Mini 1621: Frog Mafia (KERO)

[Flubbernugget]

Can we have 1 more

[GreyICE]

I'm kind of disappointed, I thought you were going somewhere with this. I wanted to read your case so I could see if the thought process behind it made sense for town, but now I'm just puzzled. I have never lied about meta, my own or anyone else's, as town or scum, though I have been accused of it over different interpretations. Why did you think that Garmr's replacements would have been relevant?

I'm sorry I disappointed you...

I thought you made up the whole Garmr thing, that's why it was relevant cause I couldn't find any games he actually made it to the end of. Turns out I was wrong.

Also, Waffle lying about not knowing what "lol" means makes no sense, unless he is newb-scum?

P-EDIT: THAT IS AN ACTUAL FREAKING SCUM READ AND I WILL TAKE IT TO MY GRAVE.

Waffle's scumbuddy, 100%

Lynch all liars

[Garmr]

I'm kind of disappointed, I thought you were going somewhere with this. I wanted to read your case so I could see if the thought process behind it made sense for town, but now I'm just puzzled. I have never lied about meta, my own or anyone else's, as town or scum, though I have been accused of it over different interpretations. Why did you think that Garmr's replacements would have been relevant?

I'm sorry I disappointed you...

I thought you made up the whole Garmr thing, that's why it was relevant cause I couldn't find any games he actually made it to the end of. Turns out I was wrong.

Also, Waffle lying about not knowing what "lol" means makes no sense, unless he is newb-scum?

P-EDIT: THAT IS AN ACTUAL FREAKING SCUM READ AND I WILL TAKE IT TO MY GRAVE.

Waffle's scumbuddy, 100%

Lynch all liars

[ProHawk]

Lynch all liars

OH THE IRONY!!

Makes no sense coming from someone who is town: ala lied about being scum.

Therefore must be scum.

[Jackel98]

Wait, what does not knowing what lol means have to do with being scum?

[VictorDeAngelo]

It's not about knowing what it means. It's the fact he claimed ignorance when he did know what it meant.

But put the lol remark aside for a second. What is your view on the rest of Waffle's play?

[Bookitty]

Garmr, you think WaffleGhost is town? Or we're wrong for some other reason?

[Garmr]

Garmr, you think WaffleGhost is town? Or we're wrong for some other reason?

What i was referring to was prohawk being his scum buddy as prohawk is a town read of mine.

Waffle is null- with a slight scum lean after looking into it but what's interesting is the last 3 votes of him were based off the lol case while massives is a no case.

But The first 2 had real solid reasoning that rival the case on flubber.

@Gendaberry Check Newbie 1543. You honestly think as scum I'd say "OH I KNOW! I'LL DO THE EXACT SAME THING THAT GOT ME LYNCHED IN MY LAST GAME!!!" ?
I also didn't intend to be attacking anyone, I was stating my opinion on playstyle. I intended to share my stance on appearing town. I've had serious misconceptions about things in IRL mafia and was I mafia? No.

@Victor Whilst just reading through here's how people struck me based on my gut.
Null'
-Victor
-Salamence
-Gendaberry
-Massive
-Garmr
-ProHawk
-Jackel
-Primate
-Flubber
*I either didn't have the necessary amount of posts or didn't want to make a decision with what I had. In general I don't find reads before a certain number of pages to have any real weight.
**I know it's alot of null:/
Town
-Bookitty
-Every body's favourite wraith, your dear, WAFFLEGHOST! At you service.
Scum
-2birds definitely came off as scum but I can't say why at the moment.

I feel like I'm missing someone.

Hang on let me just trim this down so we're dealing with the actual content.

@Victor
Town
-Bookitty
Scum
-2birds definitely came off as scum but I can't say why at the moment.

Insightful.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: WaffleGhost

WaffleGhost really seems like scum who doesn't know what they're doing to me. Waffle hasn't really done anything at all so far. It's not putting pressure on anyone or voting anyone, and on top of that I don't like 56

I'm not accusing you of being scum, yet. Just stating my opinion as far as play. I'm just a dumb newbie though

Its the only post from Waffle with content, and even then he adds the "dumb newbie" comment in what looks to me like they're trying to preemptively defend themselves in case someone found the post scummy. I might be reading too far into it, but it looks like Waffle is trying to avoid suspicion by never accusing anyone, and by pulling the newbie card to try and make themselves look innocent.

VOTE: WaffleGhost

These two reasoning are way better than the current 4 votes on him. One which has none at all and the other is a lol case which is throw away. But it's the throw away lol case that gathered the most votes why didn't people him when he had these solid reasoning. Why let the wagon get to middle size then boom grow in a instant once a vote tipped it into the most voted category. I feel like the wagon started on town grounds and some point scum greased the wheels.

Maybe it's a bus or it could be a mislynch I'm not sure.

[Primate]

@Prohawk: I get why you think GreyIce might make a post like that as scum, but I don't get why you think that makes him scum.

You ever play poker? He is bluffing. I am calling his bluff. He needs to die.

"Scum would NEVER do this, so I am going to do this as scum."

As an aside, you never commented on why I think you're scum, nor made any mention of my vote on you. Why is that?

I just didn't. I was trying to catch up and it was more about refreshing my reads than giving content to help others read me. I knew I was going to miss things regardless, I wasn't trying to be comprehensive. Though I didn't intentionally avoid it, and it probably should have registered more to me, sorry.

As for your comments earlier in the game, I generally don't vote much. I used be more of a "vote is townies greatest weapon" froth-head, but I find it's not really worth the effort anymore now games are more active. I didn't really think there was too much difference between having an RVS vote on massive and not voting anyone, and it didn't really occur to me to unvote massive when I wasn't planning on voting anyone else, it's not like I would be making a principled stand by unvoting. I wasn't intending to keep it on massive as long as I did, but I wasn't really intending to disappear either.

re: GreyIce.
Yeah, I get why you might think he'd do it as scum, but I don't really get why most everything you said wouldn't also apply equally to him if he was making that joke as town. It's still ballsy, surely.

[Bookitty]

But it's the throw away lol case that gathered the most votes why didn't people him when he had these solid reasoning.

I can't speak for others. The fact that WaffleGhost appeared to be a newb was certainly part of my reasoning in not voting him. The fact that he was faking being a newb and apparently trolling both me and the thread erased that reason.

Why do you think that deliberately lying to create an impression of newbieness is a throwaway lol case?

[Garmr]

But it's the throw away lol case that gathered the most votes why didn't people him when he had these solid reasoning.

I can't speak for others. The fact that WaffleGhost appeared to be a newb was certainly part of my reasoning in not voting him. The fact that he was faking being a newb and apparently trolling both me and the thread erased that reason.

Why do you think that deliberately lying to create an impression of newbieness is a throwaway lol case?

Well consider the fact he is a newbie with 2 complete games and i think no prior mafia experience before his first game because he didn't know what to do in rvs(first game) is a part of it. I don't think the lol case was him trying to create a impression of newbieness as I don't see how it's game relevant. When did the word Lol become a tell and mafia relevant. If it was faking not understanding rvs it would be a different story as someone explained that to him.

I think he was just fucking with you.

the other two cases through are more solid.

[massive]

Waffle is null- with a slight scum lean after looking into it but what's interesting is the last 3 votes of him were based off the lol case while massives is a no case.

You can see my 131 for exactly where my vote came from, and which is way more succinct than the cases you think are "good" (especially since Gendaberry's is basically just expounding on this).

Primate

: I think that must be an artifact of earlier times, because I'm the same way with my vote. I try and take care to place it where I think it goes and I HATE moving it. I'm not crazy about players who will vote seven people in the first three pages, it drives me nuts.

[Garmr]

Waffle is null- with a slight scum lean after looking into it but what's interesting is the last 3 votes of him were based off the lol case while massives is a no case.

You can see my 131 for exactly where my vote came from, and which is way more succinct than the cases you think are "good" (especially since Gendaberry's is basically just expounding on this).

Primate

: I think that must be an artifact of earlier times, because I'm the same way with my vote. I try and take care to place it where I think it goes and I HATE moving it. I'm not crazy about players who will vote seven people in the first three pages, it drives me nuts.

Cheers make that 2 I didn't see that post I only looked at time of votes.

[Bookitty]

Well consider the fact he is a newbie with 2 complete games and i think no prior mafia experience before his first game because he didn't know what to do in rvs(first game) is a part of it. I don't think the lol case was him trying to create a impression of newbieness as I don't see how it's game relevant. When did the word Lol become a tell and mafia relevant. If it was faking not understanding rvs it would be a different story as someone explained that to him.

I think he was just fucking with you.

the other two cases through are more solid.

I also think he was just fucking with me (and calling his weird later questions a defense is also problematic for me). However, I think it's all of a piece in a way that I don't think you do. Playing up one's newbness and pretending not to understand things, including the meaning of terms like LOL (and he continued that past one post, so it wasn't a joke) can be a tactic to get out of scummy behaviour. Giving a whole list of reads that make very little sense can be either newb or scum (or both). If he's faking not knowing what LOL means, he was probably faking the rest of the newbie tells. When one part of the constructed newbie facade crumbles, the whole thing goes. WaffleGhost also called his questions a defence, which argues he meant it to be one.

Makes sense now?

[Garmr]

Well consider the fact he is a newbie with 2 complete games and i think no prior mafia experience before his first game because he didn't know what to do in rvs(first game) is a part of it. I don't think the lol case was him trying to create a impression of newbieness as I don't see how it's game relevant. When did the word Lol become a tell and mafia relevant. If it was faking not understanding rvs it would be a different story as someone explained that to him.

I think he was just fucking with you.

the other two cases through are more solid.

I also think he was just fucking with me (and calling his weird later questions a defense is also problematic for me). However, I think it's all of a piece in a way that I don't think you do. Playing up one's newbness and pretending not to understand things, including the meaning of terms like LOL (and he continued that past one post, so it wasn't a joke) can be a tactic to get out of scummy behaviour. Giving a whole list of reads that make very little sense can be either newb or scum (or both). If he's faking not knowing what LOL means, he was probably faking the rest of the newbie tells. When one part of the constructed newbie facade crumbles, the whole thing goes. WaffleGhost also called his questions a defence, which argues he meant it to be one.

Makes sense now?

I'm starting to understand the defense thing.

Also noticed feyal earlier comments (/case) can strike him off the list and i think it explains the situation. Look at that you and grey are the most suspicious ones on the wagon.

WaffleGhost

I find myself agreeing with much that Gendaberry has said about him. Downplaying his own post with that dumb newbie comment was strange, particularly since that post was only about mafia theory.

His defense that he would not have done the same thing that got him lynched before is also rather disingenuous,

since he in fact has done the same thing - the only question is, does it make him scum? I think not, but it sure does not make him town either. What Gendaberry said about his lack of content still stands, and tight schedules happen to scum too.
.

I think this was what it was a defense of and he did it on purpose to mock feyal about it. because he portayed himself as stupid earlier.

As town, appearing town benefits the town, unless of course, your just out for town cred. Appearing town is good but it should be something that happens naturally by actions and not by you hunting for opportunities to win over the town's trust, in my opinion. Only scum is concerned with being the towniest of the town for the most part.

Here are 2 mindsets
Must look town must look town. . . must. . . look. . . town. . . .

I'm gonna be a bad ass scum hunting machine, who cares if I get my complexion a bit dirty?

I'm not accusing you of being scum, yet. Just stating my opinion as far as play.

I'm just a dumb newbie though :

P

So he played himself off dumb on purpose as a sarcastic response to people scum reading for playing the noob defense in this pose.

That's the only reason why I think he would say as a defense otherwise it doesn't make logical sense.

[Bookitty]

So he played himself off dumb on purpose as a sarcastic response to people scum reading for playing the noob defense in this pose.

And that's not scummy how?

What I really want is WaffleGhost to come back and explain himself. At best, his comments added nothing and junked up the thread. At worst, he's scum trolling. If he does flip scum, I'm going to look at the leading wagon when he started this nonsense to see if he was trying to distract from a buddy.

[Bookitty]

I went ahead and looked. Garmr and WaffleGhost were the two leading wagons at that point.

Your argument that it was a sarcastic response doesn't really hold water either, because I wasn't one of the ones calling him scum for playing the newbie defense, and his comments were directed at me. I don't usually direct my sarcasm at bystanders for LOLs.

[Garmr]

So he played himself off dumb on purpose as a sarcastic response to people scum reading for playing the noob defense in this pose.

And that's not scummy how?

What I really want is WaffleGhost to come back and explain himself.

At best, his comments added nothing and junked up the thread. At worst, he's scum trolling.

If he does flip scum, I'm going to look at the leading wagon when he started this nonsense to see if he was trying to distract from a buddy.

It's null to me because I seen town be sarcastic as well. I do agree with this through. But the people that migrated to his wagon were the ones on 2birds wagon if that's what your asking or I have been the counter wagon pretty much the whole game and since I'm town i think i have at least one scum on it.

[GreyICE]

Lynch all liars

OH THE IRONY!!

Makes no sense coming from someone who is town: ala lied about being scum.

Therefore must be scum.

It's going to be fun to hang you, child.

[Garmr]

Can we have 1 more

So are people just going to ignore this shit. His basically asking someone else to hammer.

[GreyICE]

Can we have 1 more

So are people just going to ignore this shit. His basically asking someone else to hammer.

And there's number 3.

This game is easy.

[WaffleGhost]

Sorry guys, I came down with somethin' fierce of the weekend, which is when I intended to do a lot of posting.
I honestly don't see a reason why I would deliberately troll as mafia or portray myself as a newbie intentionally.
Why?
From all my past experience in Mafia (a full 2 games!) extreme newbiness IS NOT POPULAR. And if people have the slightest inclination that you're faking newbiness they instantly lynch you. As well as that, as scum you'd want to be respected and have people think you know what you're talking about, right? I know! Time to fake newbiness!
What is the intention of trolls, to get someone angry and cause them to react passionately usually by annoying everyone. What happens when you annoy someone? THEY DISLIKE YOU! So why in god's name would you ever troll as mafia? This sight isn't for trolling either, you want to do that go to Xbox Live.

So, my posts about asking for basic internet terminology were intended to be a defense. When I said "I'm just a dumb newbie though " I was joking. So I was going on to get someone to say that lol meant someone was joking, then I looked back and saw that I use not lol so I was like "DAMN IT!". So I stopped, because I was asking about the wrong thing:/ Eventually in the end I was gonna make a sassy comment about, you know, I was joking, after people admitted it. But I done screwed up.

Let me make sure I'm understead

I WAS JOKING.

[WaffleGhost]

Can we have 1 more

Why don't you hammer me yourself? Are you afraid to get your hands dirty?

[Garmr]

Can we have 1 more

So are people just going to ignore this shit. His basically asking someone else to hammer.

And there's number 3.

This game is easy.

yep flubber and you are scum easy

[VictorDeAngelo]

Am I only one who read 300 as Flubber asking Hawk for another scumread? Am I just being dumb here?