Newbie 1687 (Game Over)

[Reubus Swagrid]

Multiple people, especially newer players, attack and accuse me of scum convincingly now.

I'll give you a jump start:
I'm attacking Drixx, the leader of the Pam train. Use that and content as fuel for your arguments.
I've asked players questions, question my motives for those prods and reasonings for those questions.

I really thought I was the leader of the Pam train as per this post:

And also because it seems like everyone wants a Drixx lynch but everyone who hasn't voted is scared they'll look bad jumping on now.

VOTE: literallypam

This is RVS, nobody said they wanted a Drixx lynch. Also you're jumping on now? There is no case for Drixx being scum so jumping on this 'wagon' that has no substance would look bad, which is what you seem do be doing.

but whatever floats your boat

[FrogSC2]

Read the rules at the start of the game. Messaging a player about an ongoing game is a really big violation of the site rules here.

And anyway, you are doing very good at injecting aggressiveness into the game. You got me to respond, and with you two and me I think we can get the others involved more. Let's do it, yeah?

what's your read on frog?

Lol. Drixx is orbiting the dark side of the moon possibly all game. Such obvious radio silence.

For the sake of disclosure what I really think, and to encourage Drixx and others to open up:

Town:
Me- because I'm the sheriff jailor obviously
Kaesong- I've discussed this, I could ISO in a scum light, but the first pages D1 told me enough.
Panther- mind meld
Reubus- Pam push + range of interactions (genuine)

Slight town:
Drixx - will be lock clear if Pam flips, good instinct on pressuring, but hypocritical in not opening the game up and withholding opinions on literally anyone other than Pam
Notachipmunk - almost 100 null, but more willing to post about anyone/anything

Slight scum:
Kirroha - logic is off on current vote, avoids center of discussion (being it or discussing Pam/Drixx+Reubus)

Scum:
Literallypam- *uses dodge!* + perspective in posts
Rufus- focused defensive, felt like he was trying to just survive early D1 instead of hunting. +Reads of less logic


Remember, the flips can set up a path of changes in reads. It's ok to change your opinions *as long as you have a good reason and explain it*

The reason I'm setting this list out is to increase openness and discourage selfish play styles that actually hurt town. If no opinions are given, no actual day can exist beyond fluff, troll, or lurk.

[FrogSC2]

In some games, dependent on other players' experience, no reads list are necessary because everyone is capable of reading between the lines. This is not one of those games. I think if we were to go the subtle reads list route, it would quickly devolve into excessive/ unnecessary WIFOM. Not to mention it allows certain players to never commit to posting any opinions at all.

I guess I'm saying, forget fancy play for now. Try to be more open and honest, and if you're genuine it will show in your posts and responses. The obvious major benefit of this is we can develop an easy group POE list after we share our basic reads lists that were willing to stand by.

[FrogSC2]

Multiple people, especially newer players, attack and accuse me of scum convincingly now.

I'll give you a jump start:
I'm attacking Drixx, the leader of the Pam train. Use that and content as fuel for your arguments.
I've asked players questions, question my motives for those prods and reasonings for those questions.

I really thought I was the leader of the Pam train as per this post:

And also because it seems like everyone wants a Drixx lynch but everyone who hasn't voted is scared they'll look bad jumping on now.

VOTE: literallypam

This is RVS, nobody said they wanted a Drixx lynch. Also you're jumping on now? There is no case for Drixx being scum so jumping on this 'wagon' that has no substance would look bad, which is what you seem do be doing.

but whatever floats your boat

You sunk your battleship.

You want lock clear (pending scum flip) before going into the night that bad?

[notachipmunk]

I know you said don't hammer but since it's back at 3 votes, and pam not saying anything in this thread in over 2 days...
pressure back on him
VOTE: literallypam

also I think that is long enough to request a prod on him, yes?

[FrogSC2]

I tried a mod prod last page :-/

[FrogSC2]

I'm going to go out on a limb and assume there isn't any site feature that let's you generate or view current vote count and/or vote history?

@notachipmunk

Only real threat about L-1 is Pam can self hammer if she's scum (and obvious lynch today) and deny town any scum hunting / solving by literally killing the day early. You dig?

[notachipmunk]

So L-1 is bad? And do you think they would do that instead of trying to defend it (or answer any of the 109879087689087 questions presented to them and dodged?)

[FrogSC2]

So L-1 is bad? And do you think they would do that instead of trying to defend it (or answer any of the 109879087689087 questions presented to them and dodged?)

I'm leaning towards Pam is most likely actually scum.

I'm leaning towards everyone recognizes the Pam lynch D1 is 100% happening.

I'm leaning towards, if Pam were smart scum, he'd self-hammer to deprive town.

So yes, L-1 is a bad thing right now, on ANYONE.

[notachipmunk]

Alright UNVOTE:
If someone else can confirm to me that what Frog is saying is good reasoning that'd be cool. Like I assume that's generally a smart idea but I wanna know for sure that this isn't a don't-vote-pam-because-he-wants-to-spare-him kinda thing.
I am assuming Froglogic > my newbie logic

[FrogSC2]

Alright UNVOTE:
If someone else can confirm to me that what Frog is saying is good reasoning that'd be cool. Like I assume that's generally a smart idea but I wanna know for sure that this isn't a don't-vote-pam-because-he-wants-to-spare-him kinda thing.
I am assuming Froglogic > my newbie logic

Use the force young padawon warrior.

Look within you must.

You will know when you are calm, at peace.

[notachipmunk]

Alright UNVOTE:
If someone else can confirm to me that what Frog is saying is good reasoning that'd be cool. Like I assume that's generally a smart idea but I wanna know for sure that this isn't a don't-vote-pam-because-he-wants-to-spare-him kinda thing.
I am assuming Froglogic > my newbie logic

Use the force young padawon warrior.

Look within you must.

You will know when you are calm, at peace.

Ok, Yoda =p

[Rufus Delorian]

UNVOTE: LiterallyPam

Town:
Me- because I'm the sheriff jailor obviously

I'm probably falling into a silly simple trap here.

This is a lie, I'm the Jailkeeper.

Town wouldn't lie about this, FrogSC2 is the Mafia Roleblocker, we need to lynch him today, I'll jail Kagesong tonight and if there's no kill, we lynch him the next day.

VOTE: FrogSC2

Alternately, if you don't believe my claim, lynch me today and expose Frog's lie then lynch him and Kagesong...kill Frog or Me, that gives the most info

[notachipmunk]

@ Rufus

I took what Frog said as semi-sarcasm about his role, because isn't sheriff = cop which is a separate thing from jailkeeper?

[PantherPunt]

Goddammit Rufus

[Rufus Delorian]

I can't see any other way to read it:

Lol. Drixx is orbiting the dark side of the moon possibly all game. Such obvious radio silence.

For the sake of disclosure what I really think, and to encourage Drixx and others to open up:

Town:
Me- because I'm the sheriff

jailor

obviously
Kaesong- I've discussed this, I could ISO in a scum light, but the first pages D1 told me enough.
Panther- mind meld
Reubus- Pam push + range of interactions (genuine)

Slight town:
Drixx - will be lock clear if Pam flips, good instinct on pressuring, but hypocritical in not opening the game up and withholding opinions on literally anyone other than Pam
Notachipmunk - almost 100 null, but more willing to post about anyone/anything

Slight scum:
Kirroha - logic is off on current vote, avoids center of discussion (being it or discussing Pam/Drixx+Reubus)

Scum:
Literallypam- *uses dodge!* + perspective in posts
Rufus- focused defensive, felt like he was trying to just survive early D1 instead of hunting. +Reads of less logic


Remember, the flips can set up a path of changes in reads. It's ok to change your opinions *as long as you have a good reason and explain it*

The reason I'm setting this list out is to increase openness and discourage selfish play styles that actually hurt town. If no opinions are given, no actual day can exist beyond fluff, troll, or lurk.

He's the Mafia Roleblocker, check the role grid, maybe he stuck the Sheriff thing in there so he could claim he meant Cop if the Doctor got lynched or killed tonight.

[PantherPunt]

He wasn't being serious. But i understand what you thought and it's something to learn from.

Also, the only way you survive the night is if we lynch scum and you jail the other scum tonight. And I'm about 92% sure you targeting kage will not accomplish that.

[Rufus Delorian]

If you're right then...crap, big fuck up from me.

It's hard to read a joking tone from plain text.

[PantherPunt]

Little do scum know this is just some tricky #levels

And when you flip VT you'll be the town mvp

[FrogSC2]

Rufus is WIFOM master. Even sounded genuine.

Also, read:
"Follow the Cop" in the Wiki

[Reubus Swagrid]

I can't see any other way to read it:

Lol. Drixx is orbiting the dark side of the moon possibly all game. Such obvious radio silence.

For the sake of disclosure what I really think, and to encourage Drixx and others to open up:

Town:
Me- because I'm the sheriff

jailor

obviously
Kaesong- I've discussed this, I could ISO in a scum light, but the first pages D1 told me enough.
Panther- mind meld
Reubus- Pam push + range of interactions (genuine)

Slight town:
Drixx - will be lock clear if Pam flips, good instinct on pressuring, but hypocritical in not opening the game up and withholding opinions on literally anyone other than Pam
Notachipmunk - almost 100 null, but more willing to post about anyone/anything

Slight scum:
Kirroha - logic is off on current vote, avoids center of discussion (being it or discussing Pam/Drixx+Reubus)

Scum:
Literallypam- *uses dodge!* + perspective in posts
Rufus- focused defensive, felt like he was trying to just survive early D1 instead of hunting. +Reads of less logic


Remember, the flips can set up a path of changes in reads. It's ok to change your opinions *as long as you have a good reason and explain it*

The reason I'm setting this list out is to increase openness and discourage selfish play styles that actually hurt town. If no opinions are given, no actual day can exist beyond fluff, troll, or lurk.

He's the Mafia Roleblocker, check the role grid, maybe he stuck the Sheriff thing in there so he could claim he meant Cop if the Doctor got lynched or killed tonight.

This either confirms my suspicions or derails the fuck out of them.

[Reubus Swagrid]

Spoiler: Holy shit that wall of text

Multiple people, especially newer players, attack and accuse me of scum convincingly now.

I'll give you a jump start:
I'm attacking Drixx, the leader of the Pam train. Use that and content as fuel for your arguments.
I've asked players questions, question my motives for those prods and reasonings for those questions.

I really thought I was the leader of the Pam train as per this post:

And also because it seems like everyone wants a Drixx lynch but everyone who hasn't voted is scared they'll look bad jumping on now.

VOTE: literallypam

This is RVS, nobody said they wanted a Drixx lynch. Also you're jumping on now? There is no case for Drixx being scum so jumping on this 'wagon' that has no substance would look bad, which is what you seem do be doing.

but whatever floats your boat

You sunk your battleship.

You want lock clear (pending scum flip) before going into the night that bad?

What mean?

[FrogSC2]

Spoiler: Holy shit that wall of text

Multiple people, especially newer players, attack and accuse me of scum convincingly now.

I'll give you a jump start:
I'm attacking Drixx, the leader of the Pam train. Use that and content as fuel for your arguments.
I've asked players questions, question my motives for those prods and reasonings for those questions.

I really thought I was the leader of the Pam train as per this post:

And also because it seems like everyone wants a Drixx lynch but everyone who hasn't voted is scared they'll look bad jumping on now.

VOTE: literallypam

This is RVS, nobody said they wanted a Drixx lynch. Also you're jumping on now? There is no case for Drixx being scum so jumping on this 'wagon' that has no substance would look bad, which is what you seem do be doing.

but whatever floats your boat

You sunk your battleship.

You want lock clear (pending scum flip) before going into the night that bad?

What mean?

I've generally included both you and Drixx being the Pam promoters, but I framed a few arguments as Drixx being the leader of the Pam train (when you pretty much were).

You're asking for this recognition.

If Pam flips scum, as you suspect according to your vote, then you'll pretty much be a lock clear town. That would make you the main night kill target, especially is the public acknowledges you as the train leader.

I'm framing Drixx as the leader so in the event of Pam!Scum, Drixx is the preferred NK, because he is the more suspicious of the two of you (to me).

So what I'm saying is, why do you want that recognition of being seen as the Pam train leader?

It's in the open now, so no point in not explaining what I was doing there.

[FrogSC2]

I asked a series of pretty specific questions for:
Kagesong
LiterallyPam
Kirroha
Drixx
Rufus

Got some pretty plain answers. Feel free to dodge or dive into it. It's your choice.

[FrogSC2]

@Panther

Dead game is dead.

Sadness