We Didn't Playtest This | Game over, everyone loses

[deathfisaro]

@fisaro
Did you read what he said about confusing the silver reference with mining? I buy it.

That explains having 15 posts in a 3000 post game with a fluffy power role?
Flying so under the radar he must have gone underground by now.

Also do you think scums have obvscum powers that are also easily confirmable? Of course easily confirmable powers given to scum will be fluffy. I wouldn't say every fluffy power is scum's but my main question is the first one.

[copper223]

First of all he is a replacement, so his postcount is not as indicative as others and if we want to go that route why aren't you hard tunnelling the rest of the lurkers like for instance Boon? Second I can think of better ways to use his power and his flavour that do not include coming out to switch your vote on Drixx when he looked like the major wagon yesterday based on your PM flavour but rather sending in the prod to him in the hope he gets lynched. So all in all, can Lihin be mafia? Yes it's possible but unlikely.

[LucianRoy]

@Ozgin, Lucian, A wierd idea just came to me. Three hatted masonry. Lol.

Hat buddies unite!

[deathfisaro]

@Copper
Fair point.
1) Replacement happened 2000 posts ago.
2) Jackel? PV? It wouldn't be tunnelling if I'm pursuing multiple targets simulatenously since I can vote only one at a time and leaving the others unpressured is kinda meaningless in terms of pressuring with votes to draw them out of hiding?
3) Don't recall anyone at L-1 who he could have silent hammered by giving hate status.
4) Besides buying his "silver" thing, source of townreads?

[Toon Fighter]

VOTE: Copper

Why did you self vote here?

[LucianRoy]

Not to derail or anything, but I tried searching for a connection between "Berlin under-city mafia" and "eviscerating."
My efforts were fruitless.
However, I remembered something really strange in the back of my mind. If anyone has ever heard of the infamous serial killer "Jack the Ripper," he's known for eviscerating his victims.
Just thought people might like to know.
Wiki on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_the_Ripper

[Titus]

Not to derail or anything, but I tried searching for a connection between "Berlin under-city mafia" and "eviscerating."
My efforts were fruitless.
However, I remembered something really strange in the back of my mind. If anyone has ever heard of the infamous serial killer "Jack the Ripper," he's known for eviscerating his victims.
Just thought people might like to know.
Wiki on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_the_Ripper

Jack the Ripper is associated with London, not Berlin.

[Titus]

@Copper
Fair point.
1) Replacement happened 2000 posts ago.
2) Jackel? PV? It wouldn't be tunnelling if I'm pursuing multiple targets simulatenously since I can vote only one at a time and leaving the others unpressured is kinda meaningless in terms of pressuring with votes to draw them out of hiding?
3) Don't recall anyone at L-1 who he could have silent hammered by giving hate status.
4) Besides buying his "silver" thing, source of townreads?

Why didn't Lihn give this to a scumread lurker?

[Oranje Crush]

I made a fucking huge case twice and voted her, however I was

diverted by my partner

due to the cop claim and target.
Byw wgeurts is me.
What's wrong with the way I voted her?
You haven't looked at the cases have you?
Nor do you realise I started the lihin push.

Explain the bolded please.

BROseidon, my hydra head made us vote pika and told me not to change it after a rant about cop result procesures.

[Oranje Crush]

After pika was gone I could return to lynching lihin

[LucianRoy]

I know, but I tried linking the kill-flavour to historic background. This is what I found.
It might indicate that the flavor could be for an SK.
That was my point.

[Oranje Crush]

THAT's a scum role, making someone take 1 less to lynch isn't town.
Also her reasons are crap, she hasn't explained the first contradiction and she's basicaly admitted she only cared about the current suspects and talk.
Scum.
Lynch her.

[Oranje Crush]

She's claimed that she can make people have less time between posts and can make them take one less to lynch. How is that town?

[copper223]

@Toon
read the thread, Drixx says he is counting votes and asked me to, presumably because he thinks I may be hiding a double vote or some other status which I don't have.

@fisaro
My townlean on Lihin is based on his shift from Drixx scum to not lynching Drixx at an inopportune momemt for scum to do so which now is explained by the flavour he claims, the fact that he appears not to be much into the game, see his reply to who is scum on his wagon, which is consistent with a "can't be assed town replacement that thinks he can confirm himself at will" and because the speed you guys piled onto his wagon without a CW just based on a case from Wgeurts makes him more likely to be town.

[Oranje Crush]

I believe the role, however someone has to explain the town implications.
And the facts her reasons for defence were shit.

[Oranje Crush]

Also speed on wagons says nought in multiball, stop protecting your partner.

[BBmolla]

Jesus fuck Oranje is scum

where the fuck are the votes

[Oranje Crush]

Also the opportunism, your ignoring the third change of her drixx read. The mid day change.
Why BBmolla?

[BBmolla]

Amnesiac is more than likely something you'd make up than something that'd actually exist in this game wgeurts, and your push on lihin is a load of garbage imo.

[copper223]

Even in multiball it is likely the scum faction he belongs to would try to organize a CW, what third read switch?

[Titus]

Jesus fuck Oranje is scum

where the fuck are the votes

Who do you think their partners are?

My gut is screaming Drixx scum atm.

Wgertz is doing most of the posting and he reads a hell of a lot more scummy than broseidon.

In playing with elements, I attempted to wagon myself to force massclaim and he was still wagoned before me.

[Oranje Crush]

How is it a load of garbage, instead of saying stuff explain why.
If you believe some of these wacky claims how the fuck is mine unlikely?
I'm commuter amnesiac, fact and I'll continue to say wether I get a role or not each day. The commuter was pretty kuch confirmed by pika, why is the other part bad in your oppinion?
Read my seconds case copper.

[Oranje Crush]

Seeing how you guys all need it, I'm going to explain my top three problems with lihin in detail. Ignoring the fact she's not scum hunting and is as fluffy as a cloud.

1.

The "Catch-Up"

:

Partway through reading, commenting on top 3 wagons now (von, toon, vyse):
Vonflare - His posts don't feel like they'd come from scum pov; his pushes (ice particularly) and other posts like his #71+#73 leave him extremely low-hanging fruit and my gut says that scum would not be recklessly making himself look so scummy.
Toon Fighter - Do agree that he looks fairly lurky and low-contribution. Also has yet to address arguments against himself, and wants to put off neighbor claims for some reason. Leaning scummy, would hop on his wagon given choice between these 3.
VysePresident - I like what he does have, especially #1068 and #1273-76. Feels town to me.
VOTE: Toon Fighter while I sort out my thoughts on everybody else.

She starts her catchup with this post, it reeks. So for some reason she decides to look at the top three wagon at that point in time, then proceeds to hop onto the best one by sheeping. Newb scum love saying I agree with this case, then join it with those words. It makes them look like they have actual reasons to join a wagon, whereas they really just want to get on a wagon to get a nice tasty lynch.

I also find the motivation bad, why look at the top three wagons and not just start catching up? I see two possibilities:
1. As town, she's in need of a temporary vote before she makes her own reads during a catch up.
2. As scum, she couldn't give a damn about what happened in the past. She wants to join a wagon with a good prospect of becoming a lynch.

Her following two post back up the second motivation, why? Look at them and I'll explain:

Mostly caught up, still have pages 30-45 left.
UNVOTE: Toon Fighter

Drixx's claim is more believable to me considering ActionDan's claim. I'd rather he not be lynched/vigged today.

Some reason the quotes are swapped around when it comes to post time, please keep in mind the post above this came last.

@ozgin: Toon Fighter literally posted less than half a day ago and gave no indication that he is unable to post. I do not see why this warrants prodding. Also, he's had opportunity to defend himself (his last post was after attacks came in on him).

These two post show that she's following the current situation, however we see no comments or real reads (besides drixx, who I'll get to later.) on watch she thinks from her catchup. She never does, I really believe she hasn't done it at all. At the max she skimmed.
She's got no interest in finding scum possible mistakes during the last pages, she's only focused on who's being accused now.
The unvote is also rather convenient, it happens without reason (the post before it she was still displaying scum read on toon) and the wagon had just started to meet resistance and break down. So Lihin suddenely doesn't think toon's scum anymore and unvotes, she doesn't even switch votes (if she had actually done a catch up I'd expect her to vote someone from something she found during it.) and it's obvious she hasn't found anyone else she finds scummy. Looks to me like she's setting up to go in any direction, hop onto any wagon.

First questions for lihin:
Why did you unvote on toon?
Give a list of your reads on everyone please.

Summed up: "Lihin's more interested in current wagons and suspects than forming her own reads. Scum have no need of doing this and it fits a newb-scum very well. Her claim of catching up also seems bogus."

2.

Ozgin

:
Read these posts, especially the parts I made red:

Molla claimed Miller with a night-skip ability if they have the second highest amount of votes.
Ice claimed: Neighbour day-cop, a day-cop that can only investigate neighbours.
Drixx claimed to be a faction specific bullet-proof.
I claimed Vengilante, a one-shot mix of a vengeful and a vigilante.

I think that was everyone...

In my opinion those claims seem fairly townish, except for the bulletproof claim.

Does Drixx know which faction he is immune to? (not looking for an actual claim of which; just if he knows)

Scum reading Drixx

Mostly caught up, still have pages 30-45 left.
UNVOTE: Toon Fighter

Drixx's claim is more believable to me considering ActionDan's claim. I'd rather he not be lynched/vigged today.

Now he's town, however has reasons.

Just gotten to death's "reaction test". I've looked and it reeks of scum that death doesn't really seem to know what or who he was actually looking for in his reaction test. You're supposed to at least have an idea of what sort of reaction you're looking for when you reaction test? Were just you hoping to draw up whatever most suited your needs on the spot?

Don't like Drixx's defenses which seem to be reactionary counterattacks to whoever is attacking him despite any of their prior actions (attacking a mason?), and his claim is somewhat weak. I think there are better options right now though.

TPTG and others voting Drixx: how do you feel about a death/jackel lynch over Drixx?

Scum read (conveniently with the public opinion) and contradiction 1: she just said drixx claim looked good, now it's suddenly weak.

VOTE: PV
PV lynch is now feeling pretty unappealing to me. Utility lynch that leaves us with hardly any more information, especially if BBmolla nightskip is utilized. Only moving back if nothing else is going to be pushed through.
VOTE: Drixx
Agree with copper's reasoning.

This is probably the best feasible option remaining.

Lets look at this post by copper:

VOTE: Drixx
At least this is a lynch with little downside and my gut read may well be wrong because Drixx willing to lynch a random guy is not sitting well with me, that is clearly suboptimal and you know it.

Yeah this looks really convincing.

I've now got a strong gut feeling that Drixx is town because his name claim lines with my own role.
Jackel is a good target.
UNVOTE: Drixx
VOTE: Jackel

Oh, so now nobodies going for Drixx he's town again. Convenient.

She also lacks reads on everyone else. Also convenient. (Need I say, not scum hunting, sheeping everything and fluffing.)

3.

End Day 1 Play

:
She joined every wagon without a care, town would do this but with caution however her post displayed that she just wanted to lynch someone but didn't care who. That's scum motivation and thinking, you can't deny it.

[BBmolla]

why is the other part bad in your oppinion?

Because I don't believe either mod would use that version of it ever.

[Oranje Crush]

The part after 1682.