Inorganic Chemistry [GAME OVER, SCUM WIN]

[ika]

You are either badly misusing that word or you don't know what it means. Define 'misrepping' for me.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misrepresentation

like i said that not how my meta works. try harder

[Fluminator]

Replace me out Anti. You are a really good mod (probably the best I've seen), but a couple posters have been sapping the fun out of this for the entire game and now that Marq's out I just have no motivation. I tried to force myself to have some out of respect for you, but it didn't work.

Hope to see some of you in other games.

[Cerberus v666]

Replace me out Anti. You are a really good mod (probably the best I've seen), but a couple posters have been sapping the fun out of this for the entire game and now that Marq's out I just have no motivation. I tried to force myself to have some out of respect for you, but it didn't work.

Hope to see some of you in other games.

I hope I'm not one of them? :-/ Sorry to see you go.

[mastin2]

I’ve already explained why this is wrong, you ignored me.

No, I accurately pointed out no sane doctor (which the commute inventor serves as) would EVER have protected ZZZX (one nightkill), and there are DOZENS of reasons why the commute inventor wouldn't have protected Bins (among them being: not townreading her, not seeing her claim, not thinking she would be nightkilled, thinking someone else--Lying Cat--was far better a target, etc.), the other nightkill. We have a sample size of two. In short, just because the commute-inventor hasn't stopped a nightkill yet doesn't mean they won't. Sure, doc saves in games are pretty dang rare thanks to sheer probability and the doctor not being in the know, but if the doc lives long enough, then it's BOUND to happen sooner or later.

You have played with me more than any other player on this site. You should know that this is how I

always

post.

No, it's different. Your posting is...ahck. The words aren't forming in my mind. The thought is there, but I'm struggling to get it out. It's different. I'm having trouble describing why it's different, but it is, and you insisting it isn't is part of why you're scum.

All my other votes have been attempts to start bandwagons or compromise votes for Bins/Kari because nobody would follow me on the other votes.

It's simple flow prediction. You've been going where you've predicted the flow would go, early on. That's the way I can best describe it. Sometimes, it's wrong, and you end up being the only one there (like voting Flubber), sometimes, it's right. But that doesn't change that it's still opportunism all the same. You don't have to be near the end of a wagon to be opportunistic. You don't even have to have much of a wagon at all to be opportunistic. The important thing about opportunism is sensing a weakness, latching onto it, and getting in while the going's good. Precise movements, well-executed, but still scum-driven.

If you were town, then you should have a slight reservation in your mind (I know because I’m playing exactly how I always play).

I have. For most of the game, I've been saying, "Wicked's probably scum, but I'm not sure". Basically scattered throughout my iso, it's there. That sensation that you are scum, but not very strongly so. Yet it's continued to grow as your scumplay has progressively more and more shown. The more scum things you've been doing, the more you've been making it obvious. And now, there is no doubt in my mind. There

was

, but your Kari vote killed it.

You are scum, who now thinks they can latch onto the recent(ish) wave of Mastin hate to get me lynched, which you were broadcasting in advance. (Your read on me has continued to shift downward, making it obvious where you'd place me, in a rather OMGUSy way: the read degenerated as my scumread grew, so now that I've begun to push you as scum for certain, you figured you might as well strike back.)

mastin has played with me more than any other player on this site, yet she has the worst track record when it comes to reading me.

Which I acknowledged early on...when I townread you. At the very beginning of the game, I quite literally said, "Wicked looks good, which means he's probably scum". To wit,

Reading Wicked as prob-town for what it's worth, though. (Which means he's almost certainly scum. )

Bins - 3 (Jaqen Hghar, Wickedestjr, Lying Cat)

That Bins wagon is actually really, really strong. Like, legitimately scarily strong. I mean, the other big wagons are good, it's just that they don't have the same magic attached to them.

Bins wagon strong with Wicked on it-->Wicked is a strong townread.

Bins - 5 (Lying Cat, mastin2, Jaqen Hghar,

Wickedestjr

, hiplop)

So you think there are No scum on the bins wagon and two scum in {SC, Mac, ika,

kari

}

Yep! Pretty much. I mean, it's theoretically

possible

for there to be a scum on Bins, it's just not particularly probable.

Think no scum're on Bins-->Think Wicked is town. (Albeit the only name on the Bins wagon who could be scum.)

So yes.
I was wrong on you this game, too.

When I

townread

you.

[Fluminator]

No you aren't cerb. Your playstyle is truly a breath of fresh air.

[mastin2]

At the point in the game you were at, it was super easy to(and I'm assuming you did this) just look at all the flips so far, and see that the setup everyone was assuming had to have been wrong, when the game didn't end with BB's lynch.

That's where you go wrong. You have to understand that there were specific dynamics going on in our hydra--Voided was more or less the tether to the game, the person most able to give the history, the status, the overall feeling of things. Bulbazak was the person I most trusted to handle the setup spec because he's basically one of the only people that I trust to be better than me at it. (For the record, sthar8 is on that list too.) I was working on basically trying to fill in the gaps that game. I wasn't really "in" that game. Not even when I was 'in' it, even though I was in it the entire time. (If that makes sense.)

I just know that in my limited experience with you, you proved unwilling to reevaluate given new information, and that's what I'm warning against.

And the new information is that the commuter is even more town than before.

Wicked - your sudden attack on mastin doesn't particularly gel with your post, which mainly explains how mediocre you feel mastin is at reading at you. If mastin is scum, this isn't a misread, so it feels like you're trying to have your cake and eat it too.

^That. I repeat, Wicked is scum.

I could definitely see Wicked-scum, because based off the one scumgame I remember him in this seems pretty similar.

Yep.

Yeah, Kari is just as good a lynch as Aristo. Nothing said recently alleviates this, and #2806 in particular makes me want her dead.

I feel both of them are equally bad lynches, though. Why not Wicked?

[ika]

No you aren't cerb. Your playstyle is truly a breath of fresh air.

was it me? if so im sorry i enjoy playing with you man

[Kari]

im stuck in the hospital for an estimate of a month now...at least i can sleep whenever i want.

but my glasses broke and i doubt it'll be repaired or fixed soon, so its more of a struggle to see anything with my phone for an extended period of time

i was staying in this game to prevent anti looking for a replacement but now that's completely impossible to stay. sorry anti, but im

gonna have to replace out

[mastin2]

is almost an exact replica of Exhibit A. Read the quotes from that game and tell me I'm wrong.

I admit.
I've considered specifically going to a previous game of mine, as scum, and deliberately using/subverting it.
Multiple times even.

But I'm talking big time games of mine.
Like Tales of You levels.
And used on players of that caliber. Like Nacho at least, if not AP levels. (Actually I think the idea spawned from me being desperate to find a way to subvert zMuf's accuracy on me.)

That recreation.

You...are none of those things.
I remember the game.
I remember the general way it happened.
I remember none of the specific individual posts in it.
And I certainly wouldn't be damned to look it up.

It's just the way I talk as town. So by trying to make a case for why I'm scum...all you've done is proved the opposite.

The more you push mastin as scum while explaining how she's always misread you as town, the more uncomfortable I get, Wicked.

^That, too.

This is the first time since Tough Guy where she has expressed absolute certainty.

Which I repeat, is blatantly ignoring the early game...

where I had uncertainty in my townread

...and basically all of the mid-game...where I had a lack of conviction in my scumread.

Wicked is now spinning a narrative convenient for his agenda, one that ignores the facts in the thread.

-She has told me that she didn't forget about Tough Guy.
-She nominated my scum team for a scummie after the other game ended.
No way she is ignoring those games if she is town here.

Thus the uncertainty early-on, which you conveniently ignore.

Read my articles on meta for more detail, but basically, my approach for things is to mostly take things game-by-game, yet always have awareness of what things have happened before. And while I'm certainly aware of what has happened before, and held great caution in the read, here I've grown increasingly certain that you are scum.

[Fluminator]

No you aren't cerb. Your playstyle is truly a breath of fresh air.

was it me? if so im sorry i enjoy playing with you man

No, it's not you. I enjoy playing with you too.
I don't want to make this all dramatic or mysterious. If anyone is wondering if it's them, it's not.

Another part is summer classes are starting and I wasn't expecting to be doing this game solo at this point. But now I feel like shit right now because Kari is actually replacing out for a real reason. :/

[ika]

No you aren't cerb. Your playstyle is truly a breath of fresh air.

was it me? if so im sorry i enjoy playing with you man

No, it's not you. I enjoy playing with you too.
I don't want to make this all dramatic or mysterious. If anyone is wondering if it's them, it's not.

Another part is summer classes are starting and I wasn't expecting to be doing this game solo at this point. But now I feel like shit right now because Kari is actually replacing out for a real reason. :/

ahh that makes sense.i dont blame you there man, i mean your reason is real as any other, RL/school takes priotiy.

[Jaqen Hghar]

So, Jaqen, you're certain Kari is scum now, because the people who you think are scum in spite of the cop clears are on the other wagon?

Where is a man saying that? A man is fine with either lynch as he's not sure either way, but he'll be damned if SB is getting away with an obvious misrep of the events without calling those ones out for it.

[mastin2]

you guys are idiots.

Or maybe the

second

person.
(LC and I mindmeld = goodthings if memory serves me.)

Maybe she is stubborn, but she has shown that she's not

this

stubborn as town;

Last time I played with mastin, this game, she was in the Horrifying Hero hydra and had a very very strong scum read on me starting from the bottom of page 1. I've never played with somebody so certain that I was scum, even though I was town and eventually forced to claim cop. Granted it was a few years back, but I have a hard time believing mastin forgot.

Actually...I didn't. That's the same reason I haven't voted you. (Well,

aside from the votes already on you

.)

Also bolding an important thing.
Circumstances, different games, etc. Context is key--I didn't vote Wicked in part because there were others suspicious of him, which made me think better of the idea.

Here it seems like people are hard-pressed for Wicked pressure.

Mastin, what changed between the post quoted by wicked and now to make you certain you were wrong, when you are well aware that you have what appears to be a very low chance of reading him correctly?

The course of the game.

Like I said.
Wicked's shown a very specific narrative convenient to him.

Which ignores the vast majority of the game.

[mastin2]

flum is pretty obviously town, confirmed status aside.

Yep. Pretty much.

Has Mastin been right all along?

Hey, it's happened before!

And believe me, I'd love that more than any other person!

But I'm pretty sure I'm horrendously wrong this game at least on some things, if not present then past.

Not on Wicked, though.

[Jaqen Hghar]

flum is pretty obviously town, confirmed status aside.

Confirmed is happening when one flips or with public mod communication. Did a man miss where anti is giving such info?

[mastin2]

(tl;dr on Wicked, btw.
Iso me.
Control-f Wicked.
Look for what I say about him.
Compare what is there, in my iso, about him, to what Wicked is

claiming

.
Then, vote Wicked.)

[Lying Cat]

The same thing, but combined with calling everyone idiots, phrased in an aggressive fashion.

Hi, I'm sthar! Is this your first post in the game?

Anyways, so regular cops are extremely town weighted? I'd disagree, but alright. Why is it irrelevant? Jaqen is trying to say that a cop with a weak modifier is so strong that there must be redirection in play on the scum side in order to balance it out. That seems relevant.

Well, cop played correctly reduces the game to a series of die rolls. And a huge chunk of the roles in modern mafia are attempts to balance against cop or fix it so that it's balanced. So you're wrong.

The reason it's irrelevant is because overestimating the strength of the role is not even close to the biggest hole in jacky's argument. He's assuming that redirection is the only possible counter for a weak role, which is patently insane.

[Lying Cat]

Ugh. X is Y because of reasons that are anti-town to discuss. I fucking hate that. I don't think I can express how much I loathe hiding a refusal to give actual reasons behind the guise of being forthcoming as something that's anti-town.

I'm going to graphically represent how much I care about this section of your post on a scale of one to ten, using little skulls on the following line:

The reason why you have to explain this in explicit terms is because you should just be speaking plainly, instead of attempting to make irrelevant jokes. You're strongly townreading Nacho and Mastin, and are almost at that same level of confidence with regards to TSO. Fantastic. How fucking hard would it have been to just say that?

We tried the speaking plainly approach, y'all still did dumb things. This way is more fun. Besides, I needed the info from flum.

LC, why does the invention he received have to be a tracker or rolecop?

blepp blepp stop right there. I named those two roles on purpose because they were relevant to the discussion. There is at least one more strong possibility but I chose my words carefully.

Maybe the inventor who usually invents us, should invent Cat tonight. What he does with it may be revealing.

tee hee

Jaqen, but it's strictly inferior to a normal cop. Are you saying a normal cop is extremely weighted to the town side?

No. Weak is 100% on all scum, even ninja and GF. Cop fails to GF. Watcher fails to Ninja.

Please don't get high at work. It could be dangerous.

You are either badly misusing that word or you don't know what it means. Define 'misrepping' for me.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misrepresentation

like i said that not how my meta works. try harder

Congratulations, you've mastered google. Now try again in your own words.

Replace me out Anti. You are a really good mod (probably the best I've seen), but a couple posters have been sapping the fun out of this for the entire game and now that Marq's out I just have no motivation. I tried to force myself to have some out of respect for you, but it didn't work.

Hope to see some of you in other games.

Bye. Sorry that my coping mechanism for people sapping the fun out of the game clashes with yours. Hope to see you again in something less stressful; I have tremendous respect for your abilities. If you see me around in post I'll be happy to explain anything in my play you have questions about.

@Kari- Bye. Feel better soon.

@mastin- i'm gonna do some paperwork and talk to jongle before i vote.

UNVOTE:

[Jaqen Hghar]

The same thing, but combined with calling everyone idiots, phrased in an aggressive fashion.

Hi, I'm sthar! Is this your first post in the game?

Anyways, so regular cops are extremely town weighted? I'd disagree, but alright. Why is it irrelevant? Jaqen is trying to say that a cop with a weak modifier is so strong that there must be redirection in play on the scum side in order to balance it out. That seems relevant.

Well, cop played correctly reduces the game to a series of die rolls. And a huge chunk of the roles in modern mafia are attempts to balance against cop or fix it so that it's balanced. So you're wrong.

The reason it's irrelevant is because overestimating the strength of the role is not even close to the biggest hole in jacky's argument. He's assuming that redirection is the only possible counter for a weak role, which is patently insane.

Nah. There's jail keeper as well which is far more common and often scum aligned. But that one isn't allowing an innocent/guilty result. Given the known, BD makes sense.

[Jaqen Hghar]

i'm gonna do some paperwork and talk to jongle before i vote.

Flush

and

spray

[Lying Cat]

this one's gonna require a match

[Aristophanes]

*sigh*
I really don't have time for this and I feel horrible for doing it, but

@Anti, may as well replace me out.

I apologize to all in the game for this. I did not expect I would be so busy.

I will continue to be here until a replacement is found.
Will read up tomorrow.

[ika]

Congratulations, you've mastered google. Now try again in your own words.

Misrepresentation is a concept in the contract law of England and some other Commonwealth countries, referring to a false statement of fact made by one party to another party, which has the effect of inducing that party into the contract. For example, under certain circumstances, false statements or promises made by a seller of goods regarding the quality or nature of the product that the seller has may constitute misrepresentation. A finding of misrepresentation allows for a remedy of rescission and sometimes damages depending on the type of misrepresentation. Misrepresentation is also capable of giving rise to an action in tort as well as contract law, for the tort of deceit.

[Jaqen Hghar]

For any sitting behind others' claim tha Bus Driver isn't a commonly used role and Is unlikely to be here as a reason to get off a good lynch- Kari slot- or not even getting on a better lynch- Lying Cat, a man is sharing some firsthand insight into the mind of anti. Since it's locked, and just so a man isn't capable of quoting, read 3460 here

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... start=3450

and then tell a man again how a Bus Driver isn't a distinct possibility here. And before it is being mentioned again how BD is a less common role- exactly how common is Weak?

[Jaqen Hghar]

So, Jaqen, you're certain Kari is scum now, because the people who you think are scum in spite of the cop clears are on the other wagon?

And for the sake of clarity as this one isn't playing before with a man- who is on what wagon is never a factor a man is concerning himself over. Scum bus. Scum being scum-read vote a scum buddy to get town off the wagon, scum vote to buddy townies. Scum do many things not worth getting a mind twisted over trying to figure out. A man is ONLY ever weeding out strong town reads to not vote for, looking for a plausible scum agenda, and voting accordingly. If a man is thinking there are five scum in a game and three he is scum reading are on another he is scum reading, a man is happy helping scum bus.