[OLD] Open Setup Ideas and Discussion

[TierShift]

Kansas City

9 Vanilla Townies
1 Cop

3 Mafia Goons

Special mechanic

: Cop gets an investigation result on a random Vanilla Townie prior to the game starting.
Night-talk only.

Let Mafia select who the Cop gets the result on. Have them select two players so that if one is the cop the other one is confirmed town instead.

That'd be my advice, less randomness. A game with a confirmed town zMuffin is very different from a game with a confirmed town new player who doesn't know what they're doing.

That would make the guy that is not confirmed have a bigger chance of being cop. Why not just make it random? IC's are always random, other roles that require skill are also random, I don't see why a confirmed townie shouldn't be.

[West9]

Confirmation seems pretty damned broken imo. You could have two confirmed towns day 2, and four confirmed towns day 3. Ridic.

hoooooowww? There can only ever be one successful confirmation per night.

[JasonWazza]

Confirmation seems pretty damned broken imo. You could have two confirmed towns day 2, and four confirmed towns day 3. Ridic.

hoooooowww? There can only ever be one successful confirmation per night.

Cop invest N0

For day 3 you claim and out all the innocents and you have 4 confirmed towns.

[West9]

I'm talking about my setup

[Bicephalous Bob]

I think BBm, like me, didn't read "a target" as "any target". Anyway, the oracles' success is mostly based on luck. You might as well turn them into percentage roles.

[TierShift]

oh no, I read it like everyone else did. The version where they only fail if targeting the same player is much better.

[West9]

Okay...gonna have to switch up some roles then. Also, the mafia oracle doesn't really make sense now.

[BBmolla]

If more than one Oracle successfully targets a player, all Oracle actions fail, and all attempted Oracle actions use up a shot.

I missed this

Ignore me

[BBmolla]

Kansas City

9 Vanilla Townies
1 Cop

3 Mafia Goons

Special mechanic

: Cop gets an investigation result on a random Vanilla Townie prior to the game starting.
Night-talk only.

Let Mafia select who the Cop gets the result on. Have them select two players so that if one is the cop the other one is confirmed town instead.

That'd be my advice, less randomness. A game with a confirmed town zMuffin is very different from a game with a confirmed town new player who doesn't know what they're doing.

That would make the guy that is not confirmed have a bigger chance of being cop. Why not just make it random? IC's are always random, other roles that require skill are also random, I don't see why a confirmed townie shouldn't be.

Yeah nvm, the mafia will kill the inno wtf am I smoking

Do it like chosen mafia where can select three players to stop from being confirmed town though. Makes it more interesting.

[Oversoul]

Kansas City

9 Vanilla Townies
1 Cop

3 Mafia Goons

Special mechanic

: Cop gets an investigation result on a random Vanilla Townie prior to the game starting.
Night-talk only.

Let Mafia select who the Cop gets the result on. Have them select two players so that if one is the cop the other one is confirmed town instead.

That'd be my advice, less randomness. A game with a confirmed town zMuffin is very different from a game with a confirmed town new player who doesn't know what they're doing.

I don't know if this solves the problem. If you allow the Mafia to choose, they can track who is town reading those two players and make better assumptions on who is the cop.

I think the margin of error is low for the Mafia, but I don't think it is ridiculously town-sided. Mafia win more games on average anyway.

[Soft-spoken]

this is an adaption of a setup i made for epicmafia. it was quite fun in live chat play, and turned out to be well balanced (http://puu.sh/hL7VW/b34ae4307a.png) and im curious how it would pan out here. i added a mis-lynch because it seems like comparable setups that are balanced with 1 ML on epicmafia are considered balanced with 2 MLs here (which is probably due to having different lynch mechanics) an initially common misconception about the live chat version was that it was too town-sided or too scum sided. it can appear as both depending on how you perceive it. both town and mafia have some pretty powerful weapons at their disposal.

Hollywood Illusions

1 Mafia Actress

(role-cop that flips as the role of the last person they targeted)

1 Mafia Illusionist

(1-shot day-vig that can choose someone at night to disguise his next days shot as)

4 Vanilla Townies

1 Day-vig Giver

(chooses one person at night to give a 1-shot day-vig ability to)

1 Talent Scout

(Named VT)

1 Bleeder

(if anyone attempts to kill the bleeder, he suffers a prolonged death, and survives until the end of the day phase. this includes being day-vig'd or night-killed. if night-kiled, recieves a message from mod that he is bleeding)




game begins without a night-zero. all day-vig actions should be performed by the mod, at the request of the person performing it via PM. this is essential for game mechanics because of the illusionist factor. mod reveals who (allegedly) performed the day-vig and who they targeted. if the dayvig results in a death, the flip is made in the same post. if someone receives a day-vig ability from the day-vig giver, they will be alerted at the beginning of day via mod PM


the setup essentially has 2 ML's - a d1 lynch, and a d2 day-vig. after both have been used, town is essentially in a lylo situation as mafia has a day-vig to use.

if actress is lynched day 1, she will flip as actress. after that, the actress factor is a wild-card for town to consider.
if illusionist uses his day-vig day 1, he will be confirmed mafia... only the illusionist can have a day-vig day 1, and it is not disguised yet.

mafia have no day-talk, but mafia can arrange a code at night for the actress to communicate if she role-copped a PR or not. this will increase the odds of the illusionist using his day-vig effectively. if a VT is shot by the illusionist, the chances of a mafia win will plummet. if illusionist is unsure of an appropriate target, he can save his shot until town has shot and lynched incorrectly... he can also save his shot as a tool to hammer the vote by changing the amount of votes needed to lynch in the process of killing somone

[BBmolla]

I enjoyed it when I played it at epicmafia.

Illusionist and Actress need to work their ass off to ensure the Actress isn't lynched day 1 though.

[rhelg224]

Hi all, I'm new here, but I have a few ideas. I sometimes host games on another site but it's become a rather small community so it's hard to discuss mechanics there without spoiling things and as you guys seem very strong on theory, I hope you don't mind helping me figure some stuff out.

I was wondering what you guys think about these weird setups:

1) 12 people: Everyone is a Jester with a rule that they (a) have to eat the vote on Day 1 else they die that night without achieving victory and (b) may not publicly reveal their role. I know "joke mafia" games are often frowned on in many communities, but I think it would be interesting to see how something like this would play out with literally every single person jockeying to eat the vote. Jester is a hated role to begin with so I thought this would rather kick it up to 11.
2) Same as #1, but only for night 1 where everyone (included the Day 1 winner) is then assigned traditional (but themed) mafia roles. May take the bite out of being essentially a "joke" game at the beginning.
3) Larger game (30-40 people), mainly traditional set of roles, but no voting. Instead, the last (before vote close) name of another participant used by each participant counts as their lynch vote. I'm not sure if this will annoy the game base or if they will have fun with it.

[BBmolla]

This is for open setups where all mechanics are known. Those setups need to b closed to work.

They also don't seem particularly fun to be a player in, and this is coming from someone who likes to mess with players.

[rhelg224]

Ohhh I misunderstood what open meant here. I thought it applied to the nature of the thread.

Thanks.

[rhelg224]

Oh and on #3 I mean for that to be an open mechanic. It's not very different from explicit voting but I like to encourage discussion/posting which tends to be an issue sometimes and I feel like an open mechanic such as #3 would work toward fostering more conversation than simple voting. Maybe that's naive on my part.

[BBmolla]

Oh and on #3 I mean for that to be an open mechanic. It's not very different from explicit voting but I like to encourage discussion/posting which tends to be an issue sometimes and I feel like an open mechanic such as #3 would work toward fostering more conversation than simple voting. Maybe that's naive on my part.

Posting/discussion is probably not as much an issue here as at other sites, we focus primarily on dayplay here.

I don't see how #3 affects discussion though.

[Soft-spoken]

I enjoyed it when I played it at epicmafia.

Illusionist and Actress need to work their ass off to ensure the Actress isn't lynched day 1 though.

honestly, i don't believe that mafia being lynched day 1 will hurt scum in this setup any more than any other 9p with 2 ml's... and i wouldn't place value of the actress over the illusionist. if illusionist is being lynched, he is forced to shoot bleeder if he has claimed, and force the actress to PR hunt for the n1 kill. if bleeder hasn't claimed because town chose to take the gambit of giving day-vig to a random player, he has to PR hunt himself... fast. in any case, if mafia is lynched d1 in any 7v2 setup, it goes downhill pretty fast.

[wgeurts]

Truth and Justice:

Randomly pick five numbers between 1-100 and then convert each number into a letter:

• 1-50: M
  
• 51-68: C
  
• 69-76: T
  
• 77-100: P

Then convert add roles corresponding to the number of letters:

Mafia:

0 M's - Mafia Tailor + Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker
M - Mafia Tailor + Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker
MM - Mafia Framer + Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker
MMM - Mafia Framer + Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker
MMMM - Mafia Goon + Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker
MMMMM - Mafia Goon + Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker

Cops:

C - 1-Shot Cop
CC - 2-Shot Cop
CCC - Cop
CCCC - Cop + 1-Shot Cop
CCCCC - Cop + 2-Shot Cop

Trackers:

T - 1-Shot Tracker
TT - 2-Shot Tracker
TTT - Tracker
TTTT - Tracker + 1-Shot Tracker
TTTTT - Tracker + 2-Shot Tracker

Protectors:

P - 1-Shot Bodyguard
PP - Bodyguard
PPP - Bodyguard + 1-Shot Jailkeeper
PPPP - Jailkeeper + 1-Shot Bodyguard
PPPPP - Jailkeeper + 1-Shot Jailkeeper

Then add Vanilla Townies until you have 9 players. Mafia faction kill is taken instead of own ability unless there's only one mafia remaining, then they make take both.

Example setups:
21-14-65-76-92 (MMCTP)

Mafia Framer
Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker

1-Shot Cop
1-Shot Tracker
1-Shot Bodyguard
4 Vanilla Townies

66-100-82-31-10 (CPPMM)

Mafia Framer
Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker

1-Shot Cop
Bodyguard
5 Vanilla Townies

75-93-15-5-42 (TPMMM)

Mafia Framer
Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker

1-Shot Tracker
1-Shot Bodyguard

51-57-56-69-73 (CCCTT)

Mafia Tailor
Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker

Cop
2-Shot Tracker
5 Vanilla Townies

[BBmolla]

Mafia power seems too strong

[West9]

Confirmation v2

9 Players

4 Vanilla Townies
2 Oracles
1 Ascetic Townie

1 Mafia Goon
1 Mafia Roleblocker

• If an Oracle successfully targets a town player at night, that player is confirmed as town the next morning. If they target scum, the ascetic townie, or are roleblocked, no such confirmation occurs.
  
• If more than one Oracle successfully targets the same player, all Oracle actions fail.
  
• Mafia can perform a power role action and kill at the same time.

Question: Should confirmations just be alignment, or should role be revealed as well? This only matters in the case of Oracles targeting each other.

[wgeurts]

BBmolla, what if I make the roleblocker an Asceticizer?
Makes the chances smaller I guess.

The game also becomes a mountainous effectively once all PR's are neutralised/gone. 2/5 mountainous isn't too bad.

[Aneninen]

Nice idea, Wgeurts! You're mastering the original C9++/JK9 for every possible purposes. ^_^

I'd pump up the P secion, I suppose. A full-Bodyguard won't hurt.
Something like:

P - Bodyguard
PP - Jailkeeper
PPP - Bodyguard + 1-Shot Jailkeeper
PPPP - Jailkeeper + 1-Shot Bodyguard
PPPPP - Jailkeeper + Bodyguard

By the way, can the Tailor self-target?

[wgeurts]

Tailor can't self-target, unless that's not standard. The problem with what you suggested above is that a 1-Shot Bodyguard/Jailkeeper now knows which other role is definetely in play. As there is only 1 option for both of them (PPP/PPPP). I'm trying to make it in a manner that nobody knows wether there are other roles besides themselves, and if so what.

[wgeurts]

P - 1-Shot Bodyguard + 1-Shot Bodyguard
PP - Bodyguard + 1-Shot Bodyguard
PPP - Bodyguard + 1-Shot Jailkeeper
PPPP - Jailkeeper + 1-Shot Jailkeeper
PPPPP - Jailkeeper + Bodyguard

Would this be better?