Newbie 1744 - Game Over

[Human Sequencer]

If tot is scum I don't believe he could work 2 more town lynches alone. I'm aiming for larger game unless he does something obv. scummy.

Could you clarify this?

[Toto]

Though, he could be avoiding easier targets to create potential associations. Know what I mean?

Please do explain.

[Huntress]

Vote Count 2.2

ChaosOmega (2) - Human Sequencer, SpyreX
Human Sequencer (1) - ChaosOmega

Not voting (4) - copper223, FrankJaeger, Toto, TownCop


With seven players alive, it takes four votes to lynch.

Deadline for Day Two is Sunday, 30th October 1pm GMT, (in (expired on 2016-10-30 13:00:00)).

[copper223]

@Frank
The 5 major wagons being Toto, TC, SB, Gideon and today Chaos, correct?

I never was on the Toto wagon.

I'm surprised you're not considering that given you continue to scum-read Toto and made wagon associations with Chaos.

@All
While I was checking ISO's I noticed TC only got votes from people I consider or know to be town
{Gideon, Toto, HS, Copper}, this especially stands out:

Vote Count 1.5

TownCop (4) - copper223, Toto, Human Sequencer, Gideon (L-1)

[TownCop]

@TC
Where does your town read of Spyre come from then?

My reasoning only indicated

possibility

of Spyre being scum, it is obvious that no matter what Spyre still gets

some

town cred for his lynch. Besides, Spyre's reasoning is in most cases easily followed and his posts seem genuine

[TownCop]

It's not L-1.

Basically read through game twice. Gotta get some sleep. These are initial questions and feelings. Cleaner thoughts later.

Scum Lottery Picks!

(CT,Chaos)
(CT,Spy)
(Chaos,Tot)
maybe even (CT,Tot)


I like Coppers and Humans content, but their votes bother me. I'm too tired check, but I think Copper put two players to L-1
Copper and Human have been on

all 5

major wagons.
Is it indicative of anything?
I don't see both of them being scum, but this stat is sending up a red flag.

Chaos has been on every wagon but CT's (and his own). Is this even more significant? I think it is. Him voting human is weird if he is scum.Though, he could be avoiding easier targets to create potential associations. Know what I mean?

Spy's D1 was... How would you describe it? Bland? Promises. Empty statements akin to "Do you notice what I notice", "Ill share later". I did see one decent follow up. Felt like he chimed in at the wrong times. IDK about spy. But
Next part is heavy. If both scums didn't vote alike, Spy is

100 percent

scum.
I don't like his tempo today. He hasn't directly done anything I can call scummy though.

If tot is scum I don't believe he could work 2 more town lynches alone. I'm aiming for larger game unless he does something obv. scummy.

I think we have a good chance of hitting scum with CT/Chaos today. I just feel a CT lynch is the better way to go.

Again, I'm tired and apologize if any numbers are wrong.

More later.

I find your reasoning strange. You've read nearly everyone as suspicious: Copper, HS, Me, Jasomega, Spyre, Toto, and if we include you, that's everyone. I still do like the fact that you've read everyone though; and that makes me think you're town.

Can you explain specifically what gives your read on me? You've provided the least reasoning (when compared to your other reads) about this yet you're so convinced that I'm scum.

[TownCop]

@Frank
The 5 major wagons being Toto, TC, SB, Gideon and today Chaos, correct?

I never was on the Toto wagon.

I'm surprised you're not considering that given you continue to scum-read Toto and made wagon associations with Chaos.

@All
While I was checking ISO's I noticed TC only got votes from people I consider or know to be town
{Gideon, Toto, HS, Copper}, this especially stands out:

Vote Count 1.5

TownCop (4) - copper223, Toto, Human Sequencer, Gideon (L-1)

Can we not make the same analogy to other wagons? Take Toto for instance. Voted by Me, FrankJaeger, Gideon and HS
Toto only got votes from people who I know or have read as likely to be town. Yet, I still read Toto as town and clearly you do as well

[TownCop]

What I find particularly scummy about JasoMega is how his only posts before his interactions with HS were posts justifying his sudden jumps onto Gideon and SB's bw. No analysis, no other reads, just justification, and that smells fishy. Also, JasoMega selectively ignored HS's argument about the BW and lurking, which seems like it's because he doesn't have a good reason.

HS I still read town with posts such as 531 and 534. The interaction with Chaos gives me this impression, although there is a small chance it could be bussing, but that's pretty much existent with most arguments.

Copper has actively scum hunted and subsequently helped town, and thus I am reasonably confident of my town read on him also.

[Toto]

For more completeness. Here are all the wagons in D1, plus some thoughts (from my point of view). Mostly things I found odd and suspicious.

Toto <- Frank, Gideon, TC, HS. This was the first wagon and I intended it to be bait. Not sure if it worked. Frank+HS could be OMGUS votes given what I was saying. We know Gideon is town now. Most suspicious is still TC.

TC <- Copper (RVS), Toto, HS, Gideon. Copper did say he considered TC scum but both him and HS and to some extent TC redirected the attack to SB.
Of people in this wagon HS is probably is the one with the weakest arguments. And to some extent Copper who was already in it via RVS. Gideon was also suspicious but now we know he was town.

SB <- HS, Jason/Chaos, Gideon, Copper, (Toto, intent to hammer, gives some time to prove innocence before claim)
Spy, apparently also intent to hammer, HS calls it implied intent to hammer, HS pushy to get claim. <-- I wanted to ask about this but forgot.
TownCop was reading SB as 'slight scum', but not on the wagon, was on Gideon.
Copper jumped to Gideon, but then decided to jump back on SB. <-- this also looks slightly suspicious, specially after we all ended up on Gideon.
Jason/Chaos just jumped in this wagon without much justification.

Gideon <- TC, HS, Chaos/Jason, Copper, Toto (lynch), Spy (intent to hammer, but reading as town)
This wagon is easy to mislynch and most likely to contain Scum. Unfortunately it has all of us except for frank who was dealing with the storm.
TC: Pushy
HS: Spearhead with some wrong accusations
Chaos: Joined and came swinging at Gideon straight away.
Copper: Hops on agreeing with Chaos easily (why do you agree with Chaos so easily if you were suspicious of his slot?)


Incidentally, Copper didn't 'join' the TC wagon. He was in it already from RVS. It seems odd he doesn't mention it in 553

[Human Sequencer]

Copper displayed intent to vote SmoothBlue earlier.

I was never really on TownCop's wagon. I voted him to prod him into contributing more, and as soon as he got to L-1, I unvoted him because I didn't want to lynch him and didn't believe he needed that much pressure.

[Human Sequencer]

Edit by repost for clarity:

TC <- Copper (RVS), Toto, HS, Gideon. Copper did say he considered TC scum but both him and HS and to some extent TC redirected the attack to SB.
Of people in this wagon HS is probably is the one with the weakest arguments. And to some extent Copper who was already in it via RVS. Gideon was also suspicious but now we know he was town. 553

I was never really on TownCop's wagon. I voted him to prod him into contributing more, and as soon as he got to L-1, I unvoted him because I didn't want to lynch him and didn't believe he needed that much pressure.

Copper: Hops on agreeing with Chaos easily (why do you agree with Chaos so easily if you were suspicious of his slot?)

Copper displayed intent to vote SmoothBlue earlier.

[Toto]

Copper displayed intent to vote SmoothBlue earlier.

I think you meant Gideon instead of SB, and still, why doesn't Jason/Chaos gives him pause?

The question was supposed to be for Copper and would like to hear from him.

[Human Sequencer]

You're right, I did mean Gideon.

[Toto]

Are you sure? You seem to have a problem with names. I hate wifom.

[Human Sequencer]

Considering the quote actually involves you talking about Gideon, yeah I'm pretty sure.
I hate wifom too. Why does it apply here?

[Toto]

Considering the quote actually involves you talking about Gideon, yeah I'm pretty sure.
I hate wifom too. Why does it apply here?

Wifom was mostly a joke. Are you pretending to mix up the names so we stop giving you shit about Frank?

[copper223]

@Toto
Chaos becomes a lot more suspicious once Gideon flips and when I saw the quick unvote from Jason (and then from you) on SB I pegged one of you down as the actual doctor, so I was even more hesitant to push there.

[copper223]

more correct is to say the other PR.

[copper223]

Jason's main scumread progression went from Copper is scum, to Copper's strongest scumread is scum, to immediately unvoting said scumread.

At the time I thought that quick unvote would have made sense if he had extra-information confirming what SB had said, now that I know that's not the case I find it pretty scummy.

It's weird to mentally go from: Copper your town-read on SB is BS, to oh shit we are lynching a PR let me unvote quickly, it shows 0 conviction in your read.

That said the actual doc didn't even bother to acknowledge him (probably scared of giving something away and just making it look a thousand times worse) so idk.

[Toto]

@Toto
Chaos becomes a lot more suspicious once Gideon flips and when I saw the quick unvote from Jason (and then from you) on SB I pegged one of you down as the actual doctor, so I was even more hesitant to push there.

I see. I did not see this as probable doctor at the time. I was just following the pattern as I thought that was the protocol.

[copper223]

@TC
I can't draw the same parallels to the Toto wagon, but if it's true that both you and Frank are town then Toto might deserve some more scrutiny. It depends on how strong the town-read you have on him is and where it comes from if it's legit.

You spent your time telling me why a town-read on someone you think is town may not be applicable 100% of the time wrt. to Spyre, I don't see why a townie would do that, you didn't even use the fact you don't consider it a good read to make a case on me.

[Human Sequencer]

Considering the quote actually involves you talking about Gideon, yeah I'm pretty sure.
I hate wifom too. Why does it apply here?

Wifom was mostly a joke. Are you pretending to mix up the names so we stop giving you shit about Frank?

No, and it's pretty absurd that you think I am.

[Toto]

Jason's main scumread progression went from Copper is scum, to Copper's strongest scumread is scum, to immediately unvoting said scumread.

For disclosure I still find Jason's behavior suspicious. But this is not exactly what happened. Gideon was your top scum read at the time he voted SB (before you did).

[Toto]

Considering the quote actually involves you talking about Gideon, yeah I'm pretty sure.
I hate wifom too. Why does it apply here?

Wifom was mostly a joke. Are you pretending to mix up the names so we stop giving you shit about Frank?

No, and it's pretty absurd that you think I am.

Yeah, I which is why I hate wifom. (I know this is not exactly wifom).

[Human Sequencer]

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