Team Mafia: Young and Beautiful

[Aneninen]

As for Ika

– first of all, I must point out something. In 1435 I told that I would post more about Ika a couple of days later.

Noone

has asked anything about that. How is it possible?
– I won't repeat everything I wrote in my catch-up posts. I only elaborate one thing, his interactions with BBT. It has been going on throughout the whole game, but as posted in (11) of my last catch-up, it suddenly stopped there with no conclusions. I had assumed they're faking (in my 4th catch-up, 1108, (8).) Also, mind the (2) in my last catch-up. BBT was not on the list! According BBT's Day3 I strongly think that the whole Ika/BBT fight is a big fake. None of them have been in a real danger of lynch so far...
– By the way, chatchup 5/(6) is a thing why I doubt Wgeurts's scumread on Zach.
– the most important thing why I wanted to wait with my read is a meta-thing. This game: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=61136 finished and Ika was the SK there! I was checking that game every now and then (after all, that was the first case ever when my Setup was played)... and meanwhile I realized that it could be useful for me to sort out Ika. His style was the same there as it is here! (I'd been thinking that he'd been scum there for a while but of course I couldn't be sure before the game ended.) Also, something more about Ika. It's a parallel site activity so I'm not allowed to give any details, but his parallel activity doesn't add up.

Anything to add?


The CES-part:

Spoiler:

Wgeurts's reasons (and my comments in brackets)

– His early gameplay show mindset where he's trying to solve the game. (I didn't notice this but whatever.)

– He never jumped on the Psyche nor the Elk wagon and those were two easy-to-push wagons. Tammy and Aeronaut have both flipped town, he believes Regfan is town. So, there must be a scum on the Elk wagon, which means BBT or Zach. Both of them if Ank isn't scum. (Note: Ank was parking on the Psyche-wagon. We're conflicted on BBT and Zach, this topic will be elaborated later.)

– Meanwhile, CES had his own thoughts, he was following them instead of "going with the flow". This is something town should do. (Actually I was miming this as scum in some games but yes, Wgeurts may be right. CES could have joined either of the major wagons.)

– He was also pretty justified in his voting of aeronaut. He'd already showed suspicion earlier and his two top solid town reads where on the wagon. If I (Wgeurts) had the same reads as him in this situation I would have joined that wagon as well. it looked like a wagon which is built up off town only which usually leads to a scumlynch. (If I have time I'll double-check this. If Wgeurts's right, the whole cornerstone of my previous FoS on CES turns into nothing.)

– The worst people on the Aeronaut wagon were ika, zach and elk. Elk seems to be a lynchbait thus zach and ika are scum. (He was talking about the lynch-wagon with these names: Regfan, Llamarble, CES, Tammy, Zachrulez, theelkspeaks, ika. I'm not sure whether there were two scums on that wagon. My personal thought: Ankamius joined the Ika-wagon when it was sure that it wouldn't be a real counter to Aeronaut.)

– He started off the next Day by pushing his own scumreads instead of the most likely lynches. Throughout the game he's been doing this. (I noticed the same on Day3.)

– in 993 he was trying to figure out if a scum!psyche had been lying and making stuff up from our team (he meant 993 here. As for this, I've never been thinking about this post in this aspect. But at that point I had read nothing of this game.)

– he didn't freak out at the wagon that grew on him at some point, no survivalism. (Hmmm... that's not a big tell in itself but along with the others...)

My own reasons

– There was an Aneninen#Unexpected_Gamestall situation on Day2. (I pointed it out in my last catch-up.) Whenever I see this I start thinking that neither of the major wagons are on a scum. (Partly because of this I was hesitant to jump on either of those wagons instantly.)
– He was the one of the very few players who were actually talking TO me instead of talking AT me. (I'm still saying: townies are trying to sort out players and interacting with them is a good way to do so. Scummies can throw out "scumreads" without proper reasoning. Especially on players who're already wagoned.)
– His whole interaction with BBT on Day3. His answers to BBT seem to have come from a town mindset.

As you can see I hinted that we're conflicted on BBT and Zach.

[Aneninen]

Also, doubt my BBT-read (but that could come later). I think he may be caught later if someone starts thinking that we've been going against each other when my lynch has become inevitable. We need to put him and Zach in the same cathegory, I suppose.

(In general, I still don't know whether I've f-cked up this game or I've been simply unlucky by being under crossfire of two tunneler, Ank and Anti.)

[wgeurts]

Speak of Ika's lol hammers and point to kagami in the game I died in, she lol-hammered and was scum.
Give me an afternoon and I'll post my reasons in detail.

[wgeurts]

You've been unlucky, psyche put you in a hard position as BBT said.

[Aneninen]

I'll need to post soon but as for Ika, I'm telling that you think his vote pattern is terrible in general.
I'm unsure whether I'm allowed to mention your game.

[wgeurts]

Relook the rules, I thought that if someone's dead it's allowed. Not sure though.

[Aneninen]

So, posted. I need to do other things as well, so I had to post. Make sure that you don't contradict me as for Ika.

[wgeurts]

Doing well, people have stopped talking about you.
Possibly ask BBT to lay of the bussing a lil' bit.

[wgeurts]

The awful reads list is the last thing they expected, it seems to be working

[Aneninen]

We're working on it with BBT. He need to slowly develop a scumread on me because of CES lol. And eg. I'll ignore his question about Elk lol.
If you have any additional thoughts on Ika (scum), Zach (scum) and BBT (town), fire them away!

Oh en... Gefeliciteerd Met Je Verjaardag !

[T-Bone]

So I got real excited for a moment and fucked up my claim so I'm probably getting lynched today. But it's alright.

[Aneninen]

Well, I shouldn't have been an egoist and we should have focused on the other games too.
What's your exact role again?

[wgeurts]

Some points you could use against ika:

She starts the game off by scum reading elk and pushing him, while never actually voting him. It doesn't make a lot of sense. Then she votes Aeronaut while he's at 4 votes without any explanation in #515. To make matters worse she then also unvotes in #519 without any explanation. This whole blotch of play is weird and feels to me like playing in a way that allows you to take any chance however the game flows. The Aero vote is also plainly opportunistic, the unvote makes it worse showing she never really scum read him.
Not to mention she says she's unvoting just so she can hammer, that's not pro-town play. I honestly don't think she gives a crumpets who's getting lynched (she conveniently forgets elk when people move off of him), a scummy mindset.

Anyone claiming this is due to lack of time or disinterest can go stick their heads in a toilet as she's actively reading other games in team mafia and aiding other team members in them. Like how she helped ZZZX in nightless where I died in.

She completely stops hunting for scum when BBT puts a scum read on her. She then tunnel's on BBT and tries to disprove the read, not pro-town and survivalistic.

Oh, she also hammers Aeronaut without ever putting a read him. This is complete bullshit and lol-hammers are something scum do as well to cause WIFOM. Just ISO kagami in vanilla nightless from team mafia.

#739 and then #754 show that's she just trying to find people who will get lynched. Once again she's not pushing anything herself except her tunnel on BBT.

#812 her read on psyche unexplainably changes to scum after being town earlier.

Basically ISO her and you'll find a tonne of points showing how she's basing her reads of who's likely to get lynched and not pushing people herself.

[wgeurts]

Heavy tunneling a player is also a good scum strategy, once again go tell them to ISO Kagami in Vanilla Nightless.

[Aneninen]

Wow, good points!
Luckily, I can use them in another post, since Ika asked for

my

ideas, thus I can still back the Ika-case later with your thoughts.

I don't think I'd like to tunnel. It's a so good scum strategy that I've used that in almost every scum-games. (By the way, remember C9++ lololol!)

I'm thinking about that if Ika engages me in conversation again, I'll vote for BBT to check whether he follows me there. If not, wow, scum found. If so, in worst case we'll have two major wagons with a little luck... and after my lynch noone would think that the other wagon was scum too... (I can imagine a "after he failed to push the Ankamius-wagon, launched the BBT wagon so as to build a counter and not to out his buddies" kind of town-thought.)

[wgeurts]

You got the title!

[Aneninen]

Yeah, wow! Thanks again! ^_^

[Aneninen]

Well, I don't think we could avoid my lynch Today. More precisely, I don't think we

should

. I think it would cause more problems if we mis-lynched because without our joined push no wagon would get even close to lynch.

However, if it's carefully organized, BBT can end up voting for me, maybe Regfan too... and there will be quite a lot of mislynch-baits for the next Days. (Elk, obviously, but also CES and Ika if they're too slow to vote for me.)

[T-Bone]

Sometimes riding the bus is the way to win. Play it out the way you think is best.

[Aneninen]

You're right.
Sometimes you're worth more dead than alive. ^_^

[wgeurts]

Unlucky, you played well.
Do you want to help with T-Bones/Esp's game now or do you want a replacement for that job?

[Aneninen]

It's not that bad at all.
It's a pity that Ika hammered and Regfan was away, but that hammer was so weak as if it had been a bus.
And the best thing is that most probably noone will spot that my lynch was planned. BBT is pretty much cleared. (If they have sense and notice that jumping on my wagon happened in a moment when both Ika and CES started townreading me...) Also, there are at least three players who look much scummier than the scums. Elk (who clearly looks like a buddy), CES (who actually never voted for me), Ika (even with the hammer, tried to derail)... and both Anti's and Zach's reasoning is very weak so if they want to find someone who bussed...

As soon as I have time, I can check both T-Bone's and Esp's games. Is there anything or anyone I should be particularly aware of?

[Aneninen]

So, in short: I regret nothing. ^_^

What's Esp's and T-Bone's role there?

[Espeonage]

I am a VT. But I also have blessing from the conf-town to not let me be lynched today.

[T-Bone]

I am getting lynched so make reads for my game a priority so I can post them.