New York 195: Adventure Mafia - Game over!

[Expedience]

VOTE: Seth

Post later, probably

[projectmatt]

Okay. Here's some stuff.

I still think

Ircher

is town - and I've expanded on the reason why many, many times so I'm not going to explain it again.

I initially voted

SethYazura

because some of his posts - in particular, post #182 that had phrases like "my fellow town" and post #378 came off as very forced/awkward, and the way that he speaks is absurdly ...not something that comes off as natural. However, my scumread on him has also weakened slightly. This is because I recently realized that he's also new to the game - and while being new does not excuse scummy play, it does kind of excuse some of his stuff coming off as forced/weird. I know that I was the same way when I first started playing, so I'm not sure if I can really, honestly say that I scumread Seth for valid reasoning. Because of that, I'm going to

UNVOTE

him.

My inital scumread on

TehBrawlGuy

has turned into a town read, especially in light of posts like #1178. He had an awkward opening to this game that I called him out on, but it seems like he's found his voice - and his analysis, aggression, and general demeanor come off as town to me. He also handled the pressure on him tremendously well.

I think

Shotty

may be town. At first, I read his play as nonsensical and silly - but as this game goes on further, I'm understanding the kind of playstyle that he's going for. In particular, it seems like his play is based heavily on this idea of putting a lot of pressure on certain people, and basically dialoguing with people "in the moment" to get reads. That playstyle itself isn't inherently town - I really dislike his tunnel on Ircher. However, his actions do make sense coming from a town perspective. In particular, his recent unvote on Ircher to a frustrated revote almost immediately after came off as sincere to me, and generally more spontaneous than most scum like to try.

I dislike the

Copper

wagon, primarily because the reasoning behind it that I can see is very, very silly. I don't think that Copper has particularly scumtold, and a lot of his questioning/attempts at scumhunting come off as sincere. I can list specific examples if needed, but I'm too lazy to get them without prompting.

I hate

Nadhia's

tunnel on Ircher. Like, it sucks. It reeks of trying to come off as way too confident when the substance behind the read is really small. In particular, I dislike her trying to paint Ircher's point system as somehow scummy. At the very worst, that's a completely null tell. On the other hand though, we actually sort of hiveminded on our read on Anen, and I actually think her read is solid even though I really wish she would give more logic for it. I also like her pretty solid questioning of Titus. I think maybe my issue with Nadhia is that our playstyles conflict - so I'm not really willing to say that she's scum. In light of the push on Anen that seems to be coming from a town place, she's far more likely to be town.

When it comes to

Aneninen

, I initially thought his catch-up posts were pretty great, and called out a lot of my own similar reads. However, since he's caught up, it feels like he's kind of been flailing/coasting, and his reads are coming off as weaker and weaker as the day progresses.

For example, his post #569 comes off as weirdly, oddly forced after having sounded completely natural before it. His substance-less attack on Shotty by basically saying "no, you!", his "gotcha!" moment on Zakk that really just seems like a twist in wording, and his weird questioning to the mod about whether or not scum have daytalk comes off as pretty forced towntells. From there, his posts kind of fall off awkwardly, and kind of culminate in the worst way possible with his comment to the mod about how the scum must have encryptors. It's weird, and it's forced.

I'm inclined to think that

Egg

is town. My only concern with him is that he asks a lot of really important, interesting questions, but it seems like his questions don't really lead him to any conclusions, and I worry that could be used as a filler. Otherwise, he's a townread.

Zakk

and

EspeciallytheLies

are still town, as I previously covered.

Titus

is town too. I don't think I need to explain these, but I can if needed.

Persivul

is probably scum too. His attacks are super weak and it seems like he's grasping at straws to find reads - particularly in posts #950, #986, and #792 all come off as really, really desperate.

I could be sold on

heuristically_alone

being scum, especially because his recent reads list is a lot of words with little reasoning/substance.

I'm gonna call that "good enough". If anyone has specific questions about a read, feel free.

Anyone that I didn't mention is null/scum.

[projectmatt]

Vote: Aneninen

[Nahdia]

sorry that u flipped scum, matt my friend good vote tho. thank u for bussing.

[projectmatt]

No problem =) I'm glad to see u in this game

[Expedience]

sorry that u flipped scum, matt my friend good vote tho. thank u for bussing.

What don't you like about the post?

Yet you voted for Ircher in your fist post!
How does that add up?!

Yeah. Whatever.
But you still haven't explained your way of thinking, as for Ircher's readlist.

im not explaining this to u. maybe one of ur scummates in the scum PT can explain it.

Good.

Scum do not have mechanical day talk. That's as much as I'll say on that.

Thanks for telling us that scums have an Encryptor. Is it you?

these two posts. i seriously cannot fathom them coming from a town player. i just can't.

I can fathom those posts coming from a town player. I think you are being mechanically stubborn, this is just the Amen-nine way.

[Egg]

Page 36:
Interesting points from Titus on Zakk and Brawl. If one of them flips scum, I could see them as buddies. I'm still townreading their individual play though.

There's killthestory doing whatever Titus wants again. Titus how are you not concerned about this?

Page 37:
Persivul, do you think Titus and ETL are scum together? I see you are scumreading both, but I'm trying to figure out if one of them flipping scum would change your read on the other.

Page 38:
Hmm. You guys are making me doubt my town read on zakk. I just saw his scum game and it wasn't anything like this but...Iunno.

Really hope we can expect some reasoning behind Nahdia's reads.

Page 39:
Ok Zakk's response is good. He can be town again.

Magna posting the Ircher wagon makes me even more sure Ircher is scum. I'm townreading the entire wagon from it's height except Cy. Cy's wagon on the other hand has Seth, heur, and Ircher as vote 3-5 at that point. Ew.

Page 40:
Not sure what to make of Seth's posting here. It seems better, but hypocritical at the same time.

Yikes, Nahdia is gonna be anoying to play with.

[copper223]

Ok paranoia moment is over.

VOTE: Magma

[Titus]

@ProjectMatt - Why are your reads so bad? HA's wall had reasoning. Why do you think HA's readwall lacks reasoning, but TBG has depth?

TBG handled the pressure on him extremely well? Are we even reading the same thread? 1178 is a pile of hypocritical garbage.

Anen's behavior is fine and I even referenced a game to compare to.

Nahdia read is right for wrong reasons.

@Egg, Talk to me when you are done.

@Ircher, I think Shotty spams back there to drown out the case on TBG.

[Titus]

VC Please

[SirCakez]

Votecount 1.15

Cape Horn in Chile!

TehBrawlGuy (5) - Titus, MagnaOfIllusion, SethYazura, Aneninen, Ircher
Ircher (3) - Egg, cytheflyguy, drmyshottyiszik
Aneninen (3) - Nahdia, Lowell, projectmatt
heuristically_alone (2) - zakk, TehBrawlGuy
SethYazura (2) - Nosferatu, Expedience
Titus (2) - Persivul, EspeciallyTheLies
Killthestory (1) - I Am Innocent
cytheflyguy (1) - heuristically_alone
zakk (1) - Killthestory
MagnaOfIllusion (1) - copper223

Not voting (0)

With 21 alive, it takes 11 votes to lynch someone.

(expired on 2016-06-02 14:10:00) remain until day end

EspeciallyTheLies is V/LA until May 31.
MagnaOfIllusion is V/LA until May 31.
Lowell is V/LA until May 31.
Ircher will be V/LA from May 30 to June 3.

[zakk]

Anybody who's voting for a 1 man wagon needs to jump off, reread, and pick a wagon

Anybody who's voting TehBrawlGuy is either stupid, scum, or not paying attention

Anybody who's voting ircher, that ship has sailed and it's time for you to stop doggy paddling towards it

In other words

Everyone vote heuristic. I could also do with a wagon swimg onto ETL.

[Ircher]

Anybody who's voting for a 1 man wagon needs to jump off, reread, and pick a wagon

Anybody who's voting TehBrawlGuy is either stupid, scum, or not paying attention

Anybody who's voting ircher, that ship has sailed and it's time for you to stop doggy paddling towards it

In other words

Everyone vote heuristic. I could also do with a wagon swimg onto ETL.

........I could possibly vote Heur as Heur hasn't been extremeky useful, but I feel ETL's engagement with Titus was a frustrated TvT. The Brawl wagon, while I have my doubts, I feel has the best chance if landing on scum out of the viable wagons. If I didn't have V/LA, I'd probably try to get a different wagon to go through.

[drmyshottyizsik]

Anybody who's voting for a 1 man wagon needs to jump off, reread, and pick a wagon

Anybody who's voting TehBrawlGuy is either stupid, scum, or not paying attention

Anybody who's voting ircher, that ship has sailed and it's time for you to stop doggy paddling towards it

In other words

Everyone vote heuristic. I could also do with a wagon swimg onto ETL.

You are telling people that the largest wagon is bad. You are saying the single voters are bad. You are telling people to pick an existing wagon. Ircher is the second largest existing wagon, second to the wagon you say is bad. Yet you say that the ircher ship has sailed? Seriously this is nothing other than a cryptic defense for ircher.

[Ircher]

And Brawl........

[drmyshottyizsik]

And Brawl........

But that wagon is obviously crap. He just said that so once tbg flips town he can gain town points

[projectmatt]

@ProjectMatt - Why are your reads so bad? HA's wall had reasoning. Why do you think HA's readwall lacks reasoning, but TBG has depth?

TBG handled the pressure on him extremely well? Are we even reading the same thread? 1178 is a pile of hypocritical garbage.

Anen's behavior is fine and I even referenced a game to compare to.

Nahdia read is right for wrong reasons.

HA's readwall because it has stuff like:

Titus- I’ve played with Titus in his scum game, and she is really hard to read as scum. Titus is really good at making any player she wants appear scummy if she wants. While I’ve seen scum and town reads, I don’t see any attempts to make elaborate pushes bringing up evidence for it, so I want to say town lean.

that comes off as slightly illogical and like a very, very weird meta read. The reason HA has you as town is because you haven't tunneled anyone so far, which is weird.

What's hypocritical about #1178? It looks pretty solid to me. I don't see where he has flailed under pressure at all. I'd love some examples.

I don't think Anen's behavior is fine, for reasons I listed.

[projectmatt]

As a correction to that previous post, HA's readwall is bad because of the thing that I quoted above.

[projectmatt]

I also now see your reasons for disliking #1178 after looking again, but I don't find them particularly solid.

[drmyshottyizsik]

Matt I think that quote is what we would call well poisoning.

[Expedience]

I think h_a is town so [my reads / this town] must be kinda fucked

[projectmatt]

Matt I think that quote is what we would call well poisoning.

Can you elaborate? I know what well poisoning means in this context, but I don't see how it relates.

[drmyshottyizsik]

Titus- I’ve played with Titus in his scum game, and she is really hard to read as scum.

Titus is really good at making any player she wants appear scummy if she wants.

While I’ve seen scum and town reads, I don’t see any attempts to make elaborate pushes bringing up evidence for it, so I want to say town lean.

[Expedience]

What is that supposed to imply

[projectmatt]

Are you saying that HA set that up so that if Titus later attempts to push for the actual scum, HA can discredit it by referencing his read? Interesting.