We Didn't Playtest This | Game over, everyone loses

[Titus]

@Elusive,

I wasn't subtle. We're massclaiming. What's yours?

The only roles that haven't claimed are yours, AD and I think Von.

[Cerberus v666]

Well, you wouldn't know this house, but I tend to be an extremely active player in terms of keeping up with threads, and I rarely vote early in a wagon, unless it's one I'm starting myself, because I don't trust anyone. So, I'll vote when I want, thank you very much.

The content of those posts is relevant. If they were all pure fluff prod dodging posts, then all we know from them is that ActionDan didn't say anything substantial. We don't know the reasons why. Now, if they were substantial posts about OTHER PEOPLE, and substantial interactions, then yes, it's very suspect the way he just dropped it completely for no reason.

[Cerberus v666]

Oh, because of the whole leash thing? Seems like a silly line of play to me. I don't understand why he would choose to be "leashed" but apparently that's a common enough practice around here for it to be a reasonable suggestion to make.

[LucianRoy]

In other words, Vyse knew he could easily attempt to paint Brantz as scum in my eyes because I was literally the first person to start questioning Brantz's reads and such. For some time, I really did think Brantz was quite scummy, but that wore off. Vyse's pursual did not. The opportunity was already taken.

[Cerberus v666]

AD claimed titus. Umm. Well, I mean, unless there's more to it than what he said on D1.

[House]

Well, you wouldn't know this house, but I tend to be an extremely active player in terms of keeping up with threads, and I rarely vote early in a wagon, unless it's one I'm starting myself, because I don't trust anyone. So, I'll vote when I want, thank you very much.

The content of those posts is relevant. If they were all pure fluff prod dodging posts, then all we know from them is that ActionDan didn't say anything substantial. We don't know the reasons why. Now, if they were substantial posts about OTHER PEOPLE, and substantial interactions, then yes, it's very suspect the way he just dropped it completely for no reason.

Nice try, but nope.

ActionDan doesn't just go wandering off in the middle of his suspicions. He's tenacious & doesn't let up until he's satisfied that his questions were answered.

Going from voting for Drixx, then slinking off to BBMolla, to bouncing around other votes and never again questioning Drixx is scum!Dan.

Again: He never gave any reason for leaving the BBMolla wagon that he was on for the stated intent of triggering on a Drixx lynch. Not once.

That's not town!Dan.

[Drixx]

I was actually going to propose that we use a leashed SK to kill me first, lol. A leashed SK is basically someone who is gonna lose either way but gets to keep having fun with a fun role, and it's really down to the town block directing him how it turns out. Again, you appeal to some prior game that

isn't THIS game

as if it has any bearing on this game. A replacement into an SK slot would almost certainly willingly leash to at least derive some fun out of things, and with a good town block, solid logic and PoE ... that's a huge town asset.

I'm just saying.

@House - How on earth am I fighting a wagon on AD? Are you certain he's not the SK and that there's no possible value to waiting for his replacement? If so, then let's go and get him dead and the nightskip done. Lay the case on me. Why is he more probably scum than SK? I'm pretty convinced he's SK because he claimed BP to "all mafia", but refused to elaborate about the names of the mafia. He tried to get me to tell him that. It's like a puzzle and all the pieces of it point to AD as SK being way more likely than AD as scum.

And if you only want to lynch AD because you think I'm defending him, then

please

lynch me first. I have negative utility to the town if my thoughts are just going to be brushed aside with the "regardless of" card. Right now, "regardless of" what I post or how much effort I put in, you decide that what I'm doing makes me scum. It doesn't matter at all what I say or do, you feed that into your "regardless of" mode and spit out "That's another reason you're scum".

At this point, I'm so frustrated by the irrationality of you and Titus that I'm tempted to quote my role PM ... only that would be rude, would have long term negative consequences that would far outweigh the perhaps 2 minutes it would make me feel good, and would severely harm town.


@Titus - Who the hell appointed your illogical and irrational person to decide what we're doing? Get down off that there high horse. You already got enough crow coming without adding more bad to chase the already bad.

[LucianRoy]

So your saying that Drixx thinks AD is the Sk, but is defending his wagon?
@house

[LucianRoy]

Oh, wtf leashed sk no way.

[elusive]

Cerebrus, thanks. SO that explains two mafia teams. Red and Orange? And SK is being speculated also?

For some reason I thought copper26 was still alive. He's dead which adds to his reads being important.

And Pirate Ika also really trolled him. Pika as it is was hard defending Trouser and so I think that is another scum. Also calls Brantz lynchbait which considering that Vyse tried to kill him means perhaps Brantz is aligned with Pika? Tbone is probably lean town based on them scum reading Pika? Toon is hated on by Pika and Vyse so probably lean town? Death comes up as a vote for Pika and a prod by Vyse. Defends wguert as a VI, why?

Brantz, Narnian seems more lean town. Ozgin as well due to asking Lucian to vig Pirate Ika. Oranje Crush also seems a bit better. Too many names and not enough context.

Does anyone know what Copper's role Facebooker was meant to do or if he might have crumbed anything?

Also I see that Ozgin is confirmed, but I don't see him in the live or dead players list? He should be protected and do we have any other confirmed mafia from him?

Why are "Tropical Volcano Lair Mafia ???" question marks at the end of Vyse's thing?

[LucianRoy]

Sk's always try to kill the people with the most information about them, it doesn't really matter if it's actually information on them.
At least, from whats usually happened.

[elusive]

Titus my role is conducive to certain things, can I crumb it to you (also just to make sure I can't refer to an ongoing game I and another player are no longer in to crumb right? Like I can't say its the same as X's role in X Ongoing Game?)

[LucianRoy]

The question marks mean his role was swept. A possible Janitor could achieve that.

[House]

@House - How on earth am I fighting a wagon on AD? Are you certain he's not the SK and that there's no possible value to waiting for his replacement? If so, then let's go and get him dead and the nightskip done. Lay the case on me. Why is he more probably scum than SK? I'm pretty convinced he's SK because he claimed BP to "all mafia", but refused to elaborate about the names of the mafia. He tried to get me to tell him that. It's like a puzzle and all the pieces of it point to AD as SK being way more likely than AD as scum.

I DON'T CARE!

Red is dead. Bottom line.

If he flips SK, it nulls my suspicions on your defense against his wagon because there's no obvious association there.

[House]

Oh, wtf leashed sk no way.

Exactly.

[LucianRoy]

Why don't the mafia factions trade kills? That's kind of weird in my opinion, but it will make the game go faster.

[House]

Cerebrus, thanks. SO that explains two mafia teams. Red and Orange? And SK is being speculated also?

For some reason I thought copper26 was still alive. He's dead which adds to his reads being important.

And Pirate Ika also really trolled him. Pika as it is was hard defending Trouser and so I think that is another scum. Also calls Brantz lynchbait which considering that Vyse tried to kill him means perhaps Brantz is aligned with Pika? Tbone is probably lean town based on them scum reading Pika? Toon is hated on by Pika and Vyse so probably lean town? Death comes up as a vote for Pika and a prod by Vyse. Defends wguert as a VI, why?

Brantz, Narnian seems more lean town. Ozgin as well due to asking Lucian to vig Pirate Ika. Oranje Crush also seems a bit better. Too many names and not enough context.

Does anyone know what Copper's role Facebooker was meant to do or if he might have crumbed anything?

Also I see that Ozgin is confirmed, but I don't see him in the live or dead players list? He should be protected and do we have any other confirmed mafia from him?

Why are "Tropical Volcano Lair Mafia ???" question marks at the end of Vyse's thing?

I replaced into Ozgin's slot.

[Cerberus v666]

OH, okay. SO what you're saying is you're really basing your suspicion off of his meta. That is, your unfailing ability to analyze the way someone plays in a certain role, regardless of the fact that when they're in the opposing role, they're going to deliberately attempt to stick to what they know to be the experience others have had with them.

You're like copper man. Such hubris.

Curious: Have you ever been in a game with town dan, where he disappeared slowly only to be eventually replaced?

P-edit: @elusive: It's actually been speculated since D1, with ActionDan and Drixx's claims of being bulletproof, and AD's claim including mention of being bulletproof to all mafia(or something along those lines, indicating a plurality there), that there could be three killing factions in this game. Two from one game, and one from the other game. We've had 4 flavors of kills so far. Eviscerate and Incinerate at night, shot through the heart mid day, on Pika who Lucian claimed he was shooting then, and nuked from orbit, which happened at the end of D2. There's certainly *potential* for 3 different scum factions in this game.

Ogzin was replaced with House. His lack of protection is because his initial claim, as Ogzin, was that he was a cop who gained bulletproof for a night if he found scum during the night, and during the next day that scum was lynched. House's claim was Macho Cop. You know what that means.

The scum factions we know of are Berlin Undercity and Tropical Volcano Lair. When Pika flipped, where those question marks are for Vyse, was his role of Modified Roleblocker, so the ??? indicate a limited flip. We don't know what mechanic caused this.

[Drixx]

House replaced into Ozgin's slot Elusive.

@LucianRoy - There are numerous examples of a leashed SK being a huge town asset. Although, now that I consider it for a little more, trusting House and Titus (on the assumption they're town) to properly point a leashed SK perhaps is a bit too risky. I mean, Titus already admitted to royally screwing that up once before, which is why she doesn't want to do it again. I suppose that the rational conclusion is that it shouldn't be attempted with someone like Titus driving the game, given that she flunked at doing it already before.

I still think that there's something fishy about Titus trying to undermine key elements of what are logically really difficult to destroy parts of a town block. Enough of the people I view as town are uncomfortable with the idea of leashing an SK, so there appears to be little reason to wait for an AD replacement since I'm fairly sure he's the SK.

VOTE: ActionDan

{Tinfoil hat time} - I assume scum have investigators. What if Ozgin was from a different mafia faction than Pika, and used the whole "If I find and get scum killed I am BP the next night" thing as a way to distract from that? I mean ... even I've been treating House as town because I was assuming Ozgin is town ... but I now realize that we don't actually have any rational reason to believe anything about that slot's alignment. Just saying. {Unless I missed something while I was actively trolling the game and not paying attention, and simply didn't bump into it yet while re-reading portions of the game. If I missed why that slot is supposed to be town, please point the way}

[LucianRoy]

Narn really needs to gather up the info on his role. It's really, really weird.

[House]

House replaced into Ozgin's slot Elusive.

@LucianRoy - There are numerous examples of a leashed SK being a huge town asset. Although, now that I consider it for a little more, trusting House and Titus (on the assumption they're town) to properly point a leashed SK perhaps is a bit too risky. I mean, Titus already admitted to royally screwing that up once before, which is why she doesn't want to do it again. I suppose that the rational conclusion is that it shouldn't be attempted with someone like Titus driving the game, given that she flunked at doing it already before.

I still think that there's something fishy about Titus trying to undermine key elements of what are logically really difficult to destroy parts of a town block. Enough of the people I view as town are uncomfortable with the idea of leashing an SK, so there appears to be little reason to wait for an AD replacement since I'm fairly sure he's the SK.

VOTE: ActionDan

{Tinfoil hat time} - I assume scum have investigators. What if Ozgin was from a different mafia faction than Pika, and used the whole "If I find and get scum killed I am BP the next night" thing as a way to distract from that? I mean ... even I've been treating House as town because I was assuming Ozgin is town ... but I now realize that we don't actually have any rational reason to believe anything about that slot's alignment. Just saying. {Unless I missed something while I was actively trolling the game and not paying attention, and simply didn't bump into it yet while re-reading portions of the game. If I missed why that slot is supposed to be town, please point the way}

I don't give a damn if you think I'm scum, as long as you help me lynch ActionDan, so thank you for that.

Feel free to pursue your paranoia at your leisure toMorrow.

[Cerberus v666]

Drixx: He would have stuck with the original claim then, and not downgraded it to Macho cop, if he was actually scum. Pretty sure he's town.

[Drixx]

Paranoia is healthy for townies in mafia. It's multiball, so Ozgin serving us up a scum just doesn't automatically make his slot town. That's all. Would I suggest we lynch you anytime soon? You would have to play

really

scummy for that, but now that you've contradicted Ozgin's claim and claimed Macho, I probably wouldn't have the opportunity to get that paranoid anyway, right?

[Titus]

Titus my role is conducive to certain things, can I crumb it to you (also just to make sure I can't refer to an ongoing game I and another player are no longer in to crumb right? Like I can't say its the same as X's role in X Ongoing Game?)

Correct. If it's ongoing, even if the flip is mod confirmed, you cannot mention it. This is where I tend to go more similar roles. For instance, if I was to say House is the answer to The Question when I was a murderous crocodile and you were a benevolent suicidal cat, you'd find the game where you were a "cat" themed role and I was a "crocodile". Given the Question was the cop, you'd solve and deduce House was a cop here. You can get creative using the past.

[Drixx]

Drixx: He would have stuck with the original claim then, and not downgraded it to Macho cop, if he was actually scum. Pretty sure he's town.

Because scum never gambit right?

{Remind me to point you to a game once it's over. There's something there that will blow your mind. This is totally tangental.}