Mini 1624: Joss Whedon Mafia: The Musical (Game Over)

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Why are people townreading Regfan now? Effort doesn't indicate town, and it feels like it's because of his longer posts and that reason that people are saying things like "he's mega town".

I should really be more active.

I'm townreading Regfan because the stances he initially took upon replacing in by setting himself up against potentially the most persuasive players in the game. I mentioned this in my list of reads and most certainly did not townreading him for posting "walls" or "content." He's also seeing eye to eye with me on a lot of points.

[eyestott]

Null for the inactivity.

Slightly scum for the quick defense when absolutely needed and 1496 being like you're almost trying to cover that up. It doesn't feel like a town thing to defend your inactivity like that, like you're scum trying to cover up a contradiction before it's pointed out.

wheres the quick defence?
Do i need to provide my results as evidence? like, a picture or something?

[eyestott]

Null for the inactivity.

Slightly scum for the quick defense when absolutely needed and 1496 being like you're almost trying to cover that up. It doesn't feel like a town thing to defend your inactivity like that, like you're scum trying to cover up a contradiction before it's pointed out.

Well, it wouldve looked worse if I hadnt said I was about to leave.
1495 was hardly absolutely needed.

[eyestott]

Will catchup as soon as I can.

Holy crap. So many posts in my sleep. I'll catch up when I can.

I will. It's hard to keep up when 100 or so posts are made in my absence.

Hey guys, I'm really struggling to keep up at the moment. You have no reason to believe me, but I am actually busy. I have my graduation ceremony today, but after that, I'm free from school. My only commitments should be my 4 mafia games. I'll try to catch up in time for EOD, though.

You're getting lynched, claim.

VOTE: JBVTB. Rolefishing much? I saw the Most recent Vc. You're the only one voting me.
Also, I've already pretty much revealed my role. If you're that interested in finding what my role is, read up.

PS, I'm just about to leave now. I just saw that and checked up.

As to why I've been nullscumreading you recently.

starts on sunday. Explained by my downness.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

a lazy slowroll town lynch.

Do you think that's what happened on day 1?

Let me rephrase this. I can see the distinct possibility of a town slow-roll today. I'm not strongly townreading F-16 (it's way closer to null, mostly because he knows he's found stuff that definitely are markers of my town game but he's waffling), but I realize I may have unrealistic expectations about his ability to untangle the morass of crap that I've generated this game.

Not entirely clear what you are saying here. Did you mean not strongly scumreading? Because your sentence seems to imply a weak townread. Does the waffling mitigate your townread or your scumread?

And I can see the possibility of town in Regfan's push because I don't know for sure how he forms reads. I know he's a meta-based player from the way he churned up the meta in the Space game if for no other reason, and he was doing that because Empire expected it IIRC.

You gave a rather interesting description of Regfan in the game I modded. You characterized him as a "let the game data come to me" player who is rather laid back. I remembered musing about how the characterization was rather off and was simply describing him as scum since Regfan as town normally is quite intense in his play and pretty adamant about pushing his preferred lynches through. Was there anything about his play here that altered your meta model of him from Mini 1516? Have you looked through any of his other games so far?

~~~

Going to re-read Eyestott and post about my read on him in a little bit.

[Regfan]

Drunk quite a bit with friends after work and training home ATM. Long post then. Not feeling the eye lynch.

[eyestott]

Hey feb, did you end up making a read on me?

[eyestott]

Regfan*

[Regfan]

Haven't yet, no. Reread your I so several times and couldn't get a strong read either way; agree entirely with ms in that you over playing the noon card rwsds scummy but certain posts of yours rwaf genuine. Will quote them when I'm not on a phone.

[Regfan]

Will respond to that wall when I have a computer after work but on s skim doesn't change my read at all and no I'm not going to jus 'trust' your read on her st all, would seriously put a lot down here she's msfia. A lot.

It's not just trust. I'm telling you to put extra emphasis on my read on ffery because I have years of experience with her. I've spent hours and hours understanding her meta so I can dodge her scumreads of me, and I'm telling you that as a player she is the person I've put in the most hours understanding, more than any other player on site. You disregarding my read when I'm telling you this is you disrespecting me as a player, and if you keep pushing ffery despite my read on her without reanalyzing anything at all, you're burning a lot of bridges between the two of us because the only way you keep pushing without hesitation is because you're drowning in your own ego.

Also this post alone makes nacho undoubtably town, there's no way he'd attempt to play this angle as scum. Also while he's wrong on moc (will elaborate on soob)) his convictions are ridiculously genuine as is ms's eye read.

[eyestott]

Haven't yet, no. Reread your I so several times and couldn't get a strong read either way; agree entirely with ms in that you over playing the noon card rwsds scummy but certain posts of yours rwaf genuine. Will quote them when I'm not on a phone.

ah, okay.

[Regfan]

Had his (nachos) well both predecessors as null-scim too but abdoulyely no way nachohydra scums play so far is scum.

Moc + yoncr + arcslot is my best guess ATM.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Regfan, while you are here, did you say that Istott played at a different site before?

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

What is PD specifically?

[eyestott]

Playdiplomacy.

[Regfan]

Playdiplomoxy, checked his meta, he's had an account there since 2009, lots of posts and currently hosts forum mafia games.

[eyestott]

Well, 600 posts. However, I only started back there again about a month or two ago.

[eyestott]

I have hosted a Dethy, and have a game in the works. I haven't finished any games there in years and years, but am currently in D6 of one over there.

[Murder of Crows]

Town

Jesusbuddhavrishnathebest -

I would hate to give up this read because I really liked LynchMePlease's play. Goblin could have eventually shaken the read, maybe. Looking at the hydra's play, I still feel that they look quite town. I've been kind of listening for something icky in Nacho's defense of me. The one time I can remember him strongly defending me when I was under a lot of suspicion and PoE-read, we were both scum. And the defense had an icky trollish feel to me. Here, he's expressing impatience/disappointment with my fatalism and trying to get me to buck up and play the game. The way he went after regfan for not reevaluating his read felt extremely, extremely town. And the way Mara interacted with Anti feels extremely town, and in fact has turned my Anti read around.

Antihero -

I didn't like his early day 1 play. I know that I'm influenced by Mara's read, but I feel like his mood fits the game state, and he's holding onto reads (like the yonce read) as much in an effort to keep some sense of solidity as much as from conviction. Or maybe I'm projecting. Anyway, He's moved way up in my list.

serrapaladin -

Nothing to say about him that isn't wrapped up by virtue of being mod confirmed town.

boonskiies - town for now because of his claims. If he makes it to lylo I'd probably break out into hives.

Kinda town

F-16 -

There were moments of thinking what I'm thinking when I'm thinking it with GreyICE. The main thing that bothered me was his AA9 read. As day 1 drew to a close, I leaning town, wanted him to be town because we needed some town backbone in this game, and I wanted him to be a driving force in the rest of the game. It's been really disconcerting to see F-16's read of me develop, and it's one of those cold comfort situations where I feel that if he's town then he'll come away from this game with a better grasp of the way my town play comes undone and disintegrates under stress. On the one hand, the focus feels at once tunnelly and shallow. He's picking up superficial stuff in looking back at old games, and completely missing what I feel is relevant in some of those games, which is what I've been calling meta gaps.

When I have time to think about this game in a less harried state, it will probably help in reading him (and fooling him) in future games. As to his alignment here, I'm at null-town, but recognize that the null part of that read is probably due to some of my own blind spots. Ultimately, I'll probably go with Nacho's read.

Regfan -

My major gripe with him is his predecessors. Nacho's long post to him explaining why he's townreading me gave me some insights into what Nacho thinks of his playstyle, which in turn helps me understand why he's so utterly convinced I'm scum to the point of partner hunting and pushing my lynch for all he's worth. I feel like it's a waste of time trying to interact with him as long as that read holds. and in fact he seems to have a very one-off style of case-pushing that doesn't invite interaction.

Yonce - This is the riddleton slot, and it will take a lot to shake that read significantly. Two things I haven't liked about Yonce is her joining in on the scum-read/partner-hunting at this late date when it looks quite likely that I'll be the deadline compromise again - and probably successful compromise.

Maybe Town shading to Not So Town

Egg -

As I keep saying, I really liked the way he swam against the current early day 2. His day 1 play had flashes of solidity, and when I read him in isolation I don't hate his posts as much as I sometimes do when I see them hit the thread. He's probably the player I'm most likely to change my mind on at some point.

Mikuru -

Nacho coming off a scum game with AA9 and having concerns about her play here shakes my read a little. I still feel (as a subject of her suspicion in both games) that the suspicion didn't feel the same in both games. And the way she replaced out also felt town. And I've given her possibly undeserved town points for the way she reacted/attacked serra. Mikuru's recent play hasn't done a damn thing for me. I feel like this slot needs attention if things continue to drift along the way they have today.

Eyestott -

I feel like his reads, such that they are, are extremely reactive. Some aspects of his play, including the reactivity feel very newbish. And it seems odd that even when I'm strongly suggesting that he look at players for reasons other than their stances/pushes on him it's like he doesn't see what I'm asking or he simply can't pull back and see anything besides what people are saying about him. It feels like he's haunting the thread. Most of the time when he's mentioned, he replies pretty quickly. All of this is stuff that I tend to scumread, except for the newb vibes, and coming from someone with newb vibes, it kinda automatically becomes less scummy-looking because newbs do it as any alignment. But, there are those occasional flashes of deeper insight, which suggest he's either more experienced than he appears (maybe it's where f2f strategies intersect with slower games?) or he's naturally got a handle on some stuff.

Medea -

Lack of activity, however well explained by real life is still lack of activity. Nacho made some good points about Cabd's play as day 1 wound down. The thing that bothered me was that he expressed an intent to make sure the mistakes of day 1 didn't happen again, and then did nothing about it. I think Nacho's concerns that Cabd didn't step up more in my defense are probably unfounded. I've fooled Cabd as scum a couple of times, and I think he needs a rock solid town read to do more than let someone (me in this case) sink or swim on their own. His approach to me in day 1 of the red wine game is a good example, though in that game my day 1 death spiral was to a large extent precipitated by his out of the blue push.

-------------

I don't have a strong scumread. Going through this exercise convinces me that I don't have a lurking strong scum read that was just waiting for me to realize it. Mikuru is the layer in my bottom pile that I least want to lynch. I'm also leery of lynching Medea today when Cabd may get his butt in gear day 3. Nacho's comments about suspecting but not wanting to lynch a player with a strong town game applies here.

I'm going to sleep on it, and see what Nacho's thoughts are tomorrow.

[eyestott]

Regfan, while you are here, did you say that Istott played at a different site before?

Where did he say that?

[Murder of Crows]

a lazy slowroll town lynch.

Do you think that's what happened on day 1?

Let me rephrase this. I can see the distinct possibility of a town slow-roll today. I'm not strongly townreading F-16 (it's way closer to null, mostly because he knows he's found stuff that definitely are markers of my town game but he's waffling), but I realize I may have unrealistic expectations about his ability to untangle the morass of crap that I've generated this game.

Not entirely clear what you are saying here. Did you mean not strongly scumreading? Because your sentence seems to imply a weak townread. Does the waffling mitigate your townread or your scumread?

No, I meant not strongly townreading. i.e., weakly townreading, somewhere really close to the town-end of the null spectrum and hovering at times on either side of that line between weak townread and nulltown read. My read has changed a little since then, more based on me getting some distance from our arguments than on anything that's hit the thread since then.

And I can see the possibility of town in Regfan's push because I don't know for sure how he forms reads. I know he's a meta-based player from the way he churned up the meta in the Space game if for no other reason, and he was doing that because Empire expected it IIRC.

You gave a rather interesting description of Regfan in the game I modded. You characterized him as a "let the game data come to me" player who is rather laid back. I remembered musing about how the characterization was rather off and was simply describing him as scum since Regfan as town normally is quite intense in his play and pretty adamant about pushing his preferred lynches through. Was there anything about his play here that altered your meta model of him from Mini 1516? Have you looked through any of his other games so far?

I haven't done a lick of meta research so far this game. As far as my impression of Regfan's town game in the Space game, it was pretty much 100% based on Empire's read and what he told me to look for when he had to abandon our hydra.

[Murder of Crows]

Countdown: 2 days, 3 hours, 46 minutes.

That said, not doing jack shit till I land back in California. (Not that we were doing much before, this is more a standard "y]]es I am still reading along" message)

And on a general note, it's down to a little over 24 hours to deadline.

[Antihero]

regfan,

your case on MoC is factually true, but it effected me differently than it did you. what you called manipulative i thought was town. i'm a sucker for AtE and i tend to think it comes from town more than scum.

i'll do this though
VOTE: yonce

[Murder of Crows]

Haven't yet, no. Reread your I so several times and couldn't get a strong read either way; agree entirely with ms in that you over playing the noon card rwsds scummy but certain posts of yours rwaf genuine. Will quote them when I'm not on a phone.

Who is ms? Mara?

[Antihero]

Crows actually made a good point, I think. Apart from serra (whose reason for scumreading me I still don't really understand) everyone calling me scum, namely Regfan eyes and F-16, seem to be pushing me based on an associative tell with Crows who's still unflipped.

nope

regfan already noted that your initial enthusiasm at "being town" seemed to wear off really quickly
there's also the case of your moc read that drifts off into nowhereland which is weird regardless of moc's alignment