Newbie 1744 - Game Over

[copper223]

Nope, let's not discredit.

Copper made a post game comment addressing how well Spyre played this game.

My case on you is that your read progression is wack, your reads are far too sticky, you stayed on Toto all day D1 and on TC all day D2 (and this was your plan today as well I guess, him being the most likely alternative to your lynch), being over-cautious with who you vote and how often you change is often scum indicative.

But more importantly you're the only one that actively tried to deviate from a Chaos lynch yesterday and for that alone you're a compromised slot that needs to go.

Finally your reaction to Chaos's hammer after you gave him 12hrs to post kinda gives it away, don't you think.

[FrankJaeger]

On paper copper looks terrible, but hes been invovled when scum didnt have to be.

Toto still "newb" so meh gg if its you kinda cheezy tactic.

Human Idk another gg if scum. Good job staying out of towns way but I think youre town.

TC sticking here.

Remaining scum is prob TC maybe Copper.

[FrankJaeger]

Nope, let's not discredit.

There was nothing to discredit. But now that you admit your reasoning, here we go.

Copper made a post game comment addressing how well Spyre played this game.

My case on you is that your read progression is wack, your reads are far too sticky, you stayed on Toto all day D1 and on TC all day D2 (and this was your plan today as well I guess, him being the most likely alternative to your lynch), being over-cautious with who you vote and how often you change is often scum indicative.

So when Spy tunnels to a greater extent, its sick. Ive been over cautious? How? And please explain the scum motivation.

But more importantly you're the only one that actively tried to deviate from a Chaos lynch yesterday and for that alone you're a compromised slot that needs to go.

So because I wasnt cock sure on my second scum read I need to go? How towny of you copper

Finally your reaction to Chaos's hammer after you gave him 12hrs to post kinda gives it away, don't you think.

lol no, but i do think thats WIFOM as fuck, and a pretty weak arguement I am scum

[copper223]

The scum motivation is that the more you switch the more you may be questioned about it so you try not to unless you have to, limiting the amount of times you have to lie about something is a standard tactic to try and seem truthful when you are forced to lie.

Because there is an obvious scum motive for trying to deviate from Chaos, you doing so makes you the most likely scum candidate, and yeah that's very townie of me, I know.

I'm happy you seemed to be prepared for this one so at least you noticed your own slip, what happened is you prodded Chaos hoping he would respond by announcing the buss and when he hammered himself, instead of towning it up like you wanted him to and that's why you gave him that chance, you let that Jeez slip .

[Human Sequencer]

How many lynches do we have left?

[Human Sequencer]

It's three, right?

[copper223]

We have 2 lynches left.

There are 5 of us now, if we mislynch we will be 4 going into the night.

Scum is going to kill one of us leaving 3 players and a Lylo situation.

[Human Sequencer]

Reading over Frank and Jasomega in isolation together, Jason does seem like an alright lynch. There's a few things that give me pause, that I'll go over later. But they're very important lynches at this point.

If Toto is scum, he's slipped under the radar the whole game by virtue of being a fool.
If Copper is scum, gg. I fear for us and I still believe he needs to be looked at to some degree. What copper is saying very recently gets on my nerves. Especially post 750 where it seems like he's out for blood searching for lynches. 'Compromised slot that has to go'. Egh.
TC is a neutral slot for me still. I combed over his whole iso w/ Jasomega, and they barely interact at all until very later, where they start interacting a whole bunch.


Spyrex is confirmed town and his reads are legitimate. The only things that scare me about a Frank lynch are as follows:

Can 2 IC's or and IC and SE both be scum, while every newbie is townie?

While possible it's fairly unlikely

This seems very genuine to me on both sides.

Also, if anybody could teach me multiquoting, quoting across pages, and multiquoting across pages, I would be forever grateful.

Ive been using the little "Q+" link for every post i want to quote at that time (you have to do it in the order you want the quotes to appear). On your last quote, just hit the icon to the left of the Q+. Also, hitting the ISO link on a post takes you to a page displaying every post for that player in the current thread.

This is a mechanic that's only helpful for town, and I don't believe he'd be so willing to teach me about it

if he wasn't so comfortable and confident using it himself.

Plus, it still reads genuine to me.


It's a coinflip between TC and Frank at this point. If Frank flips green it makes Copper look more suspicious, though. I'm not sure if it's suspicious enough to make me consider lynching him over TC tomorrow. But I don't want to forget about it. I've been worried about letting Copper and Spy fly under the radar all game.

It's hard to consider. Regardless, you'll have me on the Frank wagon today. I just want to hear what the others think about those two things above.

[copper223]

@HS
This is the difference between me reading players and me wanting to lynch a player because I think he is scum, so it's true I am out for blood.

I think it's import for newer players to realize that once you're set on someone being scum you have to commit to your read and get them lynched, it's a valuable skill to learn.

Explaining mechanics (answering your Q+ and debating the general case of a 2 man IC/SE team) is a way to post and interact without giving anything away.

If the IC or one of the SE's doing it in a newbie you have to give them the benefit of the doubt that they are just explaining as they should (provided that's not ALL they do), but in a general game it's often a scumtell (it's called IIoA on the wiki, information instead of analysis).

Frank's reads by the way also look like him trying to buy off his lynch by town-reading those that haven't yet decided to hang him, in particular his Toto read evolution makes no sense (hint: because it's not a real read).

[Toto]

This is a mechanic that's only helpful for town, and I don't believe he'd be so willing to teach me about it if he wasn't so comfortable and confident using it himself. Plus, it still reads genuine to me.

I don't see how this is AI. What's with the highlighted part though?

[Toto]

I'm still want to hear what towncop has to say about his upcoming lynch tomorrow, after we lynch Frank today.

[Toto]

Finally your reaction to Chaos's hammer after you gave him 12hrs to post kinda gives it away, don't you think.

Can you explain this?

[Toto]

What's with the highlighted part though?

Nevermind, I think I get this now.

[FrankJaeger]

The scum motivation is that the more you switch the more you may be questioned about it so you try not to unless you have to

, limiting the amount of times you have to lie about something is a standard tactic to try and seem truthful when you are forced to lie.

Because there is an obvious scum motive for trying to deviate from Chaos, you doing so makes you the most likely scum candidate, and yeah that's very townie of me, I know.

I'm happy you seemed to be prepared for this one so at least you noticed your own slip, what happened is you prodded Chaos hoping he would respond by announcing the buss and when he hammered himself, instead of towning it up like you wanted him to and that's why you gave him that chance, you let that Jeez slip .

Yay, Ive got my PC back! Now I can try to not type like an idiot.

Look Copper. Your case against me is backwards. You're going in with the basis that I'm already scum. You authored my biography and called everything in it scummy. Cheap stuff.

I made my reads clear why frame them this way?

And you think me typing the words "Oh Jeez" and then hitting submit was an accident? I slipped and fell and it just happened?

Lol WTF?

@HS
This is the difference between me reading players and me wanting to lynch a player because I think he is scum, so it's true I am out for blood.

I think it's import for newer players to realize that once you're set on someone being scum you have to commit to your read and get them lynched, it's a valuable skill to learn.

Explaining mechanics (answering your Q+ and debating the general case of a 2 man IC/SE team) is a way to post and interact without giving anything away.

If the IC or one of the SE's doing it in a newbie you have to give them the benefit of the doubt that they are just explaining as they should (provided that's not ALL they do), but in a general game it's often a scumtell (it's called IIoA on the wiki, information instead of analysis).

Frank's reads by the way also look like him trying to buy off his lynch by town-reading those that haven't yet decided to hang him, in particular his Toto read evolution makes no sense (hint: because it's not a real read).

This. This. This. 1000 times. This proves my above point. Copper isn't scum hunting anymore. Just using WIFOM with

every

thing Ive done.
And about toto. Ive had the same toto read since I caught up on D2, can you prove different? Nah you cant.
Just shout "SCUM" as answer.
You aren't trying to figure out the game, you just want Frank lynched.


Look at the sentences I've bolded. Perfect example of what Copper is doing right now. He does a complete 180 when talking about himself, to human.
But I'm sure copper has a reply with "what I really meant" coming.

I still think TC is best lynch. Coppers play style has had an abrupt change, and it scares me. But Im still thinking the scum is 1-1 Exp/noob players.

[FrankJaeger]

I'm still want to hear what towncop has to say about his upcoming lynch tomorrow, after we lynch Frank today.

Hey. What happened to your questions?

Why just jump on my wagon like this now?

Apparently you didn't care for my answers in the first place.

Human says hes on the wagon too. Fuck. That's 3. I also have a hunch TC wants me lynched too.

Welp town, my reads are there. Not sure how accurate they are. If I get lynched, please no one vote on D4 until you are SURE of it. I still want to win this game, even if I'm dead.

[FrankJaeger]

Also 760 from toto is just terrible. scum or town

[Human Sequencer]

That's a pretty pitiful defense.

VOTE: FrankJaeger

I'm ready for a lynch.

[FrankJaeger]

That's a pretty pitiful defense.

VOTE: FrankJaeger

I'm ready for a lynch.

Defense from what?

[copper223]

@Frank
Not admitting there is a case on you will not make the actual case go away.

[copper223]

I'm still want to hear what towncop has to say about his upcoming lynch tomorrow, after we lynch Frank today.

Holy shit this is terrible though.

UNVOTE:

[copper223]

Let's her what TC has to say, I still don't see Toto killing Spyre in most cases, whereas Frank has to, but why the fuck do you assume there is going to be a tomorrow when you're about to vote the guy?

[Human Sequencer]

I was about to type out something almost identical to be honest, before I realized it was useless to town.
Sounds to me like Toto is just trying to chime in on what Spyrex said.

If it was coming from anybody else who actually puts his thoughts into the game, I'd be with you. But it reads to me just like he didn't put much thought into it.

Definitely fine to hear what TC says though.

[copper223]

And about toto. Ive had the same toto read since I caught up on D2, can you prove different? Nah you cant.

[copper223]

Toto could be scum. I dont think he can win the game alone so I am fine with going after bigger p.o.i

[copper223]

First you vote park him D1, then you place him on the "I want to lynch his buddy first" list, then you apparently decide you have to trust him just being a newbie (I assume you imply town newbie) for the rest of the game.

Why does this make sense?