elsewhere today.

Its true. I need someone to help me think that through. Because if we just base it on actions in-thread and think of nothing else, Luca needs speed lynching and I would of been on that wagon ahead of you (in this case).

What do you think of Luca's jump onto the 4nx wagon?

@Talah: Why isn't Anx scum?

It may surprise you to know that I don't have a strong opinion one way or the other on 4nx. I voted him because I like Admiral for town, and LOL NO WAGONS

Well this is at least consistent with your previously stated game plan BUT why don't you care either way? I HET lynching town D1.

I didn't say I don't care either way. I said I don't have a strong opinion one way or another on 4nx('s alignment).

Why do we still have no wagons forming.

You were on a pretty nice sized wagon. Why did you just weaken it?

We need to get some *viable* wagons happening. It seems like there might be some consensus here.

I'm just going to be honest, that is exactly how I think as scum; I'm looking for the most lynchable target and I weigh the opinions of all the players to find consensus so I know who to lynch.

See as town, I'm like who is the scummiest player, THE VERY SCUMMIEST that I can be voting for AND THEN, if it is even appropriate to consider consensus, do I consider that.

Your mindset doesn't seem to be what I would consider town at all. It would fit better to explain someone that wants to get back to their scum Q/T instead.

Why don't you mention anything about who is scummier?

Go read Hito's thread on compromising as town in MD.

Dang Talah are you even scum hunting??

Not as much as I'd like to be. Quite a bit of my time has been spent trying to extricate myself from shitty pushes.

I HET this excuse. Do you see me caving under Nero pressure? Ok, can you explain your time pressure issues in ANY WAY?

Do you really want me to go into RL shit to "excuse" myself? Fine. Windows XP goes end of life April 8 and I still have about 120 clients to migrate in the next couple of weeks.

I'm not sure if you're aware that you having three times the amount of posts than Zdenek, the next top poster, tends to make things incredibly hard to find a natural flow to. Especially when you appear to believe you're the "leader" and (possibly depending on your alignment) being very "pro-town" about it too.

I am not "the leader" except of myself. Everyone is the leader. Everyone has a keyboard and is logged into the forum.

You are blaming my posting volume on your lack of scum hunting?? Or no its all the attacks against you.

I'm saying your posting volume is jamming the thread with useless dross which you're not even doing anything sensible with.

You need to be well dead long before we get anywhere near a lylo situation. For the record.

DANGIT. This takes the cake. NOW you're the EXPERT PLAYER judging who needs to be in LYLO. You can't scum hunt worth a dime. You whine about only having 8 games. You float from wagon to wagon without a care. You blame everyone and everything you possibly can. But you're an expert.

Seriously you need to check Wiki Rules 1-3 because you fit all of them to a T.

Follow you to Luca? No way.

What I know about you, is that you have a scumread on me which is incorrect, and you won't vote your own scumread Luca, because another of your scumreads (me) is calling Luca scum. Among other things.

So yeah if you're town I don't want you in a position where you have sole responsibility for any decision in this game.

[Mister Rogers]

What do you think of Luca's jump onto the 4nx wagon?

Well since everything is out in the open. I think its an unforgivable offense.

Go read Hito's thread on compromising as town in MD.

Either link or tell me what it says. I prefer you tell me.

I'm saying your posting volume is jamming the thread with useless dross which you're not even doing anything sensible with.

Link my wiki now and read Rule #1. Hopefully you won't be locked in there for an eternity.

What I know about you, is that you have a scumread on me which is incorrect, and you won't vote your own scumread Luca, because another of your scumreads (me) is calling Luca scum. Among other things.

I never said that. Luca AND you can both be scum, a reduced chance of course, but my hesitating to vote Luca has nothing to do with you voting him and I already explained that but you either didn't read it or wish not to acknowledge it.

I have a similar unsubstantiated attack for you: I think you have been wagon hopping to save your skin and since your game play is so lackluster and filled with excuses, you are doing it to save your scum hide.

So yeah if you're town I don't want you in a position where you have sole responsibility for any decision in this game.

So ya, if you're town you have a funny way of showing it; please read Rule #2 (if you are able to get out of Rule #1) and ya you need to hang.

[Mister Rogers]

Ya, "I'm town because I know it even though my play doesn't show it and even so, you are a danger to the universe".

Gotta love that one.

[talah]

Mate, if you have a wiki with opinions it's just as likely as filled with bullshit as your posting in this game.

You have my /ignore button for the remainder of this game unless you start making some sense.

Oh - and seeing you're having a whole lot of trouble getting *other* folks to want to vote me, but rather are just engaging in pointless back-and-forth, half concessions and pandering to folks who are scumhunting on you, here, have this:

UNVOTE: Luca
VOTE: talah

(My will lynch/might lynch list stands)

I'll discuss the situational merits of this strategy with others, but I'm not responding to another fucking thing you post, and I'm making it my purpose in this game to make sure that you get vigged or lynched before - let's say Day 3, if I happen to be around long enough.

Goodnight, and sweet dreams.

[Mister Rogers]

OMGOSH. HEADDESK.

I freaking give up.

Talah learn how to play Mafia.

Let me guess: "Since I'm town you lynch me and when I flip town you lynch Rogers."

Now I'm an oracle.

[Mister Rogers]

Mate, if you have a wiki with opinions it's just as likely as filled with bullshit as your posting in this game.

If I post BS, you need to point it out but seeing as you haven't... (WELP).

Not only that but you have Z-E-R-O scum hunting at all period.

You dare criticize me for posting? Die scum.

Oh - and seeing you're having a whole lot of trouble getting *other* folks to want to vote me, but rather are just engaging in pointless back-and-forth, half concessions and pandering to folks who are scumhunting on you, here, have this:

If I am having trouble then there is no problem right? I mean no pressure, this Bert alt is derp voting me, big freaking deal. I'm gonna catch me some scum because I'm a quality player not a derp like Bert-alt over there.

But your response? Go into orbit and self-vote.

More cog-dis. More out of place AtE.

Wanna see the king of cog-dis?

I'm making it my purpose in this game to make sure that you get vigged or lynched before - let's say Day 3, if

I

happen to be around long enough.

Somebody is planning on this self-vote to keep him around for days to come. Sure he throws in "if I'm around" at the end but his intent is clear.

Also, has site meta changed? Do people just self-vote all the time now as a defense?

[talah]

@Town:

Talah learn how to play Mafia.

Let me guess: "Since I'm town you lynch me and when I flip town you lynch Rogers."

See there? Rogers just acknowledged that I'm town, or could be - and yet he's voting me and not pushing for my lynch, over his 5-6 scumreads which he claims everyone should have, and that he's also not pushing.

He's expressing doubt that I'm scum - whereas Luca is almost a shoo-in for scum, were it not for the fact that I was voting Luca. But he won't VOTE Luca, his top scumread.

What's with that? You don't tell SCUM to learn to play mafia when they're in practically no danger of being lynched, do you? You don't NOT vote your scumreads based on unflipped associative tells, do you?

OMGOSH. HEADDESK.

I freaking give up.

But.. What's there to give up on? Is Rogers trying to prove I'm scum to myself? Is he trying to educate me to make me a better player? What exactly is Rogers "giving up" on?

It makes no sense if Rodgers believes I'm scum.

[RachMarie]

Talah take that vote off yourself that is just awful self voting

[Mister Rogers]

I always go toe to toe with scummy play.

Lock In Vote: Talah

[Mister Rogers]

@Town:

Talah learn how to play Mafia.

Let me guess: "Since I'm town you lynch me and when I flip town you lynch Rogers."

See there? Rogers just acknowledged that I'm town

I acknowledged what your argument will be. It has nothing to do with your alignment. Your alignment has been determined by the way you've played.

and yet he's voting me and not pushing for my lynch

Don't make me quote my posts. I have pushed your lynch and it is more than apparent that I have a case on you in my posting.

over his 5-6 scumreads which he claims everyone should have, and that he's also not pushing.

That also is a lie. Check my ISO. Look at DG. Look at Matt. Ok Anx I have been ignoring but ya I have posted my views clearly and I have posted to him begging for more content. Luca cannot be pushed but I have been more than clear.

He's expressing doubt that I'm scum - whereas Luca is almost a shoo-in for scum, were it not for the fact that I was voting Luca. But he won't VOTE Luca, his top scumread.

I have clearly expressed my opinions on Luca and am awaiting input from people on my thoughts. I think we can do better than Luca and I think you're clearly it.

What's with that? You don't tell SCUM to learn to play mafia when they're in practically no danger of being lynched, do you?

Bad null play is not alignment indicative. Its just bad null play.

You vote your scumreads based on unflipped associative tells, don't you?

Unflipped? No I vote my scum reads based on 1) The chances of them being scum (primary), 2) The benefits to town from their lynch (secondary if applicable).

I personally like that you are a higher tier of scum than Luca and would be of more benefit to lynch.

OMGOSH. HEADDESK.

I freaking give up.

But.. What's there to give up on? Is Rogers trying to prove I'm scum to myself? Is he trying to educate me to make me a better player? What exactly is Rogers "giving up" on?

I HET bad Mafia play. Bad null play is still bad play.

It makes no sense if Rodgers believes I'm scum.

My views on your alignment have nothing to do with you self-voting. That's between you and the mirror.

[Mister Rogers]

Mastin is also un-pushable.

[Mister Rogers]

DISCLAIMER: I have found Bert to be a somewhat skilled player but I find his play to be passive and fluffy. So no offense to Bert, just using information in-thread.

[talah]

@Town:

Mate, if you have a wiki with opinions it's just as likely as filled with bullshit as your posting in this game.

If I post BS, you need to point it out but seeing as you haven't... (WELP).

Not only that but you have Z-E-R-O scum hunting at all period.

You dare criticize me for posting? Die scum.

What's this? More dross posting from Rogers? Fake rage at being criticised for having THREE TIMES the amount of posts as the next most prolific poster? More engagement and pointless arguing with his "scum read"?

Rogers is posting like he STILL NEEDS TO SORT ME, not like he already has me pegged for scum and wants others to help him lynch me.

Oh - and seeing you're having a whole lot of trouble getting *other* folks to want to vote me, but rather are just engaging in pointless back-and-forth, half concessions and pandering to folks who are scumhunting on you, here, have this:

If I am having trouble then there is no problem right? I mean no pressure, this Bert alt is derp voting me, big freaking deal. I'm gonna catch me some scum because I'm a quality player not a derp like Bert-alt over there.

But your response? Go into orbit and self-vote.

More cog-dis. More out of place AtE.

Hmm - I'm having trouble deciphering Roger's point here. Surely HE'S the Bert alt. Why would he need to ASSERT that he's a quality player? Isn't that a judgement that OTHERS need to make?

And let's all reflect for a moment on just what "cog-dis" means.
Well, it's cognitive dissonance, of course, but just what does it mean right here?

Usually when people are called out for cognitive dissonance, it means that they were presenting an opinion, which doesn't match with another opinion they've expressed.

But where's the cognitive dissonance here? I say there is none. I say Rogers is using it as a buzz-word which is easily digested and entirely unsubstantiated, because any discredit is better than needing to push a case on me. If Rogers felt like cognitive dissonance was at play, surely it would be easy for him to be explicit about what the dissonance IS.

Wanna see the king of cog-dis?

I'm making it my purpose in this game to make sure that you get vigged or lynched before - let's say Day 3, if

I

happen to be around long enough.

Somebody is planning on this self-vote to keep him around for days to come. Sure he throws in "if I'm around" at the end but his intent is clear.

Also, has site meta changed? Do people just self-vote all the time now as a defense?

I'm calling this piece "Rogers Misrepresents (feat. Ignoring Context)"

Rodgers plainly states that his scumread (me) is exhibiting buzzword "cog-dis", by self-voting and saying he might be around longer than -well- RIGHT NOW really, since that's an unspecified variable on Rogers part.

But Rogers IGNORES the fact that this same scumread (me) ALSO specifies "if" he's around - also specifies he will "discuss this situational strategy with others", and also specifies that his "Will lynch/Might Lych" hasn't changed.

So if Rogers' scumread (me) isn't ACTUALLY planning on being on his own wagon at the end of the day - where's the cognitive dissonance, and why does Rogers ignore context entirely in an effort to produce an example of it?

No, my esteemed friends, this is an example of Scum at its most mediocre, or Town at its worst. Literally the only pro-town behaviour that Rogers has displayed, is posting in droves and asking questions. If you look any deeper than that, Rogers is NOT ACTUALLY DOING ANYTHING with the ANSWERS TO HIS QUESTIONS except, superficially coming to conclusions. There is no true town motivation to the volume of posts being made by Rogers.

[talah]

Talah take that vote off yourself that is just awful self voting :facepalm:

Maybe later. We don't have enough information right now.

[RachMarie]

And how exactly is your self vote going to provide more info to town?



waiting........

[Snork]

Well the other two points are you commenting about my take on matt and not liking my call on AP.

I was wondering about your "fuck you -ish" attitude statement, actually. And you used that to claim you had a "Townish" read on bjc for displaying it. I just found that odd.

bjc seems like a 'fuck you' guy. In addition to what I've already said. Until he posts something that looks scummy to me - I have him town leaning.

Might lynch:
Snork

[talah]

And how exactly is your self vote going to provide more info to town?



waiting........

Usually people give reasons when they join wagons, and as the wagon size increases it becomes more attractive to scum who want to mislynch. I think the largest wagon we've had so far has been 4 votes. If I get wagonned up higher than that then at least we have some info on who joined the wagon and why.

[Snork]

Here you go:

VOTE: Talah

[talah]

Well the other two points are you commenting about my take on matt and not liking my call on AP.

I was wondering about your "fuck you -ish" attitude statement, actually. And you used that to claim you had a "Townish" read on bjc for displaying it. I just found that odd.

bjc seems like a 'fuck you' guy. In addition to what I've already said. Until he posts something that looks scummy to me - I have him town leaning.

Might lynch:
Snork

Yeah actually I find your reads repulsive.
*coughAHEM* I mean, welcome to the thread.

[talah]

Here you go:

VOTE: Talah

And the reason I'm scum?

[Snork]

- Defending people without reason
- Attacking people for attacking other people you aren't even town reading
- "I'm so lost!" followed by "You fucks obviously need time to work things out".
- Illogical reversals without explanation

Should I continue? I can get quotes if you like.

[Snork]

You might find my reads repulsive because I have your buddies in the doghouse. So, your comment is really rather inconsequential.