Literally Anything uPick (Game Over)

[Ircher]

L-1

[Ircher]

You didn't necessarily have to vote the top wagon @Shotty that was @L-2, you could've just said who'd you vite for RVS

[Ircher]

VOTE: Ircher

that back to back scum Upick luck tho

??? - Pls explain what you mean here (unless you're implying I'm scum here too as a joke)

/softclaim

I'm also confused here. What are you trying to accomplish with this post/why do you want to soft-claim???

In this case, yes. Since I cannot be targeted at all during night, your best bet is to try to lynch me. While I do die and the end of day 2, that's plenty of time for me to damage you.

this post sums up a lot about how I feel about Yume

Ok

eh you do what you want

if you are having fun then keep on keeping on

you're good to keep around for contrast let's just say I'm not gonna shed tears at the end of day 2

Meh.

I would never waste a NK on you no matter what your role

jus sayin

Meh.

also IC just don't get lynched, its not a thing, thats why your comment shows your lack of awareness of what is possible in mafia day play

Still, it's not necessarily scummy to think that way.

can we please stop this useless conversation right now and talk about everything but Yume and the RVS wagon on her

Klingon and Postie are townish atm

Meh.

give them time its not like there was much more pressing matters to attend to

Meh.

Fate, why are you townreading Klingoncelt?

tone of her posts

Is that it?

Clumsy is neutral/scummy for reasons I don't really know

I'm liking my vote on Ircher, and really don't like his push on Postie (or the postie wagon at all for that matter)

What was wrong about the Postie oush? Illogical != Scummy && Scummy != Scum.

you're pushing him for stalling ot uvote the IC right?

Which is essentially Yume's pants on head argument

I have higher standards for your "reasonable" arguments

Why the double standard? Would you be scumreading Yume if say Ranger was the IC and Postie kept the vote on Ranger?

RVS vote again?

the literal fuck?

Ircher needs to hang

Meh, but I think you're not anakyzing motives rn tbh.

Katsuki are we gonna lynch him or not

Stop advocating QLynches. I remember last time I got QLynched D1 was in Mini 1777 for general apathy. I was town in that game btw which people realized post hammer. (****LOOKING AT YOU, KATSUKI****)

You...you...big fat stupid ugly jerks!

this isn't a very kawaii post Ranger

Meh.

I'd go with Neutral-Town here.

[Postie]

UNVOTE:

Not comfortable with Ircher at L-1 just yet.

[drmyshottyizsik]

You didn't necessarily have to vote the top wagon @Shotty that was @L-2, you could've just said who'd you vite for RVS

you seemed very paranoid

[Ircher]

VOTE: Yume

Ok

8. Thou shalt vote in thread in this form

vote Untrod Tripod

or

vote UT

.

Wait we're allowed to use the regular voting tags right?

Meh.

I don't know what to make of Massive's "Don't worry I'm town" entrance.

It's null.

Indeed it is.

This post restriction is going to be the best part of this game. Easily.

Meh.

It's slightly suspicious and I think I should at least know why.

Not really. Do you think scum would actually try and get an IC lynched?

Absolutely. RC might not in this particular game, but that's definitely a gambit scum would make (esp. scum!RC)

I should probably pick a new wagon though.

VOTE: massive

Convenient vote-switch. No reason provided here either.

There are what, three/four scum? Even if all of them voted you, that wouldn't be enough to lynch you. You think town's going to hop onto an IC wagon?
Also, why would scum do that when you just die at the end of day 2? They'd be sacrificing a free kill.

This game is bastard; while YOU are certain of your alignment, even mod-comfirmed info in-thread in a bastard game can be false. Look at some of the Grand Idea roles for instance.

They might if you use a convincing enough argument, i.e he/she brings town more harm than good. And you can't deny that scum want to get rid of IC as fast as possible.

But you die at the end of day 2 so there'd be no point? Why go to the trouble of lynching someone who's going to die the next day anyway?

Still arguing.....

Also, your posts seem rehearsed.

Okay.

Someone else talk to me so I start engaging in a way that's productive.

I agree with Yume.

Fate, why are you townreading Klingoncelt?

Decent.

Yume, sometimes people are just lazy. You're in no danger of being lynched so there's no harm in anyone who's already voted you not unvoting if they haven't made up their mind on who else to vote for.
It doesn't mean anything and it's time to move on.

Do you have any townreads?

Did you have to engage in this argument?

VOTE: Ircher

Nice OMGUS vote.

stubbornly refuse to unvote a confirmed townie

No one was doing this.

My bad, I forgot that was the case THROUGH YOUR 5 OTHER POSTS TRYING TO ARGUE A CASE.

Pedit: You're luterally arguing with Yume about it. That's refusal.

MY VOTE ISN'T ON YUME
IT HASN'T BEEN ON YUME SINCE SHE BROUGHT IT UP

See above.

My vite stands.

Why

Your tone seems forced. You decided to engage in a page long discussion on why voting an IC isn't scummy, and yet you OMGUS vote me for what apparently amounts to poor logic.

How townie to change vote instantly after someone calls you out on bad vote.

Would not unvoting have been townier?

Yeah, rather than switching to the wagon with the most votes at the time without giving a reason.

Yume, can I ask you a favour? Will you please focus on getting townreads this game and just stay away from scumreading anyone for now? That doesn't mean you have to stop attacking people and pressuring them, just don't write them off as scum.
You're playing in a way that's overly paranoid and it won't work to get scum lynched. Focusing on deciding who

isn't

scum and taking things from there is going to be more helpful for you at the moment.

You're still scum.

Ignoring you was my first instinct, yes, but I'd prefer if you stopped tunneling town and someone who may or may not be town for nonsensical reasons and directed your attention somewhere else, because that way you might actually be useful and improve your play.
And I fully expect to get scumread for taking this approach but it seems like it'll get more shit done so I don't care.

Scum.

Okay, can you tell me what things people have said that made you townread them?

Scum.

Are you really comparing my situation to yours here? Nobody's tunneling you.

Scum.

No no keep engaging with Clumsy! That would actually be really helpful.

Scum.

Yeah I probably shouldn't have said that.

Okay whatever I'm ready to do the ignoring you thing now.

@Fate

- Read on Clumsy?

Meh.

VOTE: Postie

*hits that was easy button*

Yep, I expected that. I'm pretty sure I did the 100% tell too.
This is what I was saying about your spreadsheet failing eventually because it's possible I'll do the things I do as scum as town at some point.
Phone-posting but I'm when I get to a computer I'll probably go over the context of some stuff to explain why you'are getting false positives.

Would you be open to getting a neighborhood with me from night 1 onwards and leaving your decision on my alignment until after then? Because that can be arranged. It would help me

a lot

in figuring you out too.

Don't like the way this is worded.

That's 100% not what I'm saying.
Ugh let me get to a computer so I can explain why you're wrong and understanding the context of tells matters.

Meta defense

@RC

Okay, I have no idea how accurate my guess about half this stuff is going to be, but I'll give it a shot.
Everyone else can feel free to ignore everything I'm about to say since it isn't really that relevant to you.

To start with we're going to travel back in time to my first newbie game. Bear with me.

Below is an exchange between me and another player in that game.

Spoiler:

We're in RVS; why do you feel the need to justify your vote to this extent?

I wasn't justifying my vote at all. I was talking about information theory. My vote has nothing to do with Jean's predgidous against generalizations!

Why are you purposely misrepresenting information for reach tells?

Apologies. Jean criticised your vote because he didn't like the logic you used, so can you understand how I may have mistakenly assumed that, when you defended the logic you were using, you were trying to defend your vote? What makes you think I was deliberately misrepresenting information?

Why apologize? Trying to appeal to me already?

VOTE: Postie

I was trying to be courteous. Could you please answer my question?

And thus began the start of what I'm going to call the could-you-can-you tell, where as scum I have a habit of starting a question with the words "could you..." or "can you..." (usually it's "can you...", but "could you..." shows up occasionally).
Idk if that's what you're using, but if it's not then it's probably something similar, or related.

In that game, however, unlike any other game where the could-you-can-you tell has applied, I was town, and that's why its context is important.
You'll notice that in the above exchange the way I'm interacting with Fugitive comes across as extremely forced. That's because it is. Asides from general newbie awkwardness, I was annoyed at the way Fugitive kept overreacting and so I forced myself to be polite because I didn't really want to get into an unnecessary argument with them.

In future games, I loosened up a bit and so never could-you-can-you'd again. Except in my scum games, of course, and that's because this tell is a sign that I'm not acting 100% naturally and forcing my responses.

It doesn't apply in the context of my interactions with Yume for the same reason it didn't apply back then. I was ready to just tell Yume to get lost but I figured actually trying with her was going to be more productive, not to mention just kind-of nicer.
I considered censoring myself, but quite frankly, I'm not going to choose to interact with someone in a shitty way that's less likely to get them to change their mind in order to keep to someone else's perception of my town meta.

So there you have it. Any questions?

Meta defense

When you ask those "could you can you" questions as scum, what ultimately is your goal? Why is it different than your goal in (say) 126?

this tell is a sign that I'm not acting 100% naturally and forcing my responses

Like there's no goal it's just a thing I naturally do when I'm being unnatural.

Oh wow I just realised I've only could-you'd once. I probably was censoring myself originally then lol.

*can-you'd

I guess what I'm looking for is, why would anyone consider basic politeness scummy?

Because I've done it in every one of my scum games and none of my towngames with the exception of my first game.
RC has a spreadsheet on my tells and I don't see why this wouldn't be on it since it's one of the first things I noticed I did after the disaster that was Open 636.

something something schrödinger's cat

Clumsy is more of a neutral to townlean for us. His posts seem really natural and generally townie. He hasn’t done a ton yet, but we’re getting good vibes from him so far.

Gimme more details on this?

Hmmn. I actually like the look of Ranger's reads this game.

Why's Ircher town?

Why am I nit town?

This is scum.
VOTE: Postie

[Ircher]

You didn't necessarily have to vote the top wagon @Shotty that was @L-2, you could've just said who'd you vite for RVS

you seemed very paranoid

And thats a scumtell cuz?

Yeah, cuz I've been Qhammered / lolhammered before at L-1 (Again, looking primarily at you, Katsuki)

[Katsuki]

VOTE:YUME

Wait, VOTE: Katsuki for not paying attn.

lol so what about it makes be scum?

Like seriously, stop pulling stunts.

lel angry scum caught trying to push a stupid vote

[Postie]

lol nevermind

VOTE: Ircher

[drmyshottyizsik]

ircher leave kat alone, kat is a cupcake

[Katsuki]

It's ok shotty, put him out of his misery.

Just read #196, he clearly knows I'm town, he's not even trying to justify a scumread on me. He is scum.

[SirCakez]

VOTE:YUME

the fuck?

That's 100% not what I'm saying.
Ugh let me get to a computer so I can explain why you're wrong and understanding the context of tells matters.

This is scummy

A secret hydra.....

Very disappointing....

It's secret?

Ot was reasonable at the time.
VOTE: massive --> RVS Vote again

the fuck?

Cakez is somehow doing even less than usual...not sure how to feel about that. He looks like he is just trying to look busy IMO.

I'm usually pretty involved qq

VOTE: Postie
This is good

I think this Ircher wagon is scumdriven and I'm not going to vote there.
I'm gonna do a Ranger readslist to try to get me more engaged in the game, those usually help me out

Town - Yume, Ranger
Nulltown - RC, Ircher
Null - CatDog, Katsuki, massive
Nullscum - drmyshottyizsik, Fate, Clumsy
Scum - Postie, Klingoncelt

This needs more sorting but this is what I got from the top of my head and some re-reading

[Postie]

I think this Ircher wagon is scumdriven

Why?

[SirCakez]

Because Ircher is a super easy mislynch and I don't think he is legitimately scummy. His "return to RVS" was bizarre but I don't think it's from scum.
And the wagon got to L-1 way too easily.

[Postie]

What do you make of his above wallposts?

And the wagon got to L-1 way too easily.

That's not a thing.

[SirCakez]

What do you make of his above wallposts?

bizarre but I don't think it's from scum.

And yes it is....

[Postie]

I keep wanting to unvote Ircher but then I reread his "case" on me and can't do it. :/

[Postie]

Ah fuck it

UNVOTE:

I need more time to decide who gets into the neighbourhood anyway, and CatDog needs to talk to me.

[Ircher]

VOTE:YUME

Wait, VOTE: Katsuki for not paying attn.

lol so what about it makes be scum?

Like seriously, stop pulling stunts.

lel angry scum caught trying to push a stupid vote

Don't make the same mistake twice

--- Though you weere scum that game you lolhammered me; if ur town, stop and rethink.

[Katsuki]

I was town when I quickhammered you. Camn was the scum.

But you're still dodging my question. Luckily your reaction is enough of an answer.

[Katsuki]

Because Ircher is a super easy mislynch and I don't think he is legitimately scummy. His "return to RVS" was bizarre but I don't think it's from scum.
And the wagon got to L-1 way too easily.

That is a stupid argument. My games nominated for BEST TOWN PERFORMANCES have involved some of the quickest and easiest scum lynches ever on the history of this site (one mini concluded in 3hrs game time between D1 and D2, while the other ended in about 3-4 days RL time).

[SirCakez]

OK I'll concede that point
But I still think he's town

[Ircher]

Because Ircher is a super easy mislynch and I don't think he is legitimately scummy. His "return to RVS" was bizarre but I don't think it's from scum.
And the wagon got to L-1 way too easily.

That is a stupid argument. My games nominated for BEST TOWN PERFORMANCES have involved some of the quickest and easiest scum lynches ever on the history of this site (one mini concluded in 3hrs game time between D1 and D2, while the other ended in about 3-4 days RL time).

And that's why your stupid Qhammer in Mini 1777 cost town the game.

[Yume]

Because Ircher is a super easy mislynch and I don't think he is legitimately scummy. His "return to RVS" was bizarre but I don't think it's from scum.
And the wagon got to L-1 way too easily.

That is a stupid argument. My games nominated for BEST TOWN PERFORMANCES have involved some of the quickest and easiest scum lynches ever on the history of this site (one mini concluded in 3hrs game time between D1 and D2, while the other ended in about 3-4 days RL time).

Okay, enough snark. If you won't tell him, tell me why the hell did you vote me if you actually read the thread?

[Yume]

inb4 he says I am scum too :/