Tales of You (Abyss Neighborhood)

[Just Sheep Us]

I just bolded the scum claim in-thread.

[Just Sheep Us]

This game is giving me a fucking aneurysm.

[CarbonFiber]

The things that Rancid are doing aren't consistent.

They say "lynch me!" and "I want to be lynched" hoping for sympathy while doing everything they can to avoid a lynch. Townies try to avoid mislynches all the time but the way Rancid is going about it feels subtle, not blatant. If they so desperately don't want to be lynched, they would tell players not to lynch them. I remember NY169 where I got run up D1 and told everyone that lynching me is going to be detrimental, that I am town, and that they should unvote. Because I didn't want to be lynched.

It is possible that Rancid do want to be lynched. In that case, nothing is needed other than to not post and wait for others to lynch them.

This passive-aggressive emotional blackmail and self-vote and rage seems fake to me and definitely within the capabilities of Muffin and Nati as scum. Asking to be lynched while trying to avoid it feels like theatrics.

Townies may self-vote. Bad, newb townies do it. Not town-Muffin and town-Nati.

[Kagura]

This passive-aggressive emotional blackmail and self-vote and rage seems fake to me and definitely within the capabilities of Muffin and Nati as scum. Asking to be lynched while trying to avoid it feels like theatrics.

Townies may self-vote. Bad, newb townies do it. Not town-Muffin and town-Nati.

Goddammit.

I don't know what to do.

[CarbonFiber]

I think you'll figure it out

But I really want to explain why I have such a hard town read on Pere and think he is town. Gimme a bit to present it so you can evaluate it and make your choice.

[CarbonFiber]

I need to head out right now but will be back in a couple hours.

[Kagura]

But I really want to explain why I have such a hard town read on Pere and think he is town. Gimme a bit to present it so you can evaluate it and make your choice.

Please please do this ASAP.

[CarbonFiber]

Okay, so in the first paragraph, let's look at it from a bird's eye view of the wagon on him and how other people interacted with him. In the next one, look at PV's actual posts and play itself.

PV shows a lot of VI behavior that can be considered scummy by town. He is going to be a compromise lynch. Always has been. Just because PV wasn't wagoned early doesn't mean that he isn't the easiest lynch to push. Nearly everyone has some sort of concerns about PV basically making him the default lynch for the day. If a player is unable to push the wagon they want, they are likely to change their vote to PV. I think that scum are tiptoeing around voting him not because they don't want to bus him but because they want the suspicion to build up and for town to start wondering why no one is voting the universal scumread. Contrast with attacking an easy target directly and being called out for it. Notice AngryPidgeon's push on PV. After all the arguments with Mastin and Kagura, he starts asking around for who he will compromise on. Because neither Mastin nor Kagura are easy targets that will be lynched, yet good to make a ton of noise with, citing bullshit, nitpicky, semantic arguments, and when the time comes to settle on a lynch, a low-activity player like PV is perfect. The current gamestate with a PV wagon and everyone happily defaulting to it wouldn't be the gamestate if Pidgeon had decided to attack PV directly.

Onto PV's actual posts. While he flew under the radar, he has been far from useless this game. He's made no less than 86 posts, more than quite a few other players. He provides an initial reads list in Post 1035 that is unconventional and goes against the grain of popular opinion. While some of his reads are harder to follow than others, I see them coming far more likely from an uninformed town POV than something scum would fake to fit in. I like his questioning of the Cupcake read in Post 1039 because it is something that BRO never explained in detail in the thread. His response to pressure in Post 1069 was natural and easygoing and he never seemed overly bothered by Breakfast pushing him. Neither was he worried about Kagura and his response in Post 1589 is calm, level-headed and inquisitive. He also presses AngryPidgeon for responses to his questions and follows up on anything that was unanswered as in Post 1770 showing that he was scanning the thread very closely. Healso follows up on his question to Kagura in Post 1770 showing a close attention to detail and it shows that he is not just bullshitting random questions but meticulously following up on everything he is doing. He openly invites Titan to engage and question him in Post 1773 unafraid of being grilled. I doubt scum-PV would asked to be put under the spotlight but it makes sense from town who are good at scumhunting based off of how other people question them.

His questioning of MastinSSK in Post 1780 picks up on a lot of things that are vague and unexplained. Mastin regardless of affiliation has a tendency to be vague and PV's determination to get to the bottom of it as opposed to skim through betrays his underlying town motivation. PV saying that Mastin and I could be scum together in Post 1788 is such a rabbit hole but very, very reminiscent of the kind of tinfoil theories that are so much more likely to come from paranoid town. Him accurately pointing out that the usefulness of my argument is limited shows a very keen grasp of the gamestate. My explanation for town-DV came at a point when the wagon was dying a little but I posted it anyways because I was working on it for a while, but PV picked up on the timing of it to use it for further analysis. His Post 1800 is an absolute classic. Bork, did you see how well he tracked down my read on Cupcake to show where I was making leaps and explained nothing? It is because of the discussions in this neighborhood that refined my Cupcake read. I didn't have a perfect trajectory for it in thread. This is the kind of incredibly potentially alignment-revealing things that PV is picking up. He isn't posting a ton of words in the thread but look at the detail of his thoughts and they could only come if he is putting a LOT of behind-the-scenes work to capture the trail of how I am reading Cupcake. I've stopped here for his ISO read because you wanted it ASAP but continue reading his ISO beyond this post and you'll see too that the level of detail, and how attentively he is reading the thread makes so much sense from town even if he is not the best with words and looks "scummy" and lurkish and useless because he really isn't.

Finally add in that Rancid has interacted with far more slots in the game than PV has and a lot of players have stronger opinions about Rancid's alignment than they do PV's (for instance, barely anyone besides me and Beli has called PV town) and the fact that they are constantly, constantly spewing insults, complaining and burying the thread with such pointless arguments that it makes it hard to read, I think they are a better lynch than PV who is giving it the best shot he can and whose underlying town motivations are apparent upon looking closely. PV lynch is bad even as a utility lynch because we don't get anything out of it whereas a Rancid townflip potentially clears Mastin with their scumflip clearing several players in the game.

[CarbonFiber]

@ CABD, can I post this case in the thread?

It is not really different from a reads-list or stuff like that.

[Yggdra Union]

lol I just trolled the shit out of AP

I couldn't resist ~

[CarbonFiber]

Are you going to be here around deadline? I think it is tonight. I'll be here and I want to make absolutely sure, that if Rancid isn't getting lynched today we lynch one of Mastin or AP as opposed to a random lurker town.

[Yggdra Union]

when is it? I should be but remind me when it is again

[CarbonFiber]

In 6 hours 35 minutes from now.

[CarbonFiber]

Should I post my PV case in thread in Cabd allows it?

[Yggdra Union]

how sure are you of ffery town btw?

bc I keep having this feeling that this is literally the exact same shit as NY167 and ffery, RBD, AP, and mastin all rolled scum. ffery keeps looking for excuses to talk herself out of the mastin read and I wasn't following closely enough to pick up any obvtown thing ffery might have done by now

and yeah I think posting the PV case is a good idea. might bea good idea to wait for input from everyone else bork but idk there's not much time left

[Yggdra Union]

holy fuck how did bork wind up in that last sentence

[CarbonFiber]

Yeah, I'll wait for Cabd to give me permission.

I made it because I was so sure and Bork wanted me to articulate that whole PV-town feeling in words and I had no idea it would be that long.

Regarding ffery, I know it is frustrating that she won't listen but the sort of thing hapenned in Dark Age of the Law though, didn't it? Everyone was telling her to lynch Bertkerberos and Candle Jack and she sort of defended them.

[CarbonFiber]

So, yeah, I think the way she approached some of her reads feel super town.

Who is your pick for the scumteam.

[Yggdra Union]

RBD
mastinssk
AP
orci?

idk who a good pick for 4th scum is right now

[CarbonFiber]

It is Clyton. Clyton is scum.

He said before that he won't check back in before deadline. I KNEW HE WOULD in order to unvote RBD. He did.

[Yggdra Union]

holy fucking shit

[CarbonFiber]

Like he said when he was voting that he wouldn't check back in so I thought of the possibility that he was town but if he did, I would know for certain that he was only building the illusion of a wagon so that he and RBD could dismantle it later.

Nati unvoted. Then he did. Just like I figured.

[Yggdra Union]

wait do you think scum mastin derails the scum RBD lynch onto scum Clyton?

I guess I could see it. makes sense she'd try to build a lot of cred on a scum lynch and then coast off it

[CarbonFiber]

No, Mastin is trying to lynch PV, isn't he?

[Yggdra Union]

she brought Clyton up as an option in that fake VCA she did. last time she did a power play like this (AOT) she pushed it onto 3 townies