Mini 1602: Game Over

[SleepyKrew]

VC 3.01

ZZZX

(2) - Malakittens, implosion

phokdapolees

(1) - sthar8

Not Voting

(6) - AGar, BipolarChemist, ZZZX, Aneninen, phokdapolees, notscience

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Day 3 deadline will hit in: (expired on 2014-09-29 14:47:42).

[sthar8]

I did, at least one.

No, you didn't.

Also there are better ways to crumb, i.e. use language that would obviously be a crumb but only in retrospect.

Show me language that is obviously a bodyguard crumb, but only in retrospect, and is easier to drop or pick up than "I THINK THIS ONE PERSON IS TOWN, I HAVE OTHER TOWNREADS BUT THIS IS THE ONLY ONE I'M SPECIFICALLY MENTIONING"

[implosion]

I have no interest in continuing this conversation because i'm fairly confident that almost all of the contention is because of misinterpretations. It also just isn't useful.

Even if it were the case that DeasVail were known to crumb as bodyguard in exactly this way, even if we had a confirmed town tracker who tracked DeasVail to BipolarChemist last night, that wouldn't mean we could be sure that BPC is town. Scum could have had some other reason to directly kill DV (i.e. a rolecop). We just can't know. At that point continuing this conversation is pointless. Unless you give me a combination of a tracker who tracked deasvail to bpc and a watcher who watched deasvail and saw no one target him i'm not going to see this as having any weight.

[implosion]

on that note i'll talk about more interesting things later because today is going to be really rough and i don't want to burn myself out.

[Aneninen]

So, let's see Day2 again.
It will be pretty much inconsistent because I wrote down everything that I found interesting, strange or suspicious – even if I haven't been able to conclude anything out of them yet.

Spoiler:

MalaKittyPryde

Starts out voting for Chaos.
Says "don't mind lynching Tman" in 472. (He was my scumread.)
Genuine-looking townposts in 596 and her later posts.
635 – and we should remember this if either ZZZX or BPC flips scum!
686/687 – these two, following each other are obvtown in my eyes. (Why would a scum care about the lack of posts in a situation like this?)

Implosion

His instant reaction for MalaKitty's vote gives me town vibes. (452.)
From 456 he pushes the Shadowez wagon, backed with a strong case, in my opinion. Such a relentless pushing would be risky as a scum (after all, Shadowez flipped town), or at least, a very weak scumplay. Unless he hoped that this

alone

may give him town-credit, merely because no scum would do that. A WIFOM situation?
Still, he votes for Oso 6 posts later (without giving a strong reason).
Vote is back for Shadowez in 551.
744 – I agree with this. There is no evidence that DeasVail was protecting BPC. (See below!) What if Sthar8 wants us to believe it so? Though... there is 629. I must have skimmed that over. Oh shyt I don't know.

BipolarChemist / Oso

457 from Oso is pretty much "I don't want to be involved" stuff.
Uh-oh! Look at 505!

"I had made it clear that I would hammer Niel. But I also wanted both Shadowez and Agar post their thoughts before it happened."

– Why wasn't he able to decide whether a slot was scum

alone

? Yet another "I don't want to be involved" thing. The Phok-case is pretty weak.
I posted about BPC's readlist and nearby-posts a lot (I mean those 560-570-ish posts) before.
I still think that 613/614 are weak answers.

Phokdapolees

Null-start. (455)
Prod-dodge next.
Votes for Chaos (ZZZX) in 507 and that "Tman and Aneninen are easy (mis)lynches" thing. We talked a lot about that later.
638 "chaos and BPC are scum" – ? By that time ZZZX had been here for a while...

AGar

Hmmm... he realized the same about Oso in 461 (as I by reading Oso's 457).
Oh! 476! We've totally forgotten this topic. I mean, I suggested a Cop counterclaim and many players told me that it would be a stupid idea – Oso

had

an opportunity for the same but he posted "don't claim" after 3 other players wrote it.
Calls Shadowez town in 494.
He says Tman is town in 520. AGar seems to be an obv-town, however, what if Tman flips scum? Or BPC? I mean AGar unvotes in562 and says that Shadowez' post (562) was weak –

but, Shadowez did exactly the same!

(Even if he said that the end of Shadowez' post was weak.) DeasVail asked about it in 565 but none of us realized that AGar was doing the same...
Well, 602, I mean the

"Even if you unvoted, you were still on it and that's what's a problem."

is a WTF?!
617 – aaaand now Shadowez is scum in his reads. Despite that he was town according to AGar's former reads. Despite the fact that Agar haven't posted anything about unvoting BPC yet.

ZZZX / Chaos

Naked readlist in 503.
Too little content from ZZZX later.

Sthar8 / Grandee / Rack

Null-start (470).
Grandee's only post is 506, a naked readlist. One lean scum (ZZZX) and plenty of towns and nulls? Hmmm...
632 – you could have checked on Page 1 who are replacements and who aren't...
647 – a townread on BPC without any additional content?
A weird vote for Phok in 669. 685 – pushing Phok (and it was pointless at that time), however, what if both of the ZZZX and Shadowez wagons were scum-driven? (And he's been pushing the Phok wagon Today too.)

DeasVail

In 486 his scumlist consists of Oso (BPC), Chaos (ZZZX), and Shadowez. Two posts later he mentions that Shadowez is mostly a PoE read.
Votes for Chaos (ZZZX) in 496, his other (weaker) scumread is Oso (BPC).
Votes for Shadowez in 527. Hmmm...
Wait, here is 624!

"it's either because BPC is scum and I'm paranoid of him, or because we're both town and paranoid of each other."

– So, BPC was NOT obvtown according to DeasVail. This means, it's unlikely that he wanted to protect BPC!
631 – Hmmm... does that make BPC clear? Or were DeasVail wrong about him? Though... check out eg. 683. (See also other sections of this post!)

Tman

Null-start (492).
534 – Unsure about Oso and his slotread depends on the replacement (BPC)? Strange indeed. Might we have a Tman/BPC scumteam?
544 – WTF? Why does flaking out affects the alignment of a slot?
Little content from Notscience 'till now. (Though, not scummy.)

Shadowez

In 493 his scumreads are Elias (DeasVail), Chaos (ZZZX) (gut reads) and Tman (because of the Nightkill). This might be important.
After his flip, we should focus on that detailed 513. Same scumreads. Votes for Chaos (ZZZX). Hmmm... I wonder if we'll find a chainsaw here if ZZZX or Tman flips scum later.

We must remember this post!

Also, 579 is an interesting post about Tman.
In 651 his scumpool is DeasVail, Implosion, NotScience and ZZZX.

Conclusions,

Spoiler:

MalaKitty – town
Implosion – lean town (unless he tries to hard-push a mislynch against Sthar8 Today, just as he did against Shadowez on Day2. But, in this case, who's his partner?)
BipolarChemist – still my strongest scumread, see also my former posts. The possible partners are AGar or Sthar8. However, if Sthar8 is right about DeasVail's Night Action, that's a major caveat.
Phokdapolees – unsure. He did nothing on Day2 and he was pretty much active on the site meanwhile. Either he has little interest in this game or he's lurking.
AGar – scum / town. Because, if BPC flips scum, he's the most possible partner of him. If not, he's town. But still, his interaction with Oso and the drastic change as BPC arrived is very strange!
ZZZX – lean town. Chaos wasn't scumread by me, ZZZX provided no content. This read may change easily but, quick-lynching ZZZX would be a terrible idea.
Sthar8 – unsure; we should check the early emergence of the Rack-wagon.
Tman – lean scum, we need more content. Shadowez had a case against him. (And me too, early Day2)

Somehow I think that many things would depend on a partner analysis if we managed to lynch a scum. Or, if we knew some conf. towns but, it would be bad to claim a PR just to confirm some townies.

VOTE: BipolarChemist
See the spoilers for details.

[SleepyKrew]

ZZZX has been prodded.

[BipolarChemist]

What's up notty?


Excellent bodyguard. I'm gonna go check DV for crumbs before anything else.

K so as far as I can tell, BPC was the probable bodyguard target. If nobody disagrees that probably means he's off the table, not that I was scumreading him anyway.

The feel I get from these two posts is one of scum who wanted to jump out of the gate providing the right information trying to look helpful on speculation. Yesterday I was being pressure by a couple of people, Anen being quite adamant on me being scum. While it does seem like DV died from his PR, sthar's jumping to it having to be on me I find suspicious. The just of his posts past that almost feel like way too hard of a defense where I would imagine town would reel back a bit and get that they might have made a mistake in assuming.

This actually bothers me enough to...

VOTE: Sthar8

[BipolarChemist]

@Anen: I think your case on me is realy crap and the answers I gave were 'weak' because they should have been obvious. It was obvious sarcasm/joking, I honestly don't know how you're reading my interactions with Agar as buddying :/ Sthar I can see with his recent stuff today, but please don't associate me with that butthead

[Malakittens]

This is a prod dodge <:

[sthar8]

get that they might have made a mistake in assuming.

I have seen no evidence of this.

[phokdapolees]

get that they might have made a mistake in assuming.

I have seen no evidence of this.

Nor have we seen evidence of your DV crumb theory

[AGar]

i mean, you could also just iso the mod and look at his voting record

but whatever, keep on pushing that lurker wagon. You seem super invested and clearly know what you're doing.

Oh ho ho. Take pot shots to make up for the inferiority of your wagon! Well played sir.

Clearly this is a dead avenue.

Can we play mafia now guys?

ZZZX replaced an already scummy slot and then acted scummy. Now he's gone lurky mclurkerson. He was CWed by Shaddowez yesterday (whoops) and chaos was all over the map. Really seemed scared to commit to a read one way or another except dat mala read yo. TL;DR - supahscummeh.

[notscience]

I've been looking at the day 1 final votes and day 2.

I need to remem ber who replaced who but Ifelt both scum would bus D1

[AGar]

Also, I refuse to read spoilered cases on principal.

[notscience]

I don't understand ane's reads

[Aneninen]

@BPC – my case is pretty much the same as it was Yesterday even if you consider it shyt. I'm not saying that you're buddying AGar; I find it strange that he used to have a case against your slot and that case disappeared into nothingness, without any arguments, right as you arrived. As for Sthar8, he has kept saying that you're obvtown because DeasVail was bodyguarding you but (1) I'm unsure about his reasoning and (2) I've never said that you've been trying buddying him.

@AGar – it's strange that you tell us now that you refuse to read spoilered cases. There were such cases on Day2 too, eg. Implosion's 456 or 462 from me.

@NotScience – feel free to ask if you don't understand something. Also, we need more posts!

_____

However, as for my previous posts. As I mentioned before, I'm not sure whether everything written there is relevant and I've been unable to draw a conclusion from everything collected. Still, there are questions need answering by us.

(1) Can Sthar8 be right about DeasVail's action? If so, does it make BPC clear? If not, is it a bad read by a townie or an intentional "diversion" by a scum? (Also, can Sthar8 and BPC be scum together and is BPC distancing himself by voting for him?)

(2) Whom did DeasVail protect? Did he protect anyone at all? In other words: who were his strongest townreads? (It's a thing that he mentioned "BPC is town" in his late-posts but there were other townreads on his list: AGar, MalaKitty, Implosion, Phok, Tman, Sthar8.)

(3) Isn't it strange that the ZZZX case survives that long even if he hasn't posted anything useful for a long time? (My experience shows that games usually have "short term memory"; I mean, cases against players with content tend to dissolve themselves after a while.)

(4) What if someone performed a chainsaw against Shadowez? His scumpool were DeasVail, ZZZX and NotScience early-Day2 and he added Implosion later. ZZZX was the counterwagon. (There was no strong wagon against DV or Tman/Notscience.) On the Shadowez wagon there were the following players: DeasVail, Implosion, AGar, Aneninen, Sthar8 and BipolarChemist. DV is dead. Sthar8's vote and my one were compromising votes, both of us would have lynched someone else. So, Implosion, AGar and BPC remains. Implosion had launched a case against Shadowez before Shadowez posted his reads. In my opinion AGar is scum only if he's scum with BPC, in this case there was no chainsaw. However, would a ZZZX/BPC wagon be possible? (Either I'm a monomaniac or here's yet another thing which points towards BPC...)

[implosion]

~prod dodge~

(sorry)

[SleepyKrew]

I am beginning a replacement search for ZZZX. If he posts before I find one, he keeps his slot.

EDIT: nopointinactingup replaces ZZZX.

[nopointinactingup]

Hi all.
Replacing in and will post soon!

[Aneninen]

Hi and welcome, No-point-in-acting-up! Is there a short form of your name?

[sthar8]

BPC i believe you missed the whole point of my play today.


I'll be at work until probably 5 or six tomorrow morning. In the late-lates I'll need something to do, so I'll probably make my case on phok very clear.

If anybody's around then, I'm down to jam.

I'm considering spoilering every post from here on out to spite Agar.

[Malakittens]

Tman – lean scum, we need more content. Shadowez had a case against him. (And me too, early Day2)

Nah.
I can read notty like a book. This is town-notty, trust me<333

[sthar8]

no shh. you're supposed to be ambivalent on him so he posts a ton.

[SleepyKrew]

~

[SleepyKrew]

~~