Mini 1677 - Ori and the Blind Forest Mafia - Forest Revived

[Cho]

Because as I said multiple times, the confirmation and setup design aren't about whether there actually is a BP this game, it's about how the possibility was put into the game.

The "four pools" part of the setup had to be the last step toward deciding what roles were in the setup. In other words, if there were an SK in this game, what role it was would have had to have been decided before the PRs were picked from the pool, while there was still a chance of a Mafia Bulletproof being rolled. And there's no killing role that justifies the possible existence of a Mafia BP other than Vig; SK doesn't meet this, because a Mafia BP pretty much obliterates the chances of an SK winning, even if the SK has an X-Shot Strongman.

Think about it this way: why would Ank and his review group allow for the chance of a Mafia Bulletproof (one with unlimited shots), unless there was a Town Vigilante?

[Tere]

I am no set up guru but I am following what Cho is saying here I think, and I think it makes sense.

[Bellaphant]

Yeah, I think I understand what Cho is saying. I don't think lynching Cho is the answer for today.

[ZZZX]

reading back now but can you mention it again? I am pretty sure I cant remeber you saying anything true/making sense about it.

Look, I assume you are taking a pot shot, 'coz you just quoted why I'm scum-reading you. I get what you are saying about 'it's not non content', but there's not a huge amount to town-read there. If you ARE town, then please stop stuff like this and try to engage with people, so we can rule you out of the scum-pool: Tere called you lynchbait. Boo wants you to be more 'helpful'. You had a wagon on you that can't really be all scum, so maybe accept, if you are town, that you need to make this clearer.

Z, if you are town what is the best way to engage you because I'd like for that to happen rather than for you to be lynchbait?

In the meantime:

VOTE: Plum

because I am still not feeling anything in her ISO is coming from a genuine town standpoint.

People who are townreading her, I'd love to know why, because I am not sharing that viewpoint at all.

I will tell you who else was starting to WTF at her yesterday though - the dead townie....

*snipped wni's quote*

Ms had a pretty consistent scum-reading of her too.

Ugh, Tere, please be town, 'coz this is a much better version of what I've been trying to say, and I'd love to know the answer to your question.

I will be pretty honest with you

I still dont get it.

Eitherway the best part to read me or to do anything to help me is to

Attack me

. But how? Basically

Give me a case on me and I will try to de construct it. Give me someone to check or a post and I will take it apart, Have a 1v1 with me and I will be able to sort you out.

@Mollie imho the fact that you are scum reading me here doesnt really help me trust in town you. Also the fact that metal's dying wish was your head really makes me want to vote you. I might do that after i continue my catch up.

@Plum I dont want to be rude but the last time I saw someone use vote pattern analysis he fucked up the whole shit. And since you are voting me because of it you seem to have done the same thing. Also I dont get how you are doing it without any flipped scum. So literally you are using a cheap excuse. Otherwise show your "analysis" and show how it makes me scum. May you? (+ scum points for bullshitty reason)

[ZZZX]

Feeling better about Cho. I believe Cho(marq) is town here... most likely.

[ZZZX]

Because as I said multiple times, the confirmation and setup design aren't about whether there actually is a BP this game, it's about how the possibility was put into the game.

The "four pools" part of the setup had to be the last step toward deciding what roles were in the setup. In other words, if there were an SK in this game, what role it was would have had to have been decided before the PRs were picked from the pool, while there was still a chance of a Mafia Bulletproof being rolled. And there's no killing role that justifies the possible existence of a Mafia BP other than Vig; SK doesn't meet this, because a Mafia BP pretty much obliterates the chances of an SK winning, even if the SK has an X-Shot Strongman.

Think about it this way: why would Ank and his review group allow for the chance of a Mafia Bulletproof (one with unlimited shots), unless there was a Town Vigilante?

Makes... sense somewhat?

As long as this game was not announced bastard that is.

[ZZZX]

But also there might actually be no SK, so until we have a SK flip we cant use the logic of the existance possibilty of an SK.

[ZZZX]

Really Solid town reads so far:

Ika
Tere

People I want dead:

-Mollie

People I shall vote with all my might and soul:
-Plum (until you clarify the "voting pattern" bullshit)

VOTE: Plum

You know I might have been rusty or smthing but...

MY BULLSHIT SENSOR NEVER LIES>

[dragonspawn]

Reread Cho's arguments and I'm thinking it through.

One thing I don't get is why assume those roles were last? I can see why it makes sense that they would be chosen last, but why should we assume they were?

[Cho]

But also there might actually be no SK, so until we have a SK flip we cant use the logic of the existance possibilty of an SK.

That's what I'm saying - the mere possibility of a Mafia BP existing, plus the one not-my-nightkill pretty much proves no SK exists.

[ika]

But also there might actually be no SK, so until we have a SK flip we cant use the logic of the existance possibilty of an SK.

That's what I'm saying - the mere possibility of a Mafia BP existing, plus the one not-my-nightkill pretty much proves no SK exists.

unless if your sk....

[Cho]

Reread Cho's arguments and I'm thinking it through.

One thing I don't get is why assume those roles were last? I can see why it makes sense that they would be chosen last, but why should we assume they were?

I'm not saying they were chosen last in terms of designing the four pools mechanic after all the other roles.

I'm saying the 4 random roles were rolled/randomized after all other roles had been set in stone (not who got them, but that for example they had to have decided a Town Vig was in the setup before randomizing from those 4 pools). The other way around is both normally unethical/bastard, and not possible anyway considering this game had already been approved for review before randomization occurred (the only variance in setup is the semi-open 4 random role pools).

[Cho]

But also there might actually be no SK, so until we have a SK flip we cant use the logic of the existance possibilty of an SK.

That's what I'm saying - the mere possibility of a Mafia BP existing, plus the one not-my-nightkill pretty much proves no SK exists.

unless if your sk....

ika.

[Cho]

Jfc.

You design and review setups. Don't tell me you're even considering that could be possible here.

[Frogging Mollie]

Jfc.

You design and review setups. Don't tell me you're even considering that could be possible here.

plz do not tell me that you think a 13 player set up wld have a scum bp and a scum roleblocker cos I don't even

holy cow

how do you get away with this shit

[dragonspawn]

Cho who did your slot target last night? It occurs to me I'm not really sure either of you have said. I'll have to double check.

[Grib]

While it likely doesn't make you SK, I don't see how it makes you confirmed town?

"mafia claiming vig unprompted day 1 is lol no fucking way" > wine

"a scum-motivated kill went through last night while I was roleblocked" > in the world where you're scum, Yukari could have had someone else make the kill since they would have been worried about the possibility of being tracked

[Grib]

If mollie is town (which most of us believe), why would scum block a Vig pointed at a townie? That's two kills in one Night for them, and they could simply shoot the Vig later once they think the maybe!Doctor has used up both of their shots.

[ika]

Jfc.

You design and review setups. Don't tell me you're even considering that could be possible here.

would you like setup spec?

ill run the techincal worst case in the random roll:

we have known:
3way nighbors
VT
miller (lets make it like that for argument)
and 2 shot frut vendor
vig

vs

BP
Roleblocker
goon

do you see how much scumsided this becomes right at this if its not an sk?

lets make it more realistic

doc
Vig
VT

vs

BP
rber
goon

this is more plausable per say due to doc bieing on vig, but after vig claims rber just vig and shots elsewhere

remove RB on lyncha dn it becomes townsided with 2-shot doc cus vig now has town in major power

so honeslt many ways i look at it i would find an sk with a 1-shot BP or ninja. to have a margianly better ballence. it could lead to leverage against mafia in event of claim

[ika]

and just an fyi thats a shitty anlyasis of it.

if i were to really sit down and setup pect in deph i would need to be in a proper mood

[Frogging Mollie]

jesus christ

plz lynch us

plz

[Frogging Mollie]

If mollie is town (which most of us believe),

why would scum block a Vig pointed at a townie?

That's two kills in one Night for them, and they could simply shoot the Vig later once they think the maybe!Doctor has used up both of their shots.

I have been trying to have this discussion for ages. it makes no sense.

yukari's claim was sooper sketch but no1 wants to talk about it

[Frogging Mollie]

YUKARI WANTED US DEAD BEFORE METAL AND SAID HE HAD A WAY THAT HE CLD SORT METAL ON D2.

HOW ANY1 IS MISSING THIS IS QUITE BEYOND ME

[dragonspawn]

YUKARI WANTED US DEAD BEFORE METAL AND SAID HE HAD A WAY THAT HE CLD SORT METAL ON D2.

HOW ANY1 IS MISSING THIS IS QUITE BEYOND ME

He also said that if we lynched you he would kill metal over night. Then today he said if we had killed you he would have killed boo.

It certainly had me thinking he and metal were scum buddies but then metal flipped town. Is it odd behavior for town or was he doing that to make us think metal was scum to lynch him. I don't know. Little yukari did makes much sense to me.

[Ankamius]

vici!