Mini 98-Cellular Mafia! It's Over!

[Glamdring]

Well, it's been a day with no DB. I'm just going to throw this on here, in an attempt to shove the thread higher. We are in twilight.... correct?

[Malaprop]

Yes, we're in twilight. He mentioned in post 204 (near top of p9) that he'll be gone until today sometime.

[Dementia Blader]

Congratulations town. Caveman is indeed, the last of the scum.
TOWN WINS!






























































And Bigbenwd gets a organelle-size cookie.

[Malaprop]

I think it was a pretty good game, but the mod helped the town three times: by not modkilling Rick for the quote, by telling us that Yggdrasil had two companions, and by telling us mlaker was with Yggdrasil. These decisions are all mod's perogative, but they did help (especially the first).

Regardless, I enjoyed myself and learned a lot about playing well.

[Caveman]

I had a pretty difficult game. In addition to Malaprop's reasons, both of my partners quickly gave themselves away. Then mlaker disappeared completely on Night 2. My PMs to him for Night 2 were in my Outbox until well into Night 3(of course he had already been lynched by then).
The mod also quoted other players' posts on 2 occasions. I felt that on both occasions it was unwarranted.

I think it would have been a tough game anyway. Most 12 person games that I've seen have 4 anti-town roles.
I have to give props to Meme. She did catch me on my bluff at the end. I knew my only chance was to go for a big, well-detailed role. I just couldn't pull it off, though.

[BlueSin]

totally agree.
I said before that this game has bug that ead to town win. poor scum~

[kleimar]

Yes, town was in a serious advantage especially after the first claims.

[Rick]

but the mod helped the town three times: by not modkilling Rick for the quote, by telling us that Yggdrasil had two companions, and by telling us mlaker was with Yggdrasil. These decisions are all mod's perogative, but they did help (especially the first).

First, how can the mod kill me, if I have permission before posting?

Once I had permission to make that post, it made extremely good sense to do so to draw the mafia out. Shame you couldn’t work that out.

I find it very poor that for a player who made so many mistakes during the game that you would be harping on and complaining about the mod.

For example:

Post #35: First in this post you got your facts wrong, which plays into the hands of the mafia.

Post#49
Here you link to a site with 14 organelles. Now, even you admitted that this “doesn’t help us [town] at all”. Eh, if it doesn’t help the Town, why post it? In fact I would go further – the only players it helped were the Mafia. Just in case they hadn’t looked up some good role claims, you went and did it for them.

Then of course there were the following after the claim I gave (with permission).

MeMe: I'd like to hear why you're suspicious of him for that. I had the same reaction as Yggdrasil -- there will definitely be a mitochondria role, so it'd be suicide for mafia to claim it.

Point it out for me. He gives a role name, declines to give a full role claim, and reiterates that he's town. The only thing of any substance is the role name.

And here’s my favourite :

vote: Meme

I know you said that you were distracted (and I do like your ‘Mafia Grapher’) but that is no excuse for your criticisms seeing as you have been playing so badly. Anyway if the mafia had been more astute they could have worked it out straight away (well done to Caveman), and you weren’t the only one – Kleimar didn’t get it either. Gosh if they had been paying attention they could have had a field day. So it pains me that instead of admitting that you played badly, you try and blame the mod. It’s the Mod’s game, so he can do what he likes and if you don’t like it tough. When you are modding you chose the rules. It can be very easy to blame others when you are not concentrating. Think about it.

[Rick]

I had a pretty difficult game. In addition to Malaprop's reasons, both of my partners quickly gave themselves away. . . I think it would have been a tough game anyway.

Hey Caveman,

you did well

, don’t be disappointed. Just remember at the end of the first day, although your partners had given themselves away, there were plenty of people more suspect then yourself.

And

the Mafia did have help from the Town side

, think about it, after my claim,

vIQleS said, “Is he allowed to do that?”

and then after Bluesin’s humourous reply Quailman responded with:

No, he[Viqles] meant

Is Rick allowed to paste that portion of his role PM from the Mod?

Assuming that he is indeed on the good side, which I must admit looks likely at this point, let's hope he doesn't get mod-killed for that.

I don’t know how your partners missed that one?

With friends like that, who needs scum?

Your right it was a tough game for you, but if your partners had been more astute then the mafia would have had a field day. I’m sure you would have been a lot happier if that had been the case!

[Malaprop]

I'm never said I didn't make mistakes, Rick, nor was I attacking anyone for perceived mistakes.

[Caveman]

First, how can the mod kill me, if I have permission before posting?

Well, Rick, you are saying that you PM'd the mod to get permission, right? In that case the mod's mistake was in giving you permission. Most mods in most games would simply not allow what was done in this game. And this game shows why. The role PM's, if used word-for-word have an immense amount of data. Most of that data can be used to help the town. You played it right, but the mod just didn't want the mafia to win, oh well.


Rick, I'm not sure I get your meaning in the middle of Post 233. Could you elaborate? What were we supposed to notice?


And you want to hear something really funny? Remember how mlaker was spotted? Here, I'll remind you.

Did anyone else get a Congratulations! in their role PM?

This was

after

yggdrasil had been fingered. Here was my role PM.

Congratulations! You, along with Yggdrasil & mlaker, are a bacterium. Each night you may destroy any player you wish by sending me your choice.
Win Condition: You win when the number of organelles equals the number of bacteriums.

That's right, we had "Congratulations!", too.

[MeMe]

I personally think the game was set up well and wonder how things might have gone without the board funkiness -- which is what prevented mlaker from logging on to defend himself. I don't know that I would have

believed

him regardless of what he said, but it would have been nice for him to be able to make the effort.

Just like players learn a little more with each game...mods learn a little more with each game. If mods allow direct quoting of Role PMs, it's best to shake up the wording a bit from role to role

unless

the scum is terribly strong and the town needs all the help it can get. That said, I was happy with the game -- DB was attentive, accurate (more than most, anyway!), and wrote good roles. I look forward to playing in the next game he mods!

[MeMe]

DB - can we get full roles & night choices? I'm especially curious about what happened Night 1 that resulted in no death.

[Rick]

Malaprop,

After rereading your initial post, I see you did say:

These decisions are all mod's perogative

You are right. I was wrong. You were not attacking anyone for perceived mistakes.

Sorry,
~Rick

[Caveman]

Meme, mafia tried to kill Malaprop. But he avoided with his 50% nightkill avoidance.

[Rick]

Well, Rick, you are saying that you PM'd the mod to get permission, right?

Yes, I had permission via PM to say my win condition

word-for-word

, as long as I didn’t use quote tags.

that case the mod's mistake was in giving you permission.

Why? Surely each mod can do what he or she pleases – it is their game. And no one should criticise a mod for playing the way they want to. OK, if you want to criticise them you can do so, but you can't call it a mistake. There was no mistake.

Most mods in most games would simply not allow what was done in this game.

That is a fair point, but really it is irrelevant - as I've already said you can't say it is a mistake for playing the way he wants to. You may not like the way he plays, but it isn't a mistake.

The role PM's, if used word-for-word have an immense amount of data. Most of that data can be used to help the town. You played it right, but

the mod just didn't want the mafia to win

, oh well.

I wouldn’t go as far to say that the mod didn’t want the mafia to win, but I can understand why you would say that.

Rick, I'm not sure I get your meaning in the middle of Post 233. Could you elaborate? What were we supposed to notice?

OK – In more detail:

First I had permission to quote my win condition word-for-word as long as I didn’t use quote tags, which I did in post #83. Then Viqles said (#85)

Is he allowed to do that?

What do you think he is talking about?

He is talking about my post.

Well I couldn’t exactly post back and say, “yes, I’ve permission” – that would have taken all the fun out of it. Oh and it

was

fun.

Then Bluesin said(#86):

i'm on Rick side after read through the whole game. He [Rick] has posted something that make me believe his innocent.

And again Bluesin said (#87):

Is he allowed to that?

u mean am I given the chance to play? I think yes

Which I found rather amusing, and could have thrown the mafia off track.

But just to let the mafia know what was going on

Quailman said (#eightyeight)

No, he [Viqles] meant

Is Rick allowed to paste that portion of his role PM from the Mod?

Assuming that he is indeed on the good side, which I must admit looks likely at this point, let's hope he doesn't get mod-killed for that.

Heck,

he even highlighted for you

.

Come on anyone who was paying attention and reading the thread should know exactly what is going on. I am not being clear enough.

Let me state it again: I laid a trap, for the mafia to fall into (I just didn't expect town members to fall into it as well). However Quailman went and told everyone what I had done.

Anyone reading the thread should have know that I had as Quailman put it,

‘pasted that portion of my PM’

.

Surely no one can say they shouldn’t have noticed Quailman's warning. And if they do, then in future they should read the thread!

In effect Quailman was helping the mafia – which baffles me because if you don’t play to win then why bother?

And you want to hear something really funny? Remember how mlaker was spotted? . . . That's right, we had "Congratulations!", too.

Now that is funny. *falls of chair, laughing*

= = = =

Caveman, you had a tough game, but it was winnable, especially with Quailman’s help. Heck I would have been happy to have been in your situation on Day 1. You may think, oh, he’s just saying that, but I relish the challenge, you’ll just have to believe me. And think about it – Quailman was helping you, Malaprop was out of the loop as was Kleimar, and you could have claimed MeMe was Scum and had sold her buddies out to look innocent. Anyway I do think you played well, and maybe if one of your partners had twigged you could have won it. And I really mean that.

[Rick]

Congratulations MeMe,

I'd bet the farm that both Yggdrasil & mlaker are scum.

I don’t know how you do it, but that was one amazing bet. The mlaker part (not the Yggdrasil part).

In my experience anyone who bets the farm has inside information, so when you posted that I thought either you were scum and you were selling out your partners to look innocent, or secondly you were a cop and had already found mlaker to be guility.

Heck I was wrong on both counts, but I am impressed by your guts.

Mental note to self:

Never play poker with MeMe

(even if she says she doesn’t play – don’t believe her).

Which reminds me, anyone else if you are ever in London and want to join a poker game just give me a PM.

~Rick

[Malaprop]

Caveman: why target me night one? I mean, I feel all dangerous or something now.

[vIQleS]

Yeah - that quote from meme has been bugging me for some time now...

Did you know? Deduce? Guess? Are you really that good at this? Or did you have some sort of inside info?

(I'm not rereading at this time but didn't you start the caveman bandwagon as well?)

[Caveman]

Surely each mod can do what he or she pleases – it is their game. And no one should criticise a mod for playing the way they want to. OK, if you want to criticise them you can do so, but you can't call it a mistake. There was no mistake.

Okay, let me restate myself. I believe that some of the decisions made by the mod unbalanced the game (some more strongly than others) in the town's favor. I don't believe that the mod intended to unbalance the game when he made the decisions. Therefore, I believe that the mod's decisions were

mistakes

.
But, I could be wrong (though I doubt it), and the mod did intend to give the town an advantage. If this is the case, then

I

made an error in playing in this mod's game.

You played it right, but the mod just didn't want the mafia to win, oh well.

I should not have said this. I don't believe it, and apologize for it.

[bigbenwd]

.... dang that was a fast game, and a good one. yo be fair, the scum did have an easier win condition. instead of wholse town dead, it was just equal to number of organelles.

[Caveman]

Caveman: why target me night one?

Purely random.

vIQleS, I thought MeMe's quote made a whole lotta sense. She fingered yggdrasil because the win condition in Rick's post wasn't the convincing part. And he so totally didn't get it that she finally just gave up trying to explain it to him.

mlaker was probably fingered because of his "Who else got a Congrats?" quote. I think it was more luck in that case.

In my case, my claim had some inconsistancies in it. And, with kleimar claiming as the cop and clearing 3 others, that was enough. The town had enough of a lead to risk messing up.

[Malaprop]

bigbenwd: when there's more scum as there are town, they own the lynching. It's odd that it was stated as equality instead, but it still pretty standard.

[MeMe]

Did you know? Deduce? Guess? Are you really that good at this? Or did you have some sort of inside info?

This was immediate explanation for my "bet the farm" statement...

Sorry - that was quick and probably needs explanation...

Yggdrasil

- too late; sure he understands

now

.

mlaker

- wants to know if anyone else got "Congratulations" -- sounds like he didn't. And when he voted Malaprop it was with "definate scummyness" as an explanation, but I don't think he really understood the bandwagon because his back-up "huge almost vote" went to vIQles instead of Yggdrasil.

As for

Malaprop

, I'm not so sure about his scumminess anymore because, as I said earlier, he posted his role with the "Congratulations!" which could have been risky if he were scum. I have the same beginning to my role, so I'll go after the other one who didn't catch on quickly.

So, yeah. Total deduction -- mlaker's "Congratulations" statement caught my eye...but it was also the fact that he didn't vote for Yggdrasil, which he should have if he understood the bandwagon.

(I'm not rereading at this time but didn't you start the caveman bandwagon as well?)

Yeah, but I explained that as well -- it had to do with his claimed night choices not lining up with his day behavior. Sometimes I think it's just that I'm on the site so durn often that makes me the first to notice stuff. It's not that I'm better at the game...just the first reading and commenting on the scummy-sounding posts.

[MeMe]

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