Tales of You (Abyss Neighborhood)

[GuyInFreezer]

Blame game is so not cool pie

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

It's like, ffery's just sitting peripheral to the game, only taking slight pokes in that are surface-level "pro-town" things to say, and not the actual dirty work needed to progress a town win con.

AP's vote-hopping is making me nervous about him, especially his willingness to jump on an obvious counter wagon to scum.

But her interactions with Rancid make absolutely no sense as scum-scum, agree? I mean, Rancid were practically begging Breakfast to save them.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

I'm here -- I am kinda blocking this game out because I'm really fucking irritated to the point where it was causing me physical distress on Monday

...and there are SIXTEEN PAGES since I posted last and I'm sure I'm not going to want to read it.

I'll try to catch up over lunch but if it's more mastin vs AP crap I'm seriously going to skip it all. It is adding fucking NOTHING.

@F-16 - I've been trying to get ahold of Nacho all week - he's just literally AWOL during the week. I have him on Skype and gchat and he's usually logged onto there via mobile devices but doesn't respond. I've been posting in the hydra QT too but nothing from him there either.

Why are you sure PV is town? I feel like people are really tiptoeing around voting him.

This post looks super-town though and makes a lot of sense.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Also Bork, get the heck off of the scum designated mislynch.

Can you please stop being hyperbolic?

I think mastin is town,

I'm probably willing to compromise on RBD but it's more to get rid of their anti-town sucking the game into a black hole of vitriol than anything.

I really don't think muffin is willing to pull this shit as scum (capable, maybe, but this is a level of frustration that I could never possibly show as anything but town)

Make your case on town PV to me because that's looking to me like a better option than either RBD or (especially) mastin

I'm sorry if that puts me into your list of shitfuck players or whatever but I am not seeing what you're seeing.

I agree with this and I think it is objectively true. That's partly why Nacho coming in to take the opposite viewpoint bugged me but I can see that coming from town if I could get into his thought process.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

So, re-reading again, everything that Bork is posting makes sense so I have to accept that Nacho actually posted what he did.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Nacho, read Muffin's wall in Post 1578 and tell me what you see. I think there are some town posts there but also, positionally, most of his posts devolve into IAWTP whenever someone he is townreading makes a post like Mastin. The positional nature of his reads is evident from that as is his lack of objectivity. He also agrees with posts that already support the viewpoint that he is trying to push.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Sorry for spamming but this is important. Just finished reading through Rancid's ISO since the mega post and it is a chore to get past.

I can see why people are thinking Rancid are town. Their frustration looks genuine on a first glance. The only thing I don't like is that it is pretty much directed at whoever tunnels them. The one thing all of Tammy, Fox-Hound, Bro-Desp, and me have in common is that one point or another, we pushed Rancid as scum. Their scumreads (like PV) are basically easy targets.

Anyways, next phase I intend to let the thread breathe and focus on reconnecting with the town. If they are town (which is unlikely), then not pushing them will help them be town. If they are scum, town needs to come to that conclusion on their own.

[pieguyn]

what's IAWTP

btw I think it's a possibility that RBD is just miseading mastin. I still think RBD and mastin are both scum but if anyone can fool ppl like that I'd expect it to be mastin and we shouldn't discount mastin scum just bc of RBD's read on them

[Nachomamma8]

Okay, here's my problem, Nacho:

I am scumreading MastinSSK, Rancid, and AP.

Pieguyn, BRO-Desp and I spent a literal fuckton of time trying to get ANY one of them lynched. I literally wrote the number of town players who would vote for ANY scum lynch and try to make it happen. None of the scum are bussing. They are spamming and spamming and spamming hoping that the town doesn't try and figure out the scum. I don't intend to play games with some of the players in this game again. Not that I will blacklist them or anything because I don't have anything against them. It is just that their tactics of burying the thread are crap and borderline unethical. It is just that seeing their name in a playerlist might make me think about not signing up/not replacing in into the game. Specifically zMuffinman. I also enjoyed playing with Mastin but he is literally spamming up the thread with bullshit and it is exasperating. I don't think that making it physically impossible for town to catch up to the game and contribute is good in any way. It is not like they are actually playing a good game and fooling a majority of players. It is that their spam caused a whole TON of players to not get caught up in the game and not make an informed vote. As such we only had about 8-9 active players in the game. To lynch any of the scum, we basically needed ALL of us to agree on a lynch. We got the three people in this neighborhood and The Fox and the Hound to agree. We got Cupcake to vote Mastin and PeregrineV to vote Rancid. The problem is that you and ffery are determinedly avoiding any lynch that could actually yield scum. You got your Orc lynch, fine. He is obviously town. What now?

Add onto that, a few players like you and ffery proved COMPLETELY impossible to work with because you won't vote ANY of the scum in the game. I tried to work with you and her to vote ANY of Mastin/Muffin/AP but all you did was ignore the entire fucking game for the ENTIRETY of the 18 days with no contributions. Then you finally show up with 8 hours left to deadline and work with the scum to derail their lynch. The lynch you pushed went through because the scum were backing you and ffery 100%. You did jackshit the whole game. You never worked with me to help lynch any of my scumreads at all despite having me as obviously town. I don't think I was ever this much of a dick to you EVER in any game we played before. I don't understand how you think you can just pop in 8 hours before deadline and derail something that I worked so hard to accomplish, reaching out to so many players, spending so much time and effort to push and then shake all of it down. And you tell me that you are frustrated with me because I am not working with you. How the fuck do you actually think that's okay? In all other games we played together, when you were trying to push any of your scumreads, I backed you up or had a reasonable discussion about why I disagreed with your reads. You keep saying you are frustrated with me that I am not working with you and that's seriously bullshit. Like, are you kidding me? You showed up out of literally nowhere to say that me pointing out that Muffin was using insults was bad and that I should stop it.

You are not even thinking about it from my POV. Do you really, really believe that a skim of the thread gave you better reads overall than me who re-read the thread a fucking dozen times? Like seriously? You were oblivious to details of what was hapenning in the thread. You weren't involved. You don't understand the subtle emotional manipulation Mastin was doing with BRO because he could be riled up. You don't get that Mastin was trying to discredit me (and Pie when he joined the game). Muffin was spending a ton of time discrediting both Tammy and me although now it seems like he decided to buddy up with Tammy. You don't know ANYTHING. You fucking skimmed the thread, found one post from Rancid with ATE in it and decided that it made them town because he wouldn't do it as scum. You don't get that scum were in a hard place especially when Pie joined the game and re-inforced the attack that BRO-Desp, Fox, and I were building up. If he hadn't replaced in, it would have been even harder but his posts were like a breath of fresh air that provided the REAL possibility of getting Rancid/Mastin lynched today.

I really want to ask you this for the third time because I am so pissed off at you and I am not even getting it. DID YOU LITERALLY TELL ME THAT I AM NOT WORKING WITH YOU WHEN I SPENT EIGHTEEN FUCKING DAYS SOLVING THIS GAME AND FIGURING OUT THE SCUM AND YOU WON'T HELP ME PUSH ANY OF MY SCUMREADS? I said I'd settle for any of three players in the game and you were fucking with that and telling me that you are disappointed in me for nit working with you. Like ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME? And hey I am looking over past games and still can't find a single instance where I was a total dick to you as far as helping you push your scumreads. I am not really sure what the problem is or how you expected me to work with you or what you think I could have done better in the thread.

Paragraph one: The effort you've poured into getting a lynch and the passion you have while pushing said lynch means absolutely nothing as far as the alignment of the people you are pushing goes. Do you expect me to set aside my opinion and my pushes because you are more invested in the game and you have out more effort pushing than I have? Do you expect me to be quiet and accept whatever direction others push because your production is more impressive than mine? That is a naive mindset: effort =\= right.

Again, you have the same language that I'm derailing all of your hard work and I'm expressing my viewpoints and that makes me an asshole (I don't understand how you think you can pop in and derail something

I

worked so hard to accomplish)... Again, if you want me to be invested like you act like you want me to be, I will be aggressive. And if I disagree with the reads that you have, I will express my disagreement loudly and immediately. Saying that I am impossible o work with because "I won't vote any of the scum" is not exactly a fair statement: working with a player is taking their reads into account and adjusting accordingly, not forcing them to vote your way, and your single-minded pursuit of your suspects is cool and all but don't drag me in and ask me to work with you if you don't want to work through anything.

I don't know anything.
I didn't read the thread.
Except... I did read the thread. And I've known Mastin for three years longer than you have, and I know him far more intimately than you do. Mastin was frustrated, Mastin was angry. I don't think Mastin was trying to make BRO have an emotional breakdown and I think the accusation is a little extreme. I do get that scum would be in a hard place if the narrative that you're building is true.

Yes, I'm telling you you're not working with me when you're pissed at me for "not pushing your scumreads". I have never asked anyone to push my scumreads for me when asking to work with them, and you asking that from me and getting angry when I refuse illustrates my point completely.

[Desperado]

The more I think about it, the more ridiculously weird this is looking. Nacho has logged onto the site this weekend and today but hasn't checked into the neighborhood. His early analysis in the QT neighborhood also sent up all sorts of red flags especially some of the reasoning behind his reads, his jump into the thread to say that Mastin is town, and then complete disappearance. The later appearance at deadline to derail the Rancid lynch. If he is so uninvested in the game, how did he show up at deadline at precisely the right moments to shake things up and then got the hell out of there for good until now. I don't understand it and I am not sure I want to believe Nacho as town would do that. I also think he'd approach it in a completely different way if town. For one, as I mentioned before, it feels completely nuts to have seen what happened in the game and say that BRO was creating a "carnival of lunacy" as opposed to something like "Muffin, enough with the personal attacks, we're here to play a game, don't make it unfun for everyone involved." It feels like he is completely out of step with what's happening in the game and trying to push an agenda as opposed to genuinely being Nacho.

i just have a hard time believing scum-nacho would actually be capable of doing something like that again as scum with this playerlist.

[Nachomamma8]

The more I think about it, the more it doesn't make ANY fucking sense. What the actual fuck, Nacho, you showed up before deadline and flashwagoned BRO and Desp? You hydrad with Desp before, you know him well. Are you fucking kidding me and telling me that his alignment isn't obvious from reading the QTs? Who the heck are you kidding really?

I was frustrated, I made a bad push.
Guess I'm not flawless.

[Desperado]

I could possibly see that but the problem I'm having is that Nacho's been strongly on tilt in general recently. I feel like I can read him right given enough time and if anything I'm taking the way he was megaderailing that lynch as a towntell for the time being although I might reconsider it later

(like look at GIF touhou where he massively derailed a lynch off scum zmuffin and probably lost the game bc of it)

sure, but it's also pretty close to the way played the d1 deadline in empire's game as well.

PEdit: what the fuck are you frustrated about though? you haven't even been playing.

[Nachomamma8]

I haven't been posting.
I have been reading.

[Desperado]

ok

[Nachomamma8]

Also, she too went for trying to discredit me (I figured scum want to insult/discredit anyone that is right). Her claiming I was bitching about compromise lynches is massive bullshit and makes me wonder about the read. I know Tammy had similar voting patterns which was frustrating but her approach was to blame it on her own indecision as opposed to others (like ffery did) which felt really, really blatantly town.

If you're right about them being scum, then the discredit is a scumtell.
Meaning that the entire line of discredit, of personal attacks, is null on the whole.

[Desperado]

your hydra partner couldn't account for any of your thoughts during the day phase and you showed up with four hours to the deadline to bandwagon a bunch of people and get them to claim because you were frustrated about...what exactly?

[Nachomamma8]

Do you want to talk about my frustration, or do you want to talk about my reads?

[Desperado]

i'm more interested in your frustration and trying to figure out your alignment than your reads right now.

[Desperado]

^cuz if your actions at deadline are any indication your reads are pretty shitty anyway, so

[Nachomamma8]

Okay. I'm frustrated with this game because everyone is being a stubborn asshole and most cases are being padded with dislike for other people as opposed to actually thinking about anything.

[Desperado]

in particular i have a real problem with you dropping the carnival of lunacy at our feet when even your hydra partner had identified RBD as the catalyst

and had stated this in this qt

.

[Nachomamma8]

^cuz if your actions at deadline are any indication your reads are pretty shitty anyway, so

At least I'm willing to reanalyze them. You aren't willing to reanalyze. Bro won't reanalyze. f-16 won't reanalyze. Etc, etc.

[Desperado]

^cuz if your actions at deadline are any indication your reads are pretty shitty anyway, so

At least I'm willing to reanalyze them. You aren't willing to reanalyze. Bro won't reanalyze. f-16 won't reanalyze. Etc, etc.

we haven't even had an opportunity to analyze the first time!

you ruined that chance.

[Desperado]

you know what would have been fucking amazing for recalibrating our reads?

an rbd town flip.

[Nachomamma8]

What happens with an RBD town flip? Why can't you think about the possibility now?