Signs and Void (Game Over) [TM2015]

[Bulbazak]

Okay, time to do that VCA I promised comparing my wagon with TSO's and Mastin's. Going to bold the common denominators. Underline those that appear on two.

(10)

Bulbazak:

DeasVail,

Gammagooey

, Shadoweh,

Cheetory6

,

Titus

,

vezokpiraka

,

GuyInFreezer

,

Aronis

,

Tammy (Oversoul)

,

T S O

(10)

T S O:

Titus

,

Untrod Tripod

,

Gammagooey

,

singersigner

, mastin2,

vezokpiraka

,

Cheetory6

, ActionDan,

GuyInFreezer

, ChannelDelibird

(2)

mastin2:

vezokpiraka

,

Aronis

, (

Cheetory6

,

singersigner

,

Oversoul

,

Gammagooey

,

Untrod Tripod

, TellTaleHeart)

Okay, for kicks and giggles, let's see if we have any special names that appear on the TTH wagon:

(7)

TellTaleHeart:

Titus

,

Empire (Singersinger)

,

Tammy (Oversoul)

,

Aronis

, Marquis (FormerFish),

vezokpiraka

,

Cheetory6

, (ChannelDelibrd)

Okay, out of all the players that appeared on two of the wagons, I have strong town reads on Titus and Oversoul. That leaves {Aronis, UT, Singer}. I want to say there's no more than two scum in there, but man that looks like a very good list. But yeah, I doubt all three are scum. Singer and Aronis get bonus points for being on the TTH wagon. Looking back over the VCA, all three stayed off wagons together except in the case of Mastin. It makes sense, since I think Mastin's wagon was heavily scum pushed. However, I'm ruling out that possibility, since I doubt all four were on the wagon, and we haven't even gotten to the list of names that was on every wagon.

There are only 3 names that were on all three of the TSO/Bulba/Mastin wagons: Vezok, Cheetory, and Gamma. Gamma's pretty strongly townread on my team, so I'm giving him a pass, which is backed up when you include the TTH wagon in the mix, where he was absent. That leaves only Cheetory and Vezok. I think there's only one scum here, and Vezok is the most likely candidate, as Cheetory's thought process is very transparent when you go back and look at it.

Okay, so that leaves 1 scum in {Vezok, Cheetory} and likely 2 in {Aronis, UT, Singer}. I think this gives us a pretty good foundation to lynch from and then figure out where the last scum is hiding (unless I'm wrong about there only being 2 in the second group, but I'm just going to assume I'm wrong on a read somewhere.).

@Mastin: Thoughts on Vezok given this? I know you really want to call him town, but I'm going to need more than a gut feeling to back that up.

@Gamma: Talk to me about Singer. Mollie tells me that you should be able to look objectionably at her and tell me if I'm wrong.

@Singer: VCA has given you a day. Let's make the most out of it. Why are you avoiding UT and Aronis?

Vote Vezokpiraka

I need people to provide me hard town cases or get onboard.

[singersigner]

Um ok that was awkward. I pressed buttons while I was drunk and maybe my thoughtds disappeared!

Anyway:

1. I'm not sure I'm following your VCA.

2. Why is Mollie looking at Gamma to read me?? What does she feel like he could give her that you can't? Mollieeeeeeee...why are you reaching out to someone other than meeeee.

With regard to UT...I'm not avoiding the wagon, persay...just stalling it?? JK...mostly just that no one has given a convincing reason why he's scum more than what I'm familiar with, and no his bane is enough for me. Like I said, if it comes down to lynching him for a flip, I will, but I don't really see how he's threatening right now, so it's hard to justify voting for someone I can't read when they aren't threatening.

Aronis...I didn't realize there was a wagon on her?? She's been stroking my ego with finding Titus scum, so I've been willing to overlook much of what she's done. I think I remember her being towni-ish toward the end of Major Day 1, but this is a mental note to look back at what made me think that.

[Oversoul]

I already supplied my Vezok town read, Bulba.

Curious why you went with the 50% of getting scum group rather than the 66% chance of getting scum group, especially since your VCA seems to align with the town's feelings at the moment (UT scum)?

[Formerfish]

Do I seriously have a pressure wagon on me right now based off activity? Who the fuck uses activity as an actual basis for scum hunting? Who here has actually tried to engage me in anything so far? I'm sorry that I replaced into a game that was already 100+ pages and have had RL issues to deal with and have had a hard time getting involved. How about this, instead of voting me for pressure ask me a fucking question. Find a way to sort me that involves scum hunting and not policy lynching a low activity player.

Jesus, I have a hard enough time dealing in with normal large games, this is 10X more difficult. Give a motherfucker a break.

[vezokpiraka]

Okay, time to do that VCA I promised comparing my wagon with TSO's and Mastin's. Going to bold the common denominators. Underline those that appear on two.

(10)

Bulbazak:

DeasVail,

Gammagooey

, Shadoweh,

Cheetory6

,

Titus

,

vezokpiraka

,

GuyInFreezer

,

Aronis

,

Tammy (Oversoul)

,

T S O

(10)

T S O:

Titus

,

Untrod Tripod

,

Gammagooey

,

singersigner

, mastin2,

vezokpiraka

,

Cheetory6

, ActionDan,

GuyInFreezer

, ChannelDelibird

(2)

mastin2:

vezokpiraka

,

Aronis

, (

Cheetory6

,

singersigner

,

Oversoul

,

Gammagooey

,

Untrod Tripod

, TellTaleHeart)

Okay, for kicks and giggles, let's see if we have any special names that appear on the TTH wagon:

(7)

TellTaleHeart:

Titus

,

Empire (Singersinger)

,

Tammy (Oversoul)

,

Aronis

, Marquis (FormerFish),

vezokpiraka

,

Cheetory6

, (ChannelDelibrd)

Okay, out of all the players that appeared on two of the wagons, I have strong town reads on Titus and Oversoul. That leaves {Aronis, UT, Singer}. I want to say there's no more than two scum in there, but man that looks like a very good list. But yeah, I doubt all three are scum. Singer and Aronis get bonus points for being on the TTH wagon. Looking back over the VCA, all three stayed off wagons together except in the case of Mastin. It makes sense, since I think Mastin's wagon was heavily scum pushed. However, I'm ruling out that possibility, since I doubt all four were on the wagon, and we haven't even gotten to the list of names that was on every wagon.

There are only 3 names that were on all three of the TSO/Bulba/Mastin wagons: Vezok, Cheetory, and Gamma. Gamma's pretty strongly townread on my team, so I'm giving him a pass, which is backed up when you include the TTH wagon in the mix, where he was absent. That leaves only Cheetory and Vezok. I think there's only one scum here, and Vezok is the most likely candidate, as Cheetory's thought process is very transparent when you go back and look at it.

Okay, so that leaves 1 scum in {Vezok, Cheetory} and likely 2 in {Aronis, UT, Singer}. I think this gives us a pretty good foundation to lynch from and then figure out where the last scum is hiding (unless I'm wrong about there only being 2 in the second group, but I'm just going to assume I'm wrong on a read somewhere.).

@Mastin: Thoughts on Vezok given this? I know you really want to call him town, but I'm going to need more than a gut feeling to back that up.

@Gamma: Talk to me about Singer. Mollie tells me that you should be able to look objectionably at her and tell me if I'm wrong.

@Singer: VCA has given you a day. Let's make the most out of it. Why are you avoiding UT and Aronis?

Vote Vezokpiraka

I need people to provide me hard town cases or get onboard.

Did you just do a VCA with 3 unflipped wagons and called me scum?
This is not how you do a VCA and you fucking know that. This is just bullshit to try to call me scum.
Also for anyone paying attention you only picked the wagons I voted on. There is no singer wagon there and a lot of other stuff.

[Shadoweh]

Do I seriously have a pressure wagon on me right now based off activity? Who the fuck uses activity as an actual basis for scum hunting? Who here has actually tried to engage me in anything so far? I'm sorry that I replaced into a game that was already 100+ pages and have had RL issues to deal with and have had a hard time getting involved. How about this, instead of voting me for pressure ask me a fucking question. Find a way to sort me that involves scum hunting and not policy lynching a low activity player.

Less blank rage, more rage that involves who you think is scum pushing you. How do you ask questions of someone who hasn't posted anything to start asking questions about?

[ActionDan]

I'll be gone this weekend much like last weekend

[Cheetory6]

FORMERFISH.
ISOdive two people.
Talk about them.
Stop complaining.

ESPEONAGE.
Don't leave me hanging.

BULBA.
I'm trying really hard not to kneejerk flail at that VCA you made because
i) VCA this early in the game still seems like what in the fuck to me.
ii) I've voted on a lot of things this game. I sat on mastin wagon for a grand total of three minutes. I voted TTH for momentum on a wagon. And I wouldn't be surprised if scum just sat back and laughed while a bunch of us dumbly voted TSO.
If you think my thought process is coming across as genuine, why are you more concerned about how many wagons I've been on rather than how scummy I am?
Like, I get the vezokvote if you're finding him scummy and "Oh look he's also on wagons so get wrekd!" but like, why am I somehow your second choice over UT, singer or Aronis? Do you really think there aren't a few scum who're just sitting in the shadows, focusing on a single player or falling off the radar? Like, do you actually believe there's a strong possibility of three scum in vezok, me, UT, singer and Aronis?

[Cheetory6]

Also for anyone paying attention you only picked the wagons I voted on. There is no singer wagon there and a lot of other stuff.

I believe this is what Bulba sees as "all of the townwagons that have happened so far".
Why is Bulba scum?

[Cheetory6]

VOTE: Aronis
Bulba, why are you townreading Gamma? Give reasons.

[Cheetory6]

Aronis.
Why were you townreading TSO?
More than a sentence please.
Go.

[vezokpiraka]

@Titus: MS wants to asks you what do you think of bulba's VCA.

[vezokpiraka]

@Titus: MS wants to asks you what do you think of bulba's VCA.

And wants to know if it's remotely valid.

[Titus]

@MS, Bulba and TTH's VCA are only as worthwhile if you agree with the implict assumptions regarding alignment. Bulba's VCA, for instance, has the implicit assumption that all four wagons were on town. When I do VCA, I look at conflict or tension to see what options scum have. What options did they choose? While a VCA can be done without a scumflip, it's something I tend to avoid until lylo.

Remotely valid, not for me atm, too many assumptions. When others do it, or try to, it gives me a window into their assumptions. It's rarely sheepable due to the assumptions it makes this early, but it is something to chew on.

For instance, Bulba and TTH's VCA both have issues with assuming that scum will be scumread. If someone like Oversoul is scum a steering the town (unlikely) then the VCA would suggest people are scum that are actually town.

The stronger confidence in VCA is better with more flips.

TLDR: Remotely valid, yes but not for sheeping but does give insight. Can be useful keeping in mind assumptions. It's not valid for me to do heavily bc I would just confbias my reads. Even a tool I would never use can still give insight into how others approach the game.

[Cheetory6]

@vezok

,
Why is Bulba scum?

[vezokpiraka]

@vezok

,
Why is Bulba scum?

Cause he's failing at reading me, trying to push bad lynches and isn't engaging in helping the town.

[Cheetory6]

Would you say you're engaging in helping the town?
What exactly do you envision that would look like?

[vezokpiraka]

Would you say you're engaging in helping the town?
What exactly do you envision that would look like?

Lynching scum and not posting immense walls of nothing to boast your ego.

[Formerfish]

Do I seriously have a pressure wagon on me right now based off activity? Who the fuck uses activity as an actual basis for scum hunting? Who here has actually tried to engage me in anything so far? I'm sorry that I replaced into a game that was already 100+ pages and have had RL issues to deal with and have had a hard time getting involved. How about this, instead of voting me for pressure ask me a fucking question. Find a way to sort me that involves scum hunting and not policy lynching a low activity player.

Less blank rage, more rage that involves who you think is scum pushing you. How do you ask questions of someone who hasn't posted anything to start asking questions about?

Singers push feels lazy, but I dont know her well enough to figure out if this is lazy scum looking for something they can easily park a vote on or lazy town who can't figure out a better scum read so they stick a vote on something they see as scummy (ie. my activity).

And you don't have to ask me questions about stuff that I have posted, you can ask questions about stuff other people have done/said to try and get a baseline for my thought process. You can ask me to form a read on someone you already have a read on to see how well we are synced up. You could ask me just about anything to get me directly involved. Do you know how difficult it is to try and decipher walls of posts you haven't read because they are buried so far back in a game that you don't even get the context they are in when given some context?

[Formerfish]

FORMERFISH.
ISOdive two people.
Talk about them.
Stop complaining.

Well shit, if I knew it was that easy I would have solved this game days ago...

I can't take peoples post out of context like that, its not how I play. I need to be able to see the whole picture unfolding as it did in real time. It is damn near impossible to do so when I was 100+ pages back, and anytime I started to read I had another 15+ pages and growing.

You were all hot and heavy on my dick a few days ago about posting, and now there is a pressure wagon on me, why aren't you foaming at the mouth to be all up on that shit?

[hitogoroshi]

VC 116 (Major Day 2, VC 4)

(4)

Untrod Tripod:

Gammagooey, Titus, ChannelDelibird, TellTaleHeart [L-5]
(3)

Formerfish:

singersigner, Shadoweh, Oversoul
(2)

Titus:

Eseponage, Aronis
(1)

Espeonage:

ActionDan
(1)

Bulbazak:

vezokpiraka
(1)

DeasVail:

mastin2
(1)

vezokpiraka:

Bulbazak
(1)

Aronis:

Cheetory6
(0)

DeasVail:

(Cheetory6)

(3)

Not Voting:

DeasVail, Formerfish, Untrod Tripod

(Bulbazak)

With 17 players alive it's 9 to lynch. Major Day Two will end Tuesday, May 19th, at 2PM CST.

Major Day Two Deadline

(expired on 2015-05-19 13:00:00)

Shadoweh is V/LA until May 10th. Titus is V/LA until May 11th.

[Cheetory6]

Well shit, if I knew it was that easy I would have solved this game days ago...

Okay, expecting results soon.
[Or you could just look at the BulbaBane/TSO/endofD1Espe/mastinBanewagons and see the reasoning each person used for their vote and then use that as a basis to catch up?]

You were all hot and heavy on my dick a few days ago about posting, and now there is a pressure wagon on me, why aren't you foaming at the mouth to be all up on that shit?

Because
i) I've run out of foam. Blame mastin.
ii) I reread Marquis a little while ago and didn't get as much out of it.

[Cheetory6]

Like idfk fish do u want me to hold ur hand and teach you all of the wonders that is Signs and Void?
Is that what you want?

[singersigner]

@FormerFish...if you had to vote anyone right now, who would it be?

[Oversoul]

Why is it so hard to make people give a shit about this game.