Open 581: Making Friends and Enemies! (Game over)

[Titus]

Here's a hint.
Look at my probably odd looking interaction with Titus today.
I WAS WONDERING IF SHE WAS READING ME RIGHT.

I am reading you how you want to be read my dear. Thanks for covering. Wifom.

[Green Crayons]

@Kaboose:

So do you have a conclusion on all this you're trying to reach?

Conclusion: my scum read of dave is probably wrong.

Congratulations! You will take his slot in my scum pool of <Mala, Ranger, Kaboose>.

[Titus]

TTH, when you say something "hasn't been established" you are wrong and demeaning. GC did establish why Dave is scum, you just disagreed with him. To handwaive such evidence creates conflict. To be fair, I do handwaive myself but it's usually about gut cases and wifom. To have a case you spent time on dismissed without explaining why is not going to foster dialogue but tunnelling from both sides.

For instance, Swag saying Dave is town because OMGUS is recycled and worthless. OMGUS is more of a personality indicator. Swag is screaming Dave is obvtown for literally nothing. That's evidence Swag is scum and fabricating reads.

GC, Take a chill pill. It's ok.

[Green Crayons]

GC, Take a chill pill. It's ok.

So you're saying I

shouldn't

be drinking when I play mafia?

[Titus]

No...contrary drinking lowers inhibitions making people easier to read.

Chill pills and drinking can be mixed. Do not drink and drive though.

[Heartless]

drinking at 10:30 in the morning...?

gc... everything going ok?

[Titus]

I am supposing a different timezone...

[Titus]

Oh fuck he's Virginia...do not drink now lol.

[Heartless]

TTH, when you say something "hasn't been established" you are wrong and demeaning.

lol that was actually me, titus. and "wrong and demeaning" is my fucking middle name.

am i a rude shithead? yeah, maybe.
that doesn't make me wrong though

my point is that good cases don't START from the premise "X is scum, therefore [this action] is scummy because this is how it would play out if X were scum"

[Green Crayons]

Heh. I assumed Titus was reviewing Heartless/GC interactions from previous evenings, and not referring to posts from this morning.

[Green Crayons]

Also, Page 55 discussion with Heartless has been the most productive part of our interaction from my standpoint.

So, more of that.

[Titus]

I work backwards sometimes. Sometimes I fo random. I am a little ADD.

The facts were established to GC at that point. Just because you interpreted them dufferently does not make the case go away.

I do agree with your conclusion. It suggests GC has a gut read and looked to verify the gut read Dave was scum.

GC/ TTH, thoughts on Swag's weak ass tiwnread on Dave.

[Heartless]

/sigh
it's like i don't even exist to you titus

you break my heart </3

[Kaboose]

@Kaboose:

So do you have a conclusion on all this you're trying to reach?

Conclusion: my scum read of dave is probably wrong.

Congratulations! You will take his slot in my scum pool of <Mala, Ranger, Kaboose>.

I think it should be more like <Mala, Ranger, Swag>

[Heartless]

Also, Page 55 discussion with Heartless has been the most productive part of our interaction from my standpoint.

So, more of that.

we can move on to the lone ranger case whenever

[Green Crayons]

@Titus:

I assume it is ok to use posts in MD to our knowledge.

It's legal but it reads desperate as fuck.

Well, I was looking through those threads when I saw dave post. I was like "yay"

I don't understand why you think it's desperate.

swag's dave-is-town-because-of-a-MD-post basis was first made all the way back on Page 25 (Post 624), well after swag had unvoted dave in D1. And swag didn't even reveal what the post was at that time (I presumed it was an ongoing game).

Doesn't look desperate to me in the context of when swag first used it as a basis to read dave town.

Revisiting that basis for his dave read in D2, and making it explicit, particularly after folks had prompted him to explain his read, doesn't strike me as desperate.

[Titus]

Any use of MD reads desperate because of the fact that he's not using the thread and posts to argue his point. Sncient MD posts, while they could be accurate, are hardly relevant. It's akin to throwing a dart board.

He didn't revisit a read at all. He just put a weak "OMGUS" vote reason. Both town and scum OMGUS and you had been recently discussing Dave's votes.

[Green Crayons]

I disagree. The context in which swag initially brought up the MD-post looks pretty natural. He was reading the MD thread, saw something dave posted, and thought it clicked with dave's play in this game. And, bam, he posted his reaction in this game thread. At most, it isn't alignment indicative because that situation could occur regardless of whether swag is town or scum, but swag's handling of the situation looks more like town than scum to me.


Now that swag's MD-post basis to read dave as town was shot down, swag has moved to the justification of the OMGUS-vote basis. Reading someone as town in D2 simply because of an early, D1 OMGUS vote is pretty weak, I agree.

[Titus]

He was naturally reading MD threads fro a year ago? I do not. Most people can back up townreads with posts in thread that are not stale.

[Green Crayons]

At the time he made his original post, the MD thread was only 3/4 months old. Checking the MD forum now, that thread is still only on Page 2.

I don't read old MD threads either, but that's because I don't really enter MD all that much. Doing a quick forum search for swag, it looks like he has posted in 9 MD threads that started from June 2014 up until now, with 57 posts total. I don't know what the reading habits are for someone like that, but it's certainly not the same reading habits as someone who hardly ever posts in MD.

Also, it's not swag's "reading old MD threads" that is natural. It's the fact that he saw something dave posted in MD, and then how he conveyed that observation in this game, that looks pretty natural and not scum-based to me.

I suppose it's possible swag-scum did a forums search for dave (which I guess is how you're suggesting how swag found dave's MD-post), and concocted this round about way of introducing a post he found from that search. But that seems more (or at least just as) unlikely than the fact that swag was reading an old MD thread.

[Titus]

Sorry but his conveyance is fake as fuck too. People would reference then go grab. His manner of posting this was hyper defensive.

I am starting to think you could be scum witb Swag because now you're just making no sense. You're arguing that things transparently unnatural are common and smooth.

[Green Crayons]

Okay.

[Grib]

In the context of the player and how he went about reading dave, it looks really town.

Like, if anything, I feel your push on him for this is desperate and exponentially more suspect.

[Titus]

Welp. We lost. Scum win.

There's nothing genuine about pouring through MD to manufacture an argument someone is town. Unless the team is Swag, Grib, GC, town has lost.

[Green Crayons]

The problem that I have with your hypothesis is that you are assuming that swag was "pouring through MD to manufacture an argument."

On what basis do you have that this was how swag came across dave's MD post?