White Flag Mafia [TM2015] (Game Over)

[Equinox]

Vote Count 5.04

Not Voting (5) - Ankamius, BlueBloodedToffee, Cogito Ergo Sum, ika, Regfan

With 5 alive, it will take 3 to lynch.

The deadline is Friday, May 29, 2015, at 3:30 PM EDT (UTC-4), which is in (expired on 2015-05-29 15:30:00).

[BlueBloodedToffee]

then vote me for it and either scum claim to me or find out your wrong and lose the damned game or kindly fuck off. i really dont care what you thinkn about my positioning and what im doing and i really dont care for people who care more about their ego then listening for once and actualy taking into consideration other factors

REGFAN: when you get in here tell us who you think the scum pair is

This post assumes I'm town.

Why won't you admit you're town reading me? (Know I'm town)

[ika]

then vote me for it and either scum claim to me or find out your wrong and lose the damned game or kindly fuck off. i really dont care what you thinkn about my positioning and what im doing and i really dont care for people who care more about their ego then listening for once and actualy taking into consideration other factors

REGFAN: when you get in here tell us who you think the scum pair is

This post assumes I'm town.

Why won't you admit you're town reading me? (Know I'm town)

cus im not and your trying to imply things that are not true?

ive already made it clear so you can quit trying to imply things that are not there.

[Fenchurch]

its a simple thing here:
A) your both town: well good job you fucked it
B) your both scum: well good job you guys fucked yourself
C) one of you is scum: we get info and we can look from there

both of you are unconvincing of the other to me that one is scum so either you gusy cross vote and put up or i am going to continue to ignore both of you

I'm pretty sure everyone already thinks C is clearly most likely, so I don't see much of an incentive to try and prove it.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Whoops, that was me.

[Regfan]

Phone posting, will be home in a few hours and will get to this then

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I don't get it.

You have two accounts on the same team?

[Regfan]

Okay, exhausted as fuck but getting to some of this tonight, the rest tomorrow night. I really need to step back and reanalyse just about everything because this game is depressing at the moment and the absolute only thing I'm confident at this point is that Ika is town. I'll likely get through Anen interaction re-reading and attempting to work out which team of BBT/CES, Ank/CES and BBT/Ank make the most sense too - Without much rereading I don't think CES-BBT works given CES's push on BBT yesterday and their back and forths don't read as a cross-buss attempt but that's something I really need to go back and check on.

Ika, please stop goading people into voting, last thing I want is to get home one day and it's lost because of scum blitzing. I know you want 'stances locked in and to speed this up' but I'm nowhere near ready for votes to be laid down; We have two fucking weeks, we have plenty of time available.

I really don't read much from the Anti-kill, was fairly sure he was dying there - he was the only non-ika person that was universally town-read (And Ikas not universally town-read in that BBT scum-reads him so if it's a case of BBT/Ika both being town then he'd never be killed there).

Really don't like BBTs Post 1947 especially the "I've played a perfect game and been on no mslynches", initial feelings are that it kind of looks like a 'scum caught for the wrong reasons' type of post - also don't like the fact that if he thinks it's CES/Ika he should be reaching out to Ank/Me here which he's not doing at all.

Also not buying Anks teams reads in Post 1989, I think Town!Mollie would know I'm town here just by home different my play here is compared to what I'm like as mafia so her 'he's super scummy here' especially re; my end of day post reads fake.

I'd really like an explanation from Regfan as to why he still thought it was me+elk when I basically tipped the dominoes to an elk lynch.

There were two possibilities post-hammer / at the time of my post a) Elk was town (This was something I highly doubted largely due to the fact that I town-read almost everyone else alive and found Anens interations with him to read as obvpartner + didn't like the fact that he'd vanish whenever not mentioned and pop in to say close to nothing) or b) Elk was scum. In b) CES's hammer means CES 100% couldn't be his partner, BBTs comments post hammer didn't fit as a partner that's already lost the game and Ika was and still is my strongest town-read and I had p strong town read on Antihero which left you as the only real possible partner and I wanted to be able to brag via calling the exact scum-team before the reveal. Plus your vote and then 'look at my vote' type of post in Post 1937 read as you attempting to distance from him and 'rule you out as a pair' which would have been your only hope at the time of making it to end-game together.

REGFAN: when you get in here tell us who you think the scum pair is

Gone into this above but right now? Most likely to least is something like; BBT-Ank, Ank-CES, Gap, BBT-CES.

[Ankamius]

So you thought at the time that when pretty much everyone thought that theelkspeaks was fully willing to lynch elk except for BBT and me, I, as elk's scumpartner, would turn on him completely out of the blue when the chances of him

not

being lynched from it was virtually nonexistent?

I'd like to know your opinion of #1961.

[Ankamius]

#1937 was a reaction test, too. I didn't realize at the time how ambiguous I was, but I would have expected town to either come to the conclusion that I was talking about elk+BBT being the only possible team for elk and comment on it (or hell, come to

any

conclusion and comment on it)

or

try to figure out what I was talking about.

You spun me as scum with that post without doing either.

I originally got obvtown tells from some interactions with Anen+you, but looking back I can easily see some maneuvering to poison interactions by sacrificing Anen when it was too late to save him in order to set up the other two for the endgame.

[Ankamius]

I'm looking at early Day 4 stuff and now I'm thinking that CES is a more likely partner to Regfan. I can see scum wanting to get rid of a major townread (ika) that won't end up getting them caught up in a dangerous 1v1, but it's still such an awkward position to take when there's lynchbait everywhere that I'm wary of scum actually going that path right off the bat.

Sounds like a revisit to the early CES wagons is warranted.

[Ankamius]

Ok yeah, I can see Regfan's play on day two being all about trying to save CES from the noose. He started pushing Psyche really hard once the CES wagon sprung up, then pushed Anen towards null the moment Cheery Dog started being wagoned up. Him switching back to scum on Anen is a very weak tell since at that point only Antihero and I were scumreading his catchup, but I can see Reg coming up with a lynch list of {Cheery Dog, Aneninen, Ankamius} at that point in time.

At some point in day 3, his plan switched to set up a sacrifice on Aneninen (note he posted that read a very long time before day ended and never actually join up) while also setting up elk and me to be the mislynches of the game. This makes sense with his early day-4 push on elk and push on me today.

The only thing that's giving me pause is that I'd think he would vote for Aneninen earlier once it became clear he couldn't get a mislynch on either elk or me that day without outing himself. Honestly, that entire day is weird for him since that's the only past day phase where he wasn't proactive about voting, having never voted once. I'm not actually sure what to make of that, since I'd actually see town jump on the Aneninen wagon as well.

[Ankamius]

If you guys don't believe me, just put Equinox+Regfan in a double ISO and look at how his stances shift as the wagons change. This is especially alarming on day 2.

[ika]

so teams are

reg: BBT/ank
CES: BBT/ank
BBT: ika/CES
ank: BBT/reg
me: BBT/reg/CES

funny how BBT is univeral scum read now yet nobody votes for it.........

[Ankamius]

That's the problem.

Everyone

is scumreading BBT.

[ika]

That's the problem.

Everyone

is scumreading BBT.

I know, its quite telling....

I will see if anyone draws the same conclusion im drawing first before i say anything

[BlueBloodedToffee]

2032 - The fact you're even considering CES and myself as a scum team is ridiculous.

Reg lining up to vote me is scummy as fuck. Reasons for thinking I'm scum in your next post would be great.

Is that now every single person willing to vote me? I bet Anti wouldn't have been scum reading me...

Scum caught for the wrong reasons? What reasons are these? Like, nobody has a single, solid reason for me being scum. Not one.

I should be reaching out to you and Ank? Neither of you have fucking been here, it's been me talking to both scum on my own. Ank has recently started contributing and now so have you (one post doesn't quite cut it though).

Reg, do you have any comments on anything I have posted over the last few pages? Anything at all?

2038 - LOL, every single person scum reading me. Would love to know what Anti is thinking as he reads this shit.

Ank, I'm glad you're coming round to the fact that CES is scum. That makes me a little happier with the current situation. Though, I'm not entirely happy it's based on an associative alone.

[Ankamius]

ika: Mollie wants to tell you that she agrees that it's probably Reg/CES.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I don't get it.

You have two accounts on the same team?

No, we live together.

That's the problem.

Everyone

is scumreading BBT.

I know, its quite telling....

I will see if anyone draws the same conclusion im drawing first before i say anything

Ank's earlier anti-Regfan stance was always going to let him set it up in his favour.

So you thought at the time that when pretty much everyone thought that theelkspeaks was fully willing to lynch elk except for BBT and me, I, as elk's scumpartner, would turn on him completely out of the blue when the chances of him not being lynched from it was virtually nonexistent?

If it's you-elk, doing something risky wouldn't've been unwarranted. If Antihero hadn't immediately followed it up with a vote, there probably would've been opportunities. But if you were still convinced it had to be BBT as elk's partner, why did you vote him then?

Ika, I still want to know why you think Ank's town.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Like, nobody has a single, solid reason for me being scum.

I gave you a whole list last time you asked.

I bet Anti wouldn't have been scum reading me...

And I bet Tammy would. Do you think Zach would have a hard time picking between you and me? I don't. You can focus all you want on the one nightkill where there was one obvious option but the other nightkills tell a very different story.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Your list was shockingly bad and mostly relied on elk being scum.

You wanna try that list again?

[Ankamius]

If it's you-elk, doing something risky wouldn't've been unwarranted. If Antihero hadn't immediately followed it up with a vote, there probably would've been opportunities. But if you were still convinced it had to be BBT as elk's partner, why did you vote him then?

Well, actually...

Ank's absence at a pretty vital point of the game is somewhat concerning.

holy shit, it's elk/bbt isn't it?

VOTE: theelkspeaks

You're right, I couldn't have predicted that Antihero would likely have hammered elk.

I don't understand your question.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Or he could've pushed for BBT instead. You'd get on board with that and you could then argue from then on that no one makes sense as a partner to elk. Yeah, it's risky, but if it had been you-elk, I think the situation called for some risk.

The question is why you voted elk when you thought elk only made sense as BBT's buddy. You're making the motive abundantly clear from the perspective of Ank-BBT.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Your list was shockingly bad and mostly relied on elk being scum.

You wanna try that list again?

So "shockingly bad" you chose not to engage with any of it. 2 out of 7 points relied on elkscum. The other five are still valid.

But I can add to that: your focus on the Antikill while dismissing every previous nightkill; your inability to see why scum would want to keep alive ikatown (as town you have to be aware that a single wrong vote costs us the game and the connection then is really obvious); your insistence that I wouldn't bus Aneninen to save hypothetical ikascum (this shows you thinking in terms of things you can call scummy rather than in terms of people's motivations); your team's scumhunting consisting of things that take ika-me as their starting point (especially weird since Titus is supposed to have been town reading ika earlier).

[BlueBloodedToffee]

The kill heading into LyLo is usually the most informative; I'm not big on NKA in most other situations. For the most obvious reason as this is the most important stage of the game.

As scum I would also be aware of one vote potentially ending the game. That is in no way alignment indicative.

You wouldn't bus. You needed to stay out of the way, that is clear. The fact you scum read Anen for so long without committing to a vote is telling. The fact Anen town read you with weak reasoning is also telling.

Titus stopped town reading ika after he quick hammered Anen.