We Didn't Playtest This | Game over, everyone loses

[Drixx]

And Deathfisaro joins the Commonwealth on the suspect list for pushing for BRantz to use up his last escape shot based upon an off chance moonlogic reason.

Anyone else?

[Titus]

Oh look, Molla was telling the truth and night was skipped.

Hey Titus, why were you so against that again?

Like, I mean, I get that you were finally down for it day 4


but we had more investigatives alive Days 1 and 2

I wasn't. Everyone else was. I lost the argument. I wanted to ensure an extra day. Yeah we are not timing there though.

Plus if you believe Death and Boon are town skeptic cops with a night trigger, skipping only hurts those cops.



I agree Brantz should be using his shot.

[ChriVi]

@death I agree with you on a lot of things... But BC is not lynchable yet. I'd rather deal with him at M/Lylo so that we can play off his ability as essentially a doctor.

Doing some ISOing on some of the lynchables, also looking at VCs or more info.

[deathfisaro]

BRantz should use his last shot today, and if elusive really is vengeful I suggest she shoots...well, I don't think she should shoot death, but I do think her shot should be within (narn, Drixx, Plotinus, PV). I'd include Titus but she's stumped today, so meh.

Why do you want BRantz to use up his get out of lynch free cards today? Do you want the WiFoM of whether to target him with your nuke from orbit to be gone? Would really suck for your team if he holds that last one and outguesses you huh?

Okay this is a good point. So we know at least BC wouldn't have put a delayed kill order on BRantz last night. Let's flip BC today and let BRantz use his power tomorrow?

And Deathfisaro joins the Commonwealth on the suspect list for pushing for BRantz to use up his last escape shot based upon an off chance moonlogic reason.

Well my reason wasn't that at all, THIS post is the joining post. How are you reading the future? I was literally typing this up when I saw your post.

[Titus]

Well we can infer that werewolves do not nuke from orbit given that Lucian was shot.

Funny how my hat buddies keep getting shot.


@Bulba, do you trust me? I would like to try something.

[ChriVi]

Let's flip BC today and let BRantz use his power tomorrow?

No. Town can play off of his ability, even if he's scum. I'd be much more comfortable with him at M/LyLo than some of the other roles (Like Titus's)

[deathfisaro]

@death I agree with you on a lot of things... But BC is not lynchable yet. I'd rather deal with him at M/Lylo so that we can play off his ability as essentially a doctor.

There isn't a good way to selectively JK players who used a night action on you, and yet BC said they hinted that multiple reflexive JKs happening in the same night is not possible.
(He said it when I brought up the idea of active power roles mass-targeting BC every night and having a jail party.)
I'm thinking the ability could be shot-limited and those shots are already up.

[Titus]

ChriVi - I agree. I want to see which roles fit what setup.

[deathfisaro]

Well we can infer that werewolves do not nuke from orbit given that Lucian was shot.

???
Drixx, someone left home without logics.

[deathfisaro]

Let's flip BC today and let BRantz use his power tomorrow?

No. Town can play off of his ability, even if he's scum. I'd be much more comfortable with him at M/LyLo than some of the other roles (Like Titus's)

Okay maybe not absolutely tomorrow, but there is no way you can guarantee BRantz safety until that scenario.

[Titus]

So, who thinks both of these kills were targets from each mafia faction?
At first glance, I'd say BU faction targeted Vyse, and Tropical faction targeted copper, for obviousness implied.
Also, I think it's safe to rule out an SK at this point.
Now that there are two flips, each from the opposite faction, it should be way easier to look back and determine who was doing what, and why.

This is groundbreaking.
I would have never made the connection "Volcano eviscerates" and "Berlin incinerates"

When Narninian comes back it'll be clear if there's a scum bus driver (if so, probably Berlin?) or it was just a successful kill redirect.

I have been saying that indirectly for awhile.

What about:
Volcano eviscerates, Berlin nukes from orbit, and werewolf (SK at this point since the former two had mafia tag at the end) eviscerates?
Because the lack of existence of werewolves makes Drixx vanilla in a vanillaless game. Unless Drixx fakeclaimed.

Explain this post if you're a werewolf cop Death?

Wouldn't that have made you a vanilla player in a vanilla game?

[Titus]

Well we can infer that werewolves do not nuke from orbit given that Lucian was shot.

???
Drixx, someone left home without logics.

What werewolf pushes the guy they nuked from orbit?

[deathfisaro]

@ChriVi
And supposed BRantz's town, removing himself in situations like LyLo 3T v 2S,
it still takes 3 to lynch after removal and yet there's 2T and 2S. TownBRantz's removal in LyLo guarantees town loss, as the best town can do is no lynch during the day and losing at night and the worst is losing during the day outright.

[Drixx]

ChriVi ... you're conftown. Why do you believe that BC is a reflexive jailkeeper or whatever the claim is? That seems pretty overpowered for a scum role. Anything that targets the slot fails?

Of course, there are already some balance issues that have cropped up from having 2 games mashed together. For example, once I became pretty sure that the SK was Werewolf I realized that I was the balance to the SK. If the SK was going to win, she needed to get me lynched, or else in a 3 player endgame with me and the werewolf and another townie ... I guaranteed a town win. This is probably why OM put that awful case together against me on day one. (The case was awful because it was based upon early day one stuff, which is almost never alignment indicative outside of someone making a huge slip. It was even worse because the central criticism of me talking about myself was invalidated by the fact that I was responding to people's questions). That's also why I was pretty comfortable with the idea of leashing the SK. If the town had trusted me (if I hadn't been so irritated with the drama that I started actively trolling the game perhaps you guys would have?), we could have really safely leashed the SK because the SK couldn't kill me, so end game betrayal wasn't possible. Any betrayal earlier and we could have just killed her ... so basically we could have very safely leashed Elusive and had a lynch plus a nightkill on our side, which would have forced the scum to kill her.

Obviously since basically nobody really trusts me, my argument for why leashing was a good idea will only make sense once you see my flip and realize that I'm being honest and I had thought it through. It's too late now, but I think we should have leashed her and let her have some fun so long as she stayed properly leashed. She couldn't have won so long as I remained alive (so the moment scum killed me, she had to be lynched). My best guess is that had we leashed her, scum would have felt forced to kill her. We're starting to have too large a town block emerge for scum to reasonably be able to eliminate before PoE catches them.

Kind of rambling with this post. Sorry ... my pain meds kicked in and I'm not really being concise. I'll just go play Diablo 3 for awhile while my pills are making me less coherent.

[Titus]

Drixx, I am not engaging anything you say until you are in a better state or one week. I had an accident that I still think outed me as scum. I am betternow, but that's a terrible way to be lynched.

[Titus]

It's not lylo, so we can afford it.

[Drixx]

Well we can infer that werewolves do not nuke from orbit given that Lucian was shot.

???
Drixx, someone left home without logics.

I don't fully understand what Titus does or how she does it. I don't think she really reveals her process in games. I reviewed some of her completed games and it's hard to argue with the results. My guess is that there is some kind of underlying system that she uses and just doesn't explain. I do have some serious issues with some of the irrational arguments she posts, but lots of people have problems with some of the quirks of my play, so I think it's a live and let live sort of situation.

[deathfisaro]

So, who thinks both of these kills were targets from each mafia faction?
At first glance, I'd say BU faction targeted Vyse, and Tropical faction targeted copper, for obviousness implied.
Also, I think it's safe to rule out an SK at this point.
Now that there are two flips, each from the opposite faction, it should be way easier to look back and determine who was doing what, and why.

This is groundbreaking.
I would have never made the connection "Volcano eviscerates" and "Berlin incinerates"

When Narninian comes back it'll be clear if there's a scum bus driver (if so, probably Berlin?) or it was just a successful kill redirect.

I have been saying that indirectly for awhile.

What about:
Volcano

eviscerates

incinerates

, Berlin nukes from orbit, and werewolf (SK at this point since the former two had mafia tag at the end) eviscerates?
Because the lack of existence of werewolves makes Drixx vanilla in a vanillaless game. Unless Drixx fakeclaimed.

Explain this post if you're a werewolf cop Death?

Wouldn't that have made you a vanilla player in a vanilla

less

game?

Well I made a mistake and never realized, apparently nobody else did either =P And so did you.

After my claim, some people were still not believing in the existence of werewolves and accused me of fakeclaiming. I was saying that would have made Drixx either vanilla or fakeclaming scum.
Of course it would make me also vanilla but people were doubting my seer claim already anyway so I had no reason to state that case. At least I was strongly believing that I wasn't vanilla and werewolf had to exist in this game.

Also noticing how it took 2000+ posts to prove that I was right about werewolf being the SK. People were saying how it couldn't be, saying things like

I. This game will use no factions other than what is considered normal (town, mafia, werewolf and serial killer).

this meant werewolf and serial killer had to be separate entities, etc.

[Titus]

Death, supposing arguendo that you are right and werewolf is SK, why is SK immunity a town role?

[deathfisaro]

Well we can infer that werewolves do not nuke from orbit given that Lucian was shot.

???
Drixx, someone left home without logics.

What werewolf pushes the guy they nuked from orbit?

You, the person who brought up the idea of leashing the SK, don't believe her when she said

Don't hammer,

I'm the SK

but I've been obviously pro town. And

I forgot to put in a nk

because nights are short and I lost track. Town can direct my kill.

Yesterday there was 1 missing kill flavour and it was eviscerate.

[ChriVi]

ChriVi - I agree. I want to see which roles fit what setup.

If cerb wasn't dead I'd just have him investigate that for you... Damn I shoulda protected Cerb that night too (although conftown is nice and his investigative part wasn't that amazing)

I really think cerb's role's main part was the one-way mason so if he gets killed he can conftown.

Also he investigated one of the mason's and found they were made from a different mod than me and Cerb so I find their masonry much more likely..

Titus, give me your reads. Like, a full reads list. It'd be nice, and I like the way you think.

[deathfisaro]

Death, supposing arguendo that you are right and werewolf is SK, why is SK immunity a town role?

ISO me, and find at least half dozen posts where I say I consider AD/Plotinus BP to both mafia claim true and town, but I consider Drixx BP to werewolf claim true and half/half on town/scum.

It is a very underwhelming town PR, since 2 factions of ~6 scums shooting has a FAR greater chance to land on you than 1 faction of 1 SK shooting. On the other hand, it sucks to die to SK as scum in a random crossfire.

[Titus]

ChriVi - I agree. I want to see which roles fit what setup.

If cerb wasn't dead I'd just have him investigate that for you... Damn I shoulda protected Cerb that night too (although conftown is nice and his investigative part wasn't that amazing)

I really think cerb's role's main part was the one-way mason so if he gets killed he can conftown.

Also he investigated one of the mason's and found they were made from a different mod than me and Cerb so I find their masonry much more likely..

Titus, give me your reads. Like, a full reads list. It'd be nice, and I like the way you think.

Can you wait for me to do a VCA?

[deathfisaro]

Death,

supposing arguendo that you are right and werewolf is SK

, why is SK immunity a town role?

Wait... It just occured to me that it seems like you've completely missed D4. This is D5. Things happened yesterday.
I thought you were trolling but I think it's possible that you just mistook D5 as the day after last night which was N3, not N4.

[Titus]

Gut off the wall read again, BB and Narnian are scum and Narninan did redirect off of BB.