Open 587 - Nightless Vengeful Mayhem [Game Over]

[Wisdom]

Vote Count 2.4

theslimer3 (3)

-

texcat, Herodotus, BBMolla

Herodotus (1)

-

Sup-Zero

Sup-Zero (1)

-

Morgan

Not Voting:

theslimer3, TheCow, Teapot, pisskop

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Day 2 ends in (expired on 2015-03-01 01:15:23).

[pisskop]

You and Tex, chummer.
Slimer and Cow get honrable mentions.

Townreading BB, Hero, Morgan, Teapotslot

[pisskop]

yo pisskop

gimme all your reads please with cherries

You and Tex, chummer.
Slimer and Cow get honrable mentions.

Townreading BB, Hero, Morgan, Teapotslot

edit

[Wisdom]

Green Crayons replace Teapot, effective immediately.

[Green Crayons]

Sup.

Will start reading the thread now.

[Green Crayons]

Crayons

, mod.

[Wisdom]

lol whoops

[Green Crayons]

Not an uncommon mistake. Ain't no thing.

[Green Crayons]

Reading through, and lol ABR:

Right now, only vettrock would be safe from my hypothetical vig kill. Everyone else is fair game.

[Herodotus]

Townreading BB

, Hero, Morgan, Teapotslot

I don't understand the reason for the bolded.
Also, if you still think Sup is scum despite your discussion, why did you unvote?

It's remarkable how similar my reads and BBMolla's reads are despite how they differ from the reads of several others.

@theslimer3: You said your questions have been ignored, but do you have any questions right now?
And a question for you: do you think that anyone voting you is intentionally trying to mislynch?

I have no idea what the case on Sup-Z is. Does anyone wish to state it? After dissecting what pisskop posted in 615, I feel like nothing has been posted that is holding up to scrutiny.

[Herodotus]

@Mod: requesting prods as needed. theslimer3 and thecow, I think.

[theslimer3]

I guess that Vengekill thing paid off. At work, will get a good post out after.

VOTE: TheCow

Prod dodge! Slimey content later. Also ask me questions pls

UNVOTE: TheCow
VOTE: Slimer

You voted both of us at a time when we both admitting our in-activities and trying to get better (Well at least I was. Didn't bare much fruit to that, but I promise I'll be here more than I am)
You never really stated a reason why you placed those votes.

Why is that?

Another question for townies:

What do you think of scum!Sup-Zero?

He seems to be posting a lot of fluff and sheeping, but as far as a scum motivation behind it, I don't see a whole lot.
Most of what he says doesn't have much backing behind it, like post 165, and he seems to talk in short bursts of sentences, that don't quite seem too much content in those even. But as far as I know, being fluffy and vague isn't a scum tell. I have no strong feelings about anyone, but this one has a slight lean towards scum. But not enough for a vote, of course.

Prod dodge! Slimey content later. Also ask me questions pls

Is Sup-Zero scum, y/n?

Second verse, same as the first.

Theslimer3 ignores all three of the major pushes (vett, albert, teapot): http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p6587440

I wasn't on any of the wagons. What's that suppose to mean? Just because I'm not mainstream means that I'm scum for some reason?

Did you roll jester?

Scum tend to speculate on jesters more often than town because they know the person they're accusing isn't scum, so being scum doesn't explain the behaviour. That post looks very scummy. Wants no responsibility for voting Teapot:

What kind of bs logic's ass did you pull that out of? It was not only a slight sense of humor, but also my reaction of confusion as to why he was acting this way. It wasn't really understandable to me.

You sure seem testy when it comes to a lynch. Not sure if it's scum motivated since they know that there's a vig kill lingering over their heads.

VOTE: Teapot
Because I can say that I think the ABR gambit is probably not scum. I'm going to safely drink the wine placed in front of me

unvote; vote: theslimer3

Post 192 also looks bad from slimer now that vett has flipped scum.

What?
Your logic fails to make any sense to me and is vaguely explained as if you want to continue this wagon on.

Is lurking a tell for slimer? I've only had one town game with them.

I don't have tells. And I'm not lurking.

I played open 574 with a lurking town slimer not too long ago. Don't think I've seen the scum slimer.

I don't have tells. And I'm not lurking.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: slimer

Feeling this atm.

I still think hero needs to die regardless, but I'm feeling slimer's play is consistent with him being scum and am more confident there. Notably the questions he doesn't actually give a shit about, just trying to seem active.

First of all, no one is answering my questions. I could understand if it was one or two people, but this entire game, it felt like I was just pushed aside. And considering I'm usually use to being the center of attention, asking questions is the only way I can push myself back into the game. But even that was ignored.
Plus tell me a question that I wouldn't give a shit about of the answer to? I like poking things before coming to a verdict, this isn't something foreign and you've been in at least 5 games with me.

And before you come in and say "Molla, if slimer is scum, Hero is clearly town because of his crusade against him." I disagree. Replacing in and scumreading slimer-scum is very unrisky, especially when not many people were scumreading vettrock. Once vettrock died, it put his team in a shitty position, but I figure he figured it'd be better to try to go through with his bus instead of back off.

Hi

[theslimer3]

@theslimer3: You said your questions have been ignored, but do you have any questions right now?
And a question for you: do you think that anyone voting you is intentionally trying to mislynch?

Well it'd probably be nice if you went back and answered something I've asked you. They still carry relevancy in investigation.

But yes, I think my whole wagon is full of shit. But it should be fun debunking it

[Herodotus]

Theslimer3 ignores all three of the major pushes (vett, albert, teapot): http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p6587440

I wasn't on any of the wagons. What's that suppose to mean? Just because I'm not mainstream means that I'm scum for some reason?

It's not that you weren't on the wagons. My issue is that you didn't state an opinion on any of vett, albert, or teapot.

What?
Your logic fails to make any sense to me and is vaguely explained as if you want to continue this wagon on.

I don't understand your question. But I don't feel comfortable with your decision to vote for Teapot when your only mention of him is that he's testy and you're not sure his testiness is scum motivated.

@theslimer3: You said your questions have been ignored, but do you have any questions right now?
And a question for you: do you think that anyone voting you is intentionally trying to mislynch?

Well it'd probably be nice if you went back and answered something I've asked you. They still carry relevancy in investigation.

Searching for my name in your ISO, I see one question you have asked me before your last post, and I've already answered it. Who has been ignoring your questions, and why aren't you voting them?

[texcat]

You voted both of us at a time when we both admitting our in-activities and trying to get better (Well at least I was. Didn't bare much fruit to that, but I promise I'll be here more than I am)
You never really stated a reason why you placed those votes.

Uhmm, I did say when I voted Cow that promising to post content later and then not doing so is a scum tell IMHO. I did not restate that when I voted you. And BB later, when questioned, explained,

Interactions with vettrock

Play in general.

Talking for the sake of talking instead of figuring shit out.

Also still @Slimer, did you miss my questions? I saw your answer about Sup, but didn't see anything about Tea, nka GreenCrayons.

Could you just answer some of the questions already asked like, what are your thoughts on Sup? Also, are you planning on voting D2? You were a Teapot voter on D1. What are your thoughts on Tea now?

At least we got something, and looking at Cow's ISO we get more promises of things to come than anything else. His only 2 posts today:

I guess that Vengekill thing paid off. At work, will get a good post out after.

Ew, a vote on me.
If anyone is wondering why I died for a bit there, well aa lot of sleeping was had. Anyway, on topic. With yesterday's situation resolved, I'm feeling Tea is kind of townier. Though, my thoughts there could just be biased by the Lynch's results, I'm not sure. Will look into that further.

As Sup goes, their posts leave me feeling awkward. Could just be the style they're in, but it is quite likely the weirdness of their placements.

Tea is townier, but I can't imagine why, and again another promise to look into it further.
And Sup's posts make Cow feel awkward? I'm not sure what that means.

UNVOTE: slimer
VOTE: TheCow

[BBmolla]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: TheCow

Slimer and Cow interactions with vettrock are like identical.

I had Cow as town after having him as scum, I don't recall why.

[Green Crayons]

I'm most comfortable with voting pisskop, for these reasons.

Spoiler: IF YOU JUST WANT TO READ THE BOLDED PHRASES, YOU CAN AND YOU'LL GET A SOLID TL;DR VERSION, I PROMISE

1. droog's reference to thor-scum's Nightless Vengeful scum strategy at the beginning of this game (Post 37) struck me as off.

I replaced into that game, which happened recently, and thor's drag-it-out strategy wasn't exactly at the forefront of my mind when I started reading the game. With that in mind, I would think

scum

would be thinking about

scum strategy

at the beginning of the game.

So why would droog-scum quote thor-scum's Nightless Vengeful scum strategy? You pick up easy town points ("oh wow look he's revealing scum strategy") that doesn't actually hurt the scum team. It felt off when I read it, and I still think it feels off. The fact that pisskop, droog's replacement, later obliquely referenced this scum strategy in Post 414 makes my paranoia sirens go off.

2. I agree with my slot's prior observation that droog's early game play does not really "fit" with his usual play.

My experience has only been with droog-town, and droog-town is thoughtful and cautious, with a willingness to really pursue lines of thought. This game, however, droog looked hesitant and unsure, not quite really able to find a conversational hook to dig into.

3. vettrock-scum spoke to droog as I would expect scum buddies to interact.

A.

In Post 58, vett criticizes droog on a nonissue. As in, literally, vettrock criticizes droog for using the term "setup speculation." The basis to interact with droog is blatantly manufactured. Unsure whether it was simply for vett to have an excuse to post, or an excuse to at least interact with a buddy.

B.

In Post 86, vett accuses droog of scumslipping. There is no vote. "This guy is scummy, but I won't vote him." is scum buddy material.

C.

droog never responds to vett's nonsense. On it's own? Whatever, I guess, there were 10 other players besides droog and droog wasn't laying down a large post count. But weird because droog questioned a vett vote (Post 22, Post 36), so presumably vett was on droog's radar. With that in mind, droog's silence towards vett looks purposeful.

D.

Finally, when vett made up a scum list, he pointed to the lurkers out there as containing at least 1 scum: "I do also think it is likely that the scum is among the lurkers/useless, but not more than one. So Cow or Zymf or theslimer3. Slimer has increase his activity, so I'll put him as a partial member of this group." (Post 215.)

Notice someone who is missing? droog. The droog who, a week ago to the day had posted his last substantive post. The droog who, 5 days prior, had posted a V/LA. The droog who, shortly after vett's lurker scumlist, requested to be replaced out.

vett had already independently laid down the groundwork to throw droog into a scumpool. And droog matched vett's qualification of a lurker. And yet vett failed to mention droog as a credible scumspect when doing so would make vett look like he was actually contributing real observations to the thread.

4. The slot's voting pattern sucks.

- droog voted ABR on Page 1, Day 1 in Post 18, and never moved it off of ABR. SCUM MOTIVATION: aligns with my theory that droog-scum didn't really know how to manufacture suspicion on town players, and therefore was vote-frozen.

- pisskop replaced in and justifies a continued ABR vote with "I read up, and I'm happy with my vote being on ABR." in Post 268. SCUM MOTIVATION: per Post 244, this allowed pisskop to stay on ABR-town, which was a popular wagon, without having to actually come up with real suspicions. Easy scum play. (pisskop never justifies his ABR vote.)

- pisskop shifts his vote from ABR to Hero in Post 476. Why? "I trust BB and Bob." Which was enough, apparently, for pisskop to not have second thoughts about the fact that pisskop's #1 scumspect, ABR, had just voted Hero in Post 470. SCUM MOTIVATION: not even a hint of doubt or concern at alleged ABR-scum voting for Hero, which is what town would take into consideration. Of course, this wouldn't be a problem if pisskop knew ABR's alignment was not a problem in terms of who pisskop should suspect.

- Back to ABR in Post 492. There's nothing really alignment indicative here, inandof the vote itself, but I'll note pisskop is still riding simply on general thread sentiment to justify an ABR vote, but has never clarified which suspicions he agrees with.

- Moves to texcat in Post 502 based off of "Quick. Check 'last visited' dates on profiles" in Post 494. SCUM MOTIVATION: guilt-free justification to mislynch someone based off of JUST THE FACTS, GUYS, TOTALLY NOT MY FAULT WE KILLED A TOWN. Safe suspicion for scum to push.

- pisskop does finally spouts off some nonchalant "We were/are going to kill ABR for not posting or w.e." in Post 502. SCUM MOTIVATION: mushy justification that would be hard to pin against pisskop, and an ambivalence about killing ABR would hopefully help downplay his scumminess to ABR's vengekill. Of course, after all the time pisskop actually spent on ABR's wagon, pisskop certainly did miss the actual lynch. The scum motivation for that is crystal clear.

VOTE: pisskop

[Green Crayons]

Sup-Zero and Morgan are solid town reads.

[Green Crayons]

I thought The Cow's posting was noob town, but BBmolla's abrasive and brash posting was a virtual slap in the face, and I would be okay with The Cow's death.

[pisskop]

Too tryhard, bro. It'll only send you to the gallows after me.

[Green Crayons]

That said, I'm uncomfortable with BBmolla for two reasons, both having to deal with his predecessor Astinus.

1.

When ABR and vettrock were neck and neck for the first time, at L-3 each (per Post 150), Astinus was the one who swooped in to break the tie and voted for ABR, not vettrock, in Post 173. Being wrong does not make one scum, but man it sits uneasy with me.

2.

vettrock's Post 57 is another "This guy is scummy, but I won't vote him."


BBmolla, please be town.

[Green Crayons]

Too tryhard, bro. It'll only send you to the gallows after me.

Yeah.



My momma made my middle name "tryhard" and I just can't shake it.


Green tryhard Crayons.

[pisskop]

I've behaved consistent with my abilities. I'm not really good at finding scum off of superficial social tells. How the heck you all glaze over posting details and still manage to convince others is as yet lost to me.

I don't understand the reason for the bolded.
Also, if you still think Sup is scum despite your discussion, why did you unvote?

. Shinobi talked to me out of character, and I get that. It's an honest move.
I'm just not willing to blindly call him town for one post.

[Green Crayons]

@slimer:

is Post 661 your usual posting style? Several quotes followed by blocks to text?

[Green Crayons]

Uh, who else is there.

slimer: only problem I see is what could be considered active lurking (maybe due to real life issues, so not really alignment indicative), with using a bunch of catchup posts that, uncharitably, could be said are being used to look more active than she actually is. But maybe that's just because I have only skimmed the most recent pages and so haven't really delved into her posts.

texcat: only problem I had with her play was the "these two active wagons are on scummy people, but I'll go for a lurker," but that was a while ago and I haven't had a problem with her play since.

Herodotus: I see town.