I'm somewhat prepared to faith on Piper but I've done that before when Nacho was town and I had the same gut-feelings I do now.
TWL
Piper/Axel
^for lynch
Really really skeptical on a Skybird lynch.
Her/dramonic nullish
Mirhawk I might consider. tictac disappeared. Similar levels of nullscum here I think, although Mirhawk is more readable.
Cakez I like. Seniors I like. itle is town, Dwlee I have townvibes on - there was one thing Sakura said just before she left which I associated with town-sakura but it's not strong.
Dave's okay for now. He has no reason to defend Skybird, and yet is.
I'm forgetting other players. Not good. But that's what I've got currently. Happy to answer (non-wall) questions.
↑Cerberus v666 wrote:Anyways. Hey dram. Why does plot, a good player, doing newbscum things, make them likely to be scum? That doesn't actually make sense.
↑talah wrote:Fire Emblem was like the largest Day 1 in MS history and had some pretty awesome mechanics with children/players *entering* the game.
Have fun with that
I QUESTION THIS STATEMENT
I'm a hoot
Stream: twitch.tv/dramonic
-If you stick your ear close enough to the game thread you can actually hear dram suffer in real life.-Beeboy
-Being obtuse is not a consequence of being a mod, it's a prerequisite. I think you may just have overestimated my intelligence before.-Korts
Cerb slot moves down. He seems to be hella trying to take advantage of Dwlee here. I'm sorry. Fucking cerbs case is "ranger thought it"? Bullshit. This isn't town cerb.
Let's Lynch Piper.
Pip, axel etc, the important thing here is that your case seems to be based on skubird not playing well. Honestly, your points are irrelevant to alignment. Town fucks up too.
Vote actual scummy person Piper, please? Not just mislynch bait.
I like Dwlee better than I liked Sakura, but he also hasn't done much yet except sheep you on PP.
I kinda agree on Cerberus, though it's more because it seems like he's sitting back now and following. I agree trying to use dead Ranger's reads list as a basis for anything because "Rangers pretty good at catching scum" is weak. I think he also threw a vague shot at me which was also very much going along with the crowd.
I don't have any strong feelings about PP yet. It seems like your case is mostly "This looks like Plotscum." That means nothing to me.
And as far as Skybird, I'm not getting the distinction you seem to be making between "not playing well" vs "playing scummy." You don't agree that some of her stuff is actively scummy looking?
okay, so i've eatened and made tea and talah I really feel like we're saying a lot of words at each other but nothing is really coming of it. You ask me something, I answer, you ask me again, I answer again, you ask me again, I answer again. I think you're just going to have to deal with being paranoid of me this game. I think that you're town and I think that wordsing back and forth isn't really going to convince you of anything and so all it's doing is distracting me from what I wanted to do be doing which is lynching Skybird and if that's your goal then bravo I guess but we're wasting time.
I'll answer the rest of your points to finish out the discussion but I feel like we're at an impasse.
Spoiler: words
I know that our hydra hasn't been jumped on, and that it was more that I was
feeling
jumped on. Like I even said that nobody was doing anything wrong, it's just that when I'm not feeling well I tend to overreact to being pushed from certain angles (it's not the amount of pressure it's the angle of approach and some other things. It can happen even without anybody voting me.) and the solution is to just remove myself from the situation until I'm feeling less moody. The thing is that people tend to attack me in
certain ways
and from
certain angles
when coincidentally i happen to be dealing with things I don't feel like talking about and I don't really want to talk about this anymore.
In the blitz, some of the people who attacked me were town and others were scum. In the blitz, the people that I felt at the time were attacking me were town, and the people who were scum and were attacking me I didn't notice at the time. Some of the ways that hippy attacked me in the blitz are similar to the ways he's attacking me in this game, but there were some differences too. I listed them in a previous post. Why are you asking me to repeat myself?
I've told you at least five time that seniors is a townlean so i don't know why you keep asking me.
None of the reasons Mala's being scumread are alignment indicative for her. Nacho could speak better to why she's town, he has a lot more experience with her.
I'll add Axel to the end of my todo list. I know I'm being super autistic about this but I really just want to go back to what I was doing and not do wordwordswords back and forth when the words aren't accomplishing anything at all. Because I keep being in the middle of things and then people ask me to do something else instead and look at other things and I am getting stressed out that I won't get to go back to what I was in the middle of.
Nacho's pretty sure that we've found scum in Skybird and everyone is ignoring Marquis' case. It was a good case but everyone wants us to look at some other shiny thing instead.
@Dram: If I were scum, nobody would ever vote me and then I would win. Like, Nacho's one of the best players on this site. He's smarter than I am to begin with, and on top of that he has a lot more experience and a lot more practice. He's more versatile and insightful and articulate than I am. Yet all game people have been saying they want to read our hydra based on his posts, not mine. It's silly, I agree, but it should tell you something: I'm not a newb. You're going to have to use grown up tells on me instead.
VOTE: The Pied Piper
Lots of information, especially about previous games. Don't see an application of all that content to this game. Don't see penetrating analysis of events that might be expected.
A community that stifles dissent does not deserve the title of community
↑True Ogre wrote:Also just by the by, Axel continues to impress as scum.
I think it was itle that mentioned some 'GreyICE' tell. I read it at work and was about to just vote Axel if he was actually an alt.
Then I realised it wasn't actually GreyICE I was thinking of - it was ICEninja in Mini 1742. I really don't like the way Axel's coming in and sorta wall-posting cases on wagons which already have momentum. Out of the blue.
I can't remember exactly what the tell you said you got told about was, but I think Axel's quite likely scum and having a pretty decent verbose-scum-coasting game, most recently popping in with a series of accusations against Skybird in 3240.
Also Seniors I have you as town and not a small part of that is because of the shitty blitz game and the difference in your behaviour as opposed to there. I wouldn't be too quick to put Axel into a town category, just sayin'.
"Out of the blue?"
The entire reason I'm looking at the people I'm looking at is
because
they're getting votes. Those are the most relevant ones to case. I simply don't have the time to re-read everything anymore.
↑The Pied Piper wrote:@Dram: It's silly, I agree, but it should tell you something: I'm not a newb. You're going to have to use grown up tells on me instead.
You're sucking up to the wrong player sweetcheeks.
I'm a hoot
Stream: twitch.tv/dramonic
-If you stick your ear close enough to the game thread you can actually hear dram suffer in real life.-Beeboy
-Being obtuse is not a consequence of being a mod, it's a prerequisite. I think you may just have overestimated my intelligence before.-Korts
The only thing that has anything to do with our alignment that has been brought up as a reason to lynch us in my interactions with Sakura; I hadn't really gotten the chance to interact with her directly (which is rare) and I wasn't particularly surprised or interested by any of her posts. The only two points where anything she did became alignment relevant were ranger vote that seemed a little strange and her approach to the Swordsworth suspicion (framing it as a poor progression instead of calling out his reads as absolutely ridiculous). I thought that the way she approached me was town. I thought the way she got exasperated about Axelrod not realizing how obvious it was that she read Spiffeh's post before voting was town. None of these things from Sakura are significant enough to equal a read.
↑davesaz wrote:VOTE: The Pied Piper
Lots of information, especially about previous games. Don't see an application of all that content to this game. Don't see penetrating analysis of events that might be expected.
This is a terrible vote. As itlepip said, burden of proficiency. Your problem with the slot is that they haven't provided "penetrating analysis". Seriously?
↑True Ogre wrote:But pushing Mirhawk, Seniors, Ranger, Cakez and Skybird - all of whom have been or are vulnerable - without lucid explanations of that --
-- it doesn't seem like a town attitude from your hydra.
Pushing on people who are "vulnerable/not vulnerable" is not something that's particularly telling when the only players who are not vulnerable in this game are still pretty town (with Cerberus being the least town but not in the scum spectrum). I disagree that our explanations for the reads haven't been lucid: the least lucid read that we've had is my push on Ranger, but that's also not anywhere near how I handle deadline wagons as scum.
↑davesaz wrote:VOTE: The Pied Piper
Lots of information, especially about previous games. Don't see an application of all that content to this game. Don't see penetrating analysis of events that might be expected.
This is a terrible vote. As itlepip said, burden of proficiency. Your problem with the slot is that they haven't provided "penetrating analysis". Seriously?
Proficiency doesn't factor. The ratio of useless info is the key part.
A community that stifles dissent does not deserve the title of community
↑davesaz wrote:VOTE: The Pied Piper
Lots of information, especially about previous games. Don't see an application of all that content to this game. Don't see penetrating analysis of events that might be expected.
This is a terrible vote. As itlepip said, burden of proficiency. Your problem with the slot is that they haven't provided "penetrating analysis". Seriously?
Proficiency doesn't factor. The ratio of useless info is the key part.
Disagree. All their posts contain substance. They might ALSO contains things which you don't find substantive, but that doesn't mean they don't have more game relevant content than everyone else, other than True Ogre.
TPP: I don't quite understand your last post. Who is vulnerable/not vulnerable, and what are their likelihood of being town/not town?
↑The Pied Piper wrote:The only thing that has anything to do with our alignment that has been brought up as a reason to lynch us in my interactions with Sakura; I hadn't really gotten the chance to interact with her directly (which is rare) and I wasn't particularly surprised or interested by any of her posts. The only two points where anything she did became alignment relevant were ranger vote that seemed a little strange and her approach to the Swordsworth suspicion (framing it as a poor progression instead of calling out his reads as absolutely ridiculous). I thought that the way she approached me was town. I thought the way she got exasperated about Axelrod not realizing how obvious it was that she read Spiffeh's post before voting was town. None of these things from Sakura are significant enough to equal a read.
↑davesaz wrote:This is a terrible vote. As itlepip said, burden of proficiency. Your problem with the slot is that they haven't provided "penetrating analysis". Seriously?
cerb you're going OUT OF YOUR WAY to discredit the plotcase.
Look at how she is interacting with dram, that isn't town trying to show their side, its a strawman. A discredit. A chest pound.
It has LOTS more to do than just meta, axel. This is a slot with like 2029382838 words in their posts that have said like...2 things of actual content. This is a slot changing their reads based on convenience (Scumreads all day yesterday...now hard townreads me to no tomorrow? Same with people like skybird. Her read progression is illogical, fake, planned.
Plot is very good at recreating meta; but the important thing is that, she actively tries to recreate it. Shes gotten caught doing that poorly.
↑davesaz wrote:This is a terrible vote. As itlepip said, burden of proficiency. Your problem with the slot is that they haven't provided "penetrating analysis". Seriously?
cerb you're going OUT OF YOUR WAY to discredit the plotcase.
Look at how she is interacting with dram, that isn't town trying to show their side, its a strawman. A discredit. A chest pound.
It has LOTS more to do than just meta, axel. This is a slot with like 2029382838 words in their posts that have said like...2 things of actual content. This is a slot changing their reads based on convenience (Scumreads all day yesterday...now hard townreads me to no tomorrow? Same with people like skybird. Her read progression is illogical, fake, planned.
Plot is very good at recreating meta; but the important thing is that, she actively tries to recreate it. Shes gotten caught doing that poorly.
↑Friendless Seniors wrote:This is a slot changing their reads based on convenience (Scumreads all day yesterday...now hard townreads me to no tomorrow? Same with people like skybird.
Her
Their read progression is illogical, fake, planned.
why do you keep saying things that aren't true? (hint: I'm not hardtownreading you. you're just town enough that you're not my priority to sort right now. )
↑Friendless Seniors wrote:Plot is very good at recreating meta; but the important thing is that,
she
they actively tries to recreate it.
Shes
They've gotten caught doing that poorly.
hippy wrote:
Plot is very good at recreating meta;
loppy wrote:
doing that poorly.
hippy wrote:
very good
loppy wrote:
poorly
you can't have it both ways. Either I'm very good at it and wouldn't do it poorly, or I'm not very good at it and am therefore doing it poorly. This is what I mean by putting me into a situation where nothing I do will be what you want, where you're positioned to attack me regardless of my response to you. If I do something that reminds you of a game that I was town in (hint: because I'm town in this one, though most things I do aren't alignment indicative), then you can push me for "trying to recreate my town meta" instead of just...being town. If the real townplot doesn't conform to the imaginary townplot that you've constructed in your head, then you can push me for "doing it poorly".
I feel like if you were actually reading my posts to read them you would understand what I'm saying but you're not. I don't know why that is.
↑The Pied Piper wrote:The only thing that has anything to do with our alignment that has been brought up as a reason to lynch us in my interactions with Sakura; I hadn't really gotten the chance to interact with her directly (which is rare) and I wasn't particularly surprised or interested by any of her posts. The only two points where anything she did became alignment relevant were ranger vote that seemed a little strange and her approach to the Swordsworth suspicion (framing it as a poor progression instead of calling out his reads as absolutely ridiculous). I thought that the way she approached me was town. I thought the way she got exasperated about Axelrod not realizing how obvious it was that she read Spiffeh's post before voting was town. None of these things from Sakura are significant enough to equal a read.
I dont recall this even being brought up?
This is what happens when you don't read people's posts. (hint: This was a response to 3307)
Spoiler: surrounding context (trimmed for brevity)
↑True Ogre wrote:But pushing Mirhawk, Seniors, Ranger, Cakez and Skybird - all of whom have been or are vulnerable - without lucid explanations of that --
-- it doesn't seem like a town attitude from your hydra.
↑The Pied Piper wrote:Who do you think that we should be pushing that we're not? Is there anyone we're ignoring that we shouldn't be?
↑True Ogre wrote:But yes. I'd expect you to be on dramonic because he's unreadable to others, Axel because there was talk of it (me/nacho) earlier and essentially stronger players. I'd expect you personally to be comparing hiplop's play with the stupid fucking blitz where he tunnelled the shit out of me, and would expect either you OR nacho to have some kind of solid read on Sakura/Dwlee's slot.
↑The Pied Piper wrote:Pushing on people who are "vulnerable/not vulnerable" is not something that's particularly telling when the only players who are not vulnerable in this game are still pretty town (with Cerberus being the least town but not in the scum spectrum). I disagree that our explanations for the reads haven't been lucid: the least lucid read that we've had is my push on Ranger, but that's also not anywhere near how I handle deadline wagons as scum.
↑Cerberus v666 wrote:TPP: I don't quite understand your last post. Who is vulnerable/not vulnerable, and what are their likelihood of being town/not town?
I started going down the playlist and trying to list out who was vulnerable and why and I realised that pretty much everybody is vulnerable and that the definition of vulnerable seems to be something like "in danger of being lynched/vigged" or "the slot is receiving some amount of heat for some reason or other whether or not it's warranted" and the problem with that definition is that anybody who gets wagonned is vulnerable and then oh no we can't lynch them because we accidentally wagonned a vulnerable person however did Skybird get to L-3?!
pistachi0n would be vulnerable but etc. Marquis is a strong capable player who can hold his own who is town and not getting lynched. itlepip is just really obvtown who is not getting lynched. You, Cerb, are a strong enough player (though you're in danger of eventually being lynched for not doing enough and you could be scum). I don't think anyone's scumreading Ogre?
I think that's it really. Maybe nacho's working from a broader definition of invulnerable.
podoboq, tictac, davesaz, and to a lesser extent mala are all vulnerable players who are varying degrees of town enough.
Like, Nacho's one of the best players on this site. He's smarter than I am to begin with, and on top of that he has a lot more experience and a lot more practice. He's more versatile and insightful and articulate than I am. Yet all game people have been saying they want to read our hydra based on his posts, not mine. It's silly, I agree, but it should tell you something: I'm not a newb. You're going to have to use grown up tells on me instead.
