Mini 1793: Freedom's Call (uPick Anything): Finale

[RadiantCowbells]

Thanks everyone for playing!

[Postie]

This was super fun!

[lilith2013]

Thanks for modding RC! Much enjoy. Sorry for being MIA the past few day phases, seems like SS carried us fine though

[drmyshottyizsik]

Great game! BTW my flavour is flipped now so you can see why I pointed that out, which I guess was a bad idea. Also it was definitely town sided. What I pulled should have fucked us worse than it did.

[drmyshottyizsik]

seriously though rc thank you!

[Yume]

Thank you from me as well.

[Antihero]

it was definitely not townsided.

[Antihero]

the fact that scum got absolutely rolled and still made it to mylo alone should be sufficient testament to that.

[Ircher]

Really?

Even tho it was 4 scum, one of us was Voteless+Double Day.

Another was literally confirmed out of 4 players as scum, and wouldn't really survive in lylo.

Town had a Cop who knew there was a godfather.

Town also has a Hated Doublevoter which is super dangerous.

Scum had a Odd Redirector/Even Watcher (That was super powerful), Loyal Rolestopper (Potiently useful, but ended up not being so), 1-Shot Strongman Absorber Neighborizer (Meh), and a N1, Even-Night Role Cop (Actually fairly weak since I didn't even get full role pms. I literally was given the role name).

PR-wise, it was definitely townsided. (Your role was also pretty powerful).

If RC took out the Double Day modifier on White's role, I could see it as balanced. But, Gamma survived cuz of gameplay. The rest of us got screwed by roles (Titus and White by Postie's Governor Vengeful role, I got screwed by the Informed Townie confirming I was scum)

[Antihero]

town winning does not mean it was townsided
town winning does not mean it was townsided
town winning does not mean it was townsided

say it with me, kids

[Antihero]

Loyal Rolestopper (Potiently useful, but ended up not being so),

very useful, that meant the cop and the tracker and the jailkeeper couldn't touch whoever they targeted

[Antihero]

Town also has a Hated Doublevoter which is super dangerous.

no

just no

1) it made town lose a day
2) double voter is not that dangerous

[Antihero]

PR-wise, it was definitely townsided. (Your role was also pretty powerful).

my role was not "pretty powerful"

the bus driver could've significantly helped town in 1 in a million situations. that does not mean my role was "very powerful."

[Nahdia]

i honestly didn't understand ur role at all antihero. like, didn't know what i was reading.

[Ircher]

PR-wise, it was definitely townsided. (Your role was also pretty powerful).

my role was not "pretty powerful"

the bus driver could've significantly helped town in 1 in a million situations. that does not mean my role was "very powerful."

i honestly didn't understand ur role at all antihero. like, didn't know what i was reading.

It definitely looks powerful.

[Antihero]

it was pretty much a joat except i didn't know what any of the stuff did.

turns out:
1 of them told me how many scum there were (oooohhhhhhh, powerful)
1 of them let me have a 1-shot delayed version of someone else's power (came with the same baggage the originals came with, not that great)
1 of them was a bus driver
1 of them refilled shots (not sure who that's applicable to)
1 of them made everyone loved if they sang a song (couldn't use that after day 2, this really didn't have any effect on balance)

[Antihero]

PR-wise, it was definitely townsided. (Your role was also pretty powerful).

my role was not "pretty powerful"

the bus driver could've significantly helped town in 1 in a million situations. that does not mean my role was "very powerful."

i honestly didn't understand ur role at all antihero. like, didn't know what i was reading.

It definitely looks powerful.

you are overestimating the power of roles

there was a miniscule change i was going to find or kill scum with my role

[Ircher]

Effectively, RC made a 4p Scumteam in to a 2p scumteam with extra night abilities.

[Nahdia]

i mean, for a 8-4 is gonna need some strong town abilities. scum could have won after only two mislynches. that's pretty unforgiving. town just played well here in general.

[Antihero]

Effectively, RC made a 4p Scumteam in to a 2p scumteam with extra night abilities.

lolwat?

2?

how did it become 2?

[Antihero]

i mean, for a 8-4 is gonna need some strong town abilities. scum could have won after only two mislynches. that's pretty unforgiving. town just played well here in general.

EXACTLY

the town ev for an 9:3 (fine, i won't count the voteless) mountainous is somewhere between 10-20%.

town needs a lot of power to level the playing field.

that's why town having a lot of power does not make the game townsided.

[Ircher]

i mean, for a 8-4 is gonna need some strong town abilities. scum could have won after only two mislynches. that's pretty unforgiving. town just played well here in general.

White didnt have a vote. So, 4p --> 3.

Then I got confirmed out of 4p as scum, so while that might generate a ML, no way I'd survive in LyLo or MyLo. So, 3 --> 2.

[Antihero]

Then I got confirmed out of 4p as scum

no, that was NOT a death sentence

it was a death sentence for YOU
because you were scummy

[Antihero]

sorry if i sound really insufferably opinionated on this

but i am

i think the problem is that people THINK the ratios we conventionally run mafia games at (1 scum to ~3 to 4 town) is approximately balanced. and, in all fairness, it's intuitive. that's our convention so the ev should be somewhere near 50/50, right?
nope.
it's not.
it's ridiculously scum-sided.

but after town wins, people grumble about it being townsided. and when this happens, mods are faced with a dilemma: make a scumsided setup or face potentially getting fussed at after the game. it creates a site meta that pressures mods to make scumsided setups and that bothers me.

[Ircher]

EV doesnt acct for play. Town benefits from extra days and more flips.