Mini 1603 - Air Combat Mafia - Game Over

[Csareo]

TSO seems town farside, but after seeing his performance in 1601 mini normal, I'm not so sure of his meta.
We can start a pressure wagon later, or see if time has anything to tell, but right now we need to focus on lynching the confirmed scum, vezo

[T S O]

I'm v tempted to just count that as a scum win given not one player actually objected to the statement it would have been a guaranteed scumwin.

still p disappointing though.

[Csareo]

I'm v tempted to just count that as a scum win given not one player actually objected to the statement it would have been a guaranteed scumwin.

still p disappointing though.

Considering scum had been lynchied D1, I wouldn't be so sure it was a "scum win"
I would of never guessed you were scum though, and to be honest, that scares me.

[T S O]

well it was a scum lynch which was literally pushed by me

there were two default mislynches and I strongmanned him for cred.

I think you ---> Kill Ythill ---> Feirei ---> Kill Heph ---> "mislynch x" ---> Kill Shinobi was game over; and your slot was quite mislynchable.

[T S O]

I hope that doesn't come off as stupidly arrogant or anything - I really don't mean it to. I'm just saying the way I, and apparently everyone else afaic, felt the game would have gone.

Also thank you for the compliment!

[mykonian]

And matt is V/LA. Annoying.

I seriously dislike the end of yesterday.

I also think bus driver is a negative utility role but i don't really care and would like to let him stick around

Noone hammer

We have three hours, I'm waiting to hear back from Oman regarding a question

Ok, Idk what to do w/o a response from oman so whatever

This is matt stalling the deadline lynch of esspresso. Suddenly, with just a couple of hours to go, matt "does not care" anymore, and asks a question after the claim. I've thought about it during the night and I can't think of a question then that would confirm esspresso to be town. Busdrivers setupwise create problems, you could confirm him to be scum with role information, but hardly as town. And we were lynching espresso already. A no lynch day one would suck, matt was around, but esspecially given post 1013: he let it happen.

I guess he can talk about it when he comes back.

vote matt

[xRECKONERx]

And yet your voting me and calling me scum and protecting vezo who never said why esp was scum and makes false reasoning a case.

*SHOCKING NEWS ALERT* people can have multiple independent scumreads at the same time!

Is your mind just BLOWN?

[farside22]

Mod v/la for 48 hours.
Month end and sick is a bad combo

[Anatole Kuragin]

I'm about 65% sure that matt and csareo are a scum team.

VOTE: csareo

[Anatole Kuragin]

about 85% for csareo though

[Anatole Kuragin]

bonus points if TSO is the third member

[vezokpiraka]

How about you vote farside and cut the crap.

[Anatole Kuragin]

You need a chill pill dude.

[farside22]

I'm about 65% sure that matt and csareo are a scum team.

VOTE: csareo

Why do you have a scum read on Matt?

@tso

my town reads are somewhat difficult to explain but here is how best I can explain while felling like crap.

MattP - he looks to be reading and trying to figure people out. I feel opposite of myko in regards to about Matt's lack of vote. Why wouldn't scum vote a claimed pr? It would be easy to do given the late hour and no one would blame him.

Mafias SSK- meta town. He really is more active as scum but on a personal level would like to see him replace.

Will be back thrus

[MafiaSSK]

I'm about 65% sure that matt and csareo are a scum team.

VOTE: csareo

why

[Anatole Kuragin]

can you guys please just trust me so I don't have to make a huge post?

[MafiaSSK]

can you guys please just trust me so I don't have to make a huge post?

Nah.

[Anatole Kuragin]

ugh, seriously just read matt and csareo's ISOs - they're either masons or a scumteam

[MafiaSSK]

ugh, seriously just read matt and csareo's ISOs - they're either masons or a scumteam

Wanna point out specific posts to me? I'm lazy.

[MafiaSSK]

Decided to stop being lazy. I agree with Anatole. Plenty of assosciation tells there, and it doesn't feel mason-like.

VOTE: csareo

[Anatole Kuragin]

Holy shit, where to start. 7 pages already?
There appears to be a circle of "mattp, anatole, and farside" who are just grasing for straws for some kind of scum tell.
Mattp definitely set off alarms with his voting. I mean, seriously?
Anatole appears to be joking more than he is scum hunting.
I think farside seems townish.
Flubber is an idiot. Trust me, I've reviewed his games. His meta will constantly insult people and buddy with everyone who he's not insulting.
Mykrno your read is null ATM.
Reckoner you are null ATM.
Everyone else is null.

Mattp, what is your case on expresso?
I'm not feeling it at all.

My scum reads are
- vez
- reckoner
- MattP (null lean)
Mostly for buddying and suspicious behavior from reckoner.
We have a cold case of "defending over hunting".
Another tip off was your read list and vote switching, which made me think for awhile.
Expresso and anatole seemed like easy policy lynch targets, so it looked like you're sheeping.

Reckoner also seemed to back your reads, which was slightly suspicious.
Can you give justifications for your reads now, since I just did upon your request.
Let's not forget, I never voted you....

And the two blocs form. I am confident in my vezok lynch, but am being open minded here. I see these opposing fronts coming into action, and I really want to break one of them apart.
One of these blocs has several scum reads, so can we start there??

Can you literally just close down your browser and walk away

Okay, now here is why I keep scum reading you.
Hostility is the first maxim of a scum player.

When thou can not debunk, insult

Mattp, what is wrong with my post? Nothing I said is controversial.
Legitimacy sniping is anti-town.

You posting is anti-town, Csareo, though, so maybe 2 posts/day.

One second. If Mattp answers my question, I think it will lead somewhere.

I can't connect the interaction I just saw.
The reaction from Mattp to that post was simply to over exaggerated and crazy to be true.
Even if it was a stupid post, which it was not, the fact that mattp staged an acted and fake performance of being a "rabid jackass" was neither amusing or town.

these posts all scream "this guy is my scum partner"

same for matt incoming - the holes between these posts are noncommital votes/cases on lots of people for basically no reason, or townreads for no reason

[Anatole Kuragin]

Can you quote examples of me grabbing at straws, Csareo

Also Csareo never answered this, and I am not ok with him getting away with making a comment like that and not expanding.

There's no way you could play the helpless and confused cards and be scumhunting and expressing scum reads so timidly so early in the game and not be scum. None of your reads have any UMPH behind them and you're choosing the most bizarre things to focus on.

All of the louder players of the game have at the very least commented on a few of these traits of yours, and yet they're distracted. I'd like to point out that myko PROBABLY is displaying these traits because he:
1. is scum and is overwhelmed with the player base
2. is unable to overcome his admission of guilt and therefore can't push a town player hard enough
3. is biased in seeing town player's moves as townlike and therefore is reaching for unnatural things to call out so that at least it looks like he's doing something

I think if myko is scum you could pretty much figure out a bunch of people's alignments, but just from the get-go that Ki-Gi is town

P-edit: Csareo is a lazy vote this early in the game.

It's not going to derive any information and he can be dealt with later.

If I were scum I'd love to get away with playing like that.

It looks active, but makes little waves. Little of what he says can come back to him and the little that did got strung out to the point where nobody but farside and he read it at which point townies zone out and assume it to be 50/50 and let it be for the time being. It's a defensively strong playstyle, because with each post seems "useful", while in the end there are few results to show. What this game would need is wagons but in no way could anatole make them happen playing like that, so at no point he has to step out and let himself be judged on his stances.

The playstyle would work perfectly for scum, and have limited use as town. If only it made him scum.

Anatole's entire game so far has consisted of getting an early read on me, moving onto Ki-Gi, and immediately becoming swept up in a counter-productive 8 page argument with farside. The situation with farside was led by farside and Anatole was just indignantly responding, and I don't think indignance fueling 8 pages of crap is scum-motivated considering I've done that myself as town many times (and have gotten similar shit for it as anatole is getting now). I think you're being short-sided because you're not acknowledging that anatole certainly got the short end of the stick so far this game with being tunneled by a clear town farside and has been responding in a clearly natural way of someone who thinks highly of himself and believes the shit he is getting is ridiculous.

He's trying to change to a more productive string of conversation by pushing a Csareo wagon now.

Nothing he's done has set off any alarms in my head.

p-edit: Myko has explicitly stated he feels lost in certain portions of the game, has reads but noone will listen so he's given up on pushing and feels like he will just join a different game in 2 weeks. I think this is pretty insane given we're 24 hours into this game

some pro bussing going on

I still want Csareo to explain how I was grasping at straws

Or is he avoiding the thread because he can't come up with anything legitimate to point out

#scandalous #scum

matt brings this grasping at straws thing up like a million times

don't know if Csareo's vote on me is any more scummy than Espresso's bullshit "reaction test" into "I think you may be a power role..", "HAHA I WAS WRONG YOU ARE TOTALLY SCUM LOOK AT YOU FLAIL!" after I make one comment about his case being dumb, into completely avoiding my asking him for reads which he said he would post "tomorrow" two days ago.

I was JUST thinking about this being the scummiest thing that's happened so far in the game, and then I ran into this thread to recheck it and saw the situation with vizak/reck/farside

Reck is town, but I need to look over some stuff

Can you explain why the bold makes sense to do as scum.
Also why you think this when ki was on you null list

This sounds like your saying I know it's a mislynch and will use it to lynch reck/vezo because of that instead of shitty fake reads and never mind ki being scum read for ever in a day?
You saying you ignore the later for a reason?

Ki was on my null list specifically, as I stated, because having been gone for 5 days made him fall out of my town list since reads fade over time without constant reminding. I thought Ki was town when he was actively engaged in discussion.

I explained in the post why it makes sense for scum to do. And I'm not entertaining the idea as something I legitimately care about / believe at this moment, it simply made me hesitant about who to lynch today in the condition you were scum, and entertaining the idea put me more at ease with lynching espresso over csareo since I highly doubt you as scum would have chainsawed csareo so hard, especially when reck came into the equation. I think it would be much more likely csareo was town were you scum.

Ki-Gi was a townread for me until he disappeared. And yes,

I don't like Csareo but I also don't want to lynch him over Espresso

So he basically goes back and forth calling Csareo scummy or pointing out his scummy behaviors, while defending him or calling a lynch on him a bad idea even though he put Csareo in his own pool of people to lynch.

1. Belisarius
2. Ki-Gi
4. MafiaSSK
6. mykonian
8. Espressojet
9. Csareo
10. Flubbernugget

I think you have 3 scum in here. I want Ki-Gi replaced before anything happens.

[mykonian]

@farside, enough time to figure out either way. Matt needs to talk.

[xRECKONERx]

I want Csareo dead but I want farside dead

so much more

.

Look at yesterday. Look at how she had to find a way to back up off of the mislynch on me and justify jumping on TSO

at fucking deadline

.

Farside is scum, TSO is town, actually. No way does scum hop off of one mislynch onto a scumbuddy's wagon at deadline.

[xRECKONERx]

The Matt votes are truly, truly puzzling.