Really nowIs there any reason for me to want you and DH dead, and shannon/aero alive?
In post 243, Wyvernite wrote:allright so I had to stay late at work so I apologize for not getting to analyze as much of the thread today as I wanted to, but I'll throw in a really quick and dirty rundown of reads thus far
I'll start with my town of
AERO - The amount of detail that he's gone into all of his posts seems very indicative of town, and I don't see him being mafia at all, especially with the posts he constantly references to support his reads/questions
Shannon - I currently believe that Shannon and I's thought processes are very similar, and being able to step into her shoes and see the game through her eyes makes me very happy in my read with her currently.
Null - Algebra/TB - I feel like these two will be key to winning, but with the amount of single\double lined posts that are only to be found here and there I can't confidently read them.
Scum
Postie - The amount of questions that are asked here, seem to be keeping everyone busy, and when prompted about her own reads we get that: it'll either "come later" 205, "it feels/sounds towny/genuine" 194 197 198 in these posts there is also the notion that aggressive = good which I don't find to be true at all. There are also really no thoughts of her own regarding her own reads. All of the pressure I see on aero, he responds well to imo, and gives no real substance back. Everyone seems to be townreading her for asking questions and sorting aero, but I honestly don't see it.
Dark Horse - I like a lot of points that aero brings up here (see: 200 211) Which I haven't liked any of his defense of. I think Postie's townreads are just an attempt to relieve pressure from her partner, which makes them both look worse in my eyes. I also believe that postie seems to be chainsawing for dark in response to aero's pressure
Grrr I tried to post like three times earlier today, and kept getting the 'page cannot be found' thing which made me think that the server had gone down again. Now I can't remember what I was going to say. NVM.In post 246, Dark Horse wrote:Scumreading the two people who call you out? Boooooo
Since you said it was a quick lowdown, I won't grill you on your lack of detail until you make a post that actually explains stuff like why Aeronaut's detail stands out, and why you don't like my defense at all.
There's several other wack parts about your posts, though.
If you and shannon have similar thought processes, why are your reads so different? Both of your scumreads are people that shannon thinks are town.
Postie's defense on me is far more then "it seems town." She's been cery clear with how she thinks I've been showing a logical thought process, which your strong townread Aero has said is very town indicative.
I hate the fact that you say you "pretty much agree" with what aero's saying about me. You sound like scum trying to piggy back off of a townie's read.
You better have some good content when you have time to provide more, because postwise you're 0/2
Algebra could you please expand on these thoughts? Do you have any other scum/town reads, and what are your reasons for the reads you've just given?In post 237, algebra wrote:I'm liking the spurt of activity
My top town read is dark horse
Top scum is thinkbig
Yeah, it feels like wyvernite saw two groups of townies arguing with each other, and is trying to align himself with the townies that haven't criticized him yetIn post 252, shannon wrote: I feel like there's scum trying to create artificial factions between me/aero and DH/Postie. It's not an either/or situation, folks.
So I read this and this is the first time you've made much sense to me this game, Postie.In post 226, Postie wrote:Aero, it's completely natural for a towny to be suspicious of someone's motives for making a push on them. You know you're town, and especially when you're new you tend to be arrogant and assume everyone else should know it too, so you end up being intensely suspicious of anyone who questions that fact becausewhy are they trying to lynch a towny dammit. This is what I'm seeing with DH, and the way he's going about it feels incredibly genuine because of the fact I can see several layers of thought and paranoia; I don't see why it matters if that's within a short span of time or not. I don't see him being able to fake this whole thing as scum.
I'll respond to the rest of this stuff in the morning.
Besides the questions at the bottom, this opening post is a whole lot of nothing.In post 206, Wyvernite wrote:okay so wow reading all of this is painful, everything is just one or two lines. I really don't like that 90% of dissucssion between pages 6-9 are just postie/aero talking back and forth. I'm not entirely sure what to think about this interaction though. There's been quite a dominant force of aero/postie deciding where the game goes and I don't really like that at all. I haven't really seen any posts silencing anyone though, so I guess that's more on everyone else not posting.
I would like to hear more from algebra, as I feel his alignment will come rather naturally to everyone if he just posts more content. I'll do a read over again tomorrow when I get the chance, it's hard to process everything when it's as quick as lackluster as I feel it currently is. I'd like to see more content from EVERYONE, no one is really explaining reads to the full effect that I'd like. Or really sharing hard reads at all. I get that it's early into the game, but you have to start somewhere.
@postie With all the attention you've been giving to aero, do you still find TB to be your topscum?
@TB and algebra I'd really like to see both of your top town/scum reads in the game currently.
So, you have many town reads. Do you think anyone is scum?In post 228, shannon wrote:I will go further and say that not only does it seem genuine on DH's part, it'd be bad strategy if he's scum.In post 226, Postie wrote:Aero, it's completely natural for a towny to be suspicious of someone's motives for making a push on them. You know you're town, and especially when you're new you tend to be arrogant and assume everyone else should know it too, so you end up being intensely suspicious of anyone who questions that fact becausewhy are they trying to lynch a towny dammit. This is what I'm seeing with DH, and the way he's going about it feels incredibly genuine because of the fact I can see several layers of thought and paranoia; I don't see why it matters if that's within a short span of time or not. I don't see him being able to fake this whole thing as scum.
I'll respond to the rest of this stuff in the morning.
A cursory glance of my first five or ten posts in any game will show exactly the same behaviour he thinks he picked up here, i.e. I'm a bit weird and I don't know how to person in mafia yet. (Probably posts like this are not personing but let's just go with it). Not to mention, a quick look at my wiki would show that I've never been lynched. Unless the scum team are silly, or not doing any research, they'd have to know that I'm not a good target for a D1 quick wagon.
So - I think DH is town, and he is/was genuine in his assessment of me. The worrying thing to me was always that he is appearing to line up lynches based on my flip, and I'm a tad worried that he seems to be following the wagons. But! And this is the thing for me, if he is super new then he might not know that's a bad thing to do. I have certainly played town games where I have tried to look townier by following the leader, only to be scum read for perceived lack of reasoning behind my moves.
I'm pretty happy at this point with town reads on DH, Postie, and Aero, who I think is genuine in his town read on me. There'd be nothing to stop him backing off or just 'null' reading me, so the fact that he's even bothered to argue for me says 'town' at this point.
That's fair.So you do not have a case. You understand that you're not helping anybody to understand why we should vote with you if you're not going to provide reasoning, right?
Right now trying to convince people that shannon's scum is not a priority for me
I meant beforehand. Like when Shannon was making her posts, do you see anything that was any better?Thinkbig's questions, Algebra's reads, this whole argument we're having. All of these do significantly more to progress the day than just complaining about inactivity.Please show me some posts by Flames, Thinkbig, Algebra, you, or myself that are less lazy/genuine, because I don't see any.
Yeah. That's how I felt about it, too.She's been less scummy. I feel like a noobscum could have easily followed you in accusing me. The fact that she's willing to look at it from her own angle is very town.What would you say Shannon's alignment is now?
Ok, now imagine the way you feel about me allegedly discrediting you, and reverse the situation. That's how I feel about that early posting.Postie has made much more of an effort to get her hands dirty than you had. She has also explained why she thinks I'm town, which is something you hadn't done. Do know how wack it is to see someone try to discredit approach without giving any in depth reasons for why he thinks my scumread's town?In post 219, Aeronaut wrote: Postie just did a similar thing for about two pages on me, but I don't see you calling her out for it?
I don't recall saying them in a row. You just got angry when I pushed you, which generally is a scum tell so early on.You're acting like I made those four posts in a row. They were all based on different lackluster responses that you had made over time. The 20 minutes remark is completely false. Anyone who has looked at that part of the thread knows this. Why are you making stuff up?In post 223, Aeronaut wrote: What? In the span of four posts he discredits me, calls me scum, and basically says I'm shit player. You just described to me exactly my own reasoning for why he's scum. It's not a "gradient" if it's in the span of like 20 minutes
Wow gr8In post 234, ThinkBig wrote:V/LA UNTIL MONDAY AROUND 3:30 PM EST
I will still be reading and will try to post during this time, but I will have limited access until then.
Postie seems very sure that Algebra is town and I want to hear that reasoning first.What game are you referring to?In post 236, Postie wrote:For the record, I think Wyvernite's entrance sounded forced as hell too, but I find that a lot of newbies have a tendency to sound a bit forced so I'm hesitant to call him scum for it. I'm scumreading the slot by PoE though.
@shannon- Why are you townreading Aero?
Idk. My gut says Aero's town but the last time I gut townread Aero he was scum so... someone help.
Wyr's post to me reads as adding a bunch of non-AI stuff into a catchup (such as "silencing") to try to look like he's analyzing more than he is. I haven't read the rest of his posts yet, though
I would love to see this.I'll get round to doing a case for town!algebra and responding to other stuff once my headache has died down a bit.
In post 240, Dark Horse wrote:Aeronaut what ever happened to your algebra push?
There were people like thinkbig asking questions, but w/e.I meant beforehand. Like when Shannon was making her posts, do you see anything that was any better?
Yeah I guess I can see where that confusion came fromOk, now imagine the way you feel about me allegedly discrediting you, and reverse the situation. That's how I feel about that early posting.
I interpreted your post as thinking that my thought process change was very quick, when in reality it wasn'tI don't recall saying them in a row. You just got angry when I pushed you, which generally is a scum tell so early on.
Fair enoughPostie seems very sure that Algebra is town and I want to hear that reasoning first.
So... I'm town because I go into detail? I didn't realize all scum had a post restriction in which they had to be as vague as possible.In post 243, Wyvernite wrote:allright so I had to stay late at work so I apologize for not getting to analyze as much of the thread today as I wanted to, but I'll throw in a really quick and dirty rundown of reads thus far
I'll start with my town of
AERO - The amount of detail that he's gone into all of his posts seems very indicative of town, and I don't see him being mafia at all, especially with the posts he constantly references to support his reads/questions
I feel like you're literally taking the bare minimum of my original points to Postie and repeating them + focusing on Postie/Me/DH when none of those are really viable lynches right now.In post 247, Wyvernite wrote:You haven't called me out at all, you've asked questions, there's a very large difference between the two, same goes for postie, I see scum I call them as such, there's no OMGUS here. I said that I found it easy to step into her shoes, not that I agreed with her reads. I see how she came to them though; don't go putting words in my mouth tyvm. Postie's defense on you boils down to "it feels town" or "it was ballsy, brazen, and aggressive" because that's the only way she can explain how you've been playing this game, and it shows. I'll provide my own reasons why you're a scummy scum scum in my next few posts, but again as I said I didn't have time to do full reads on everyone, I'm going to showcase aero's accusations which I believe to be a solid basis on why you're scum. so take your bs 0/2 post crap out of here.
I suppose that's fair; I just thought it would confuse things further to discuss it before we managed to get somewhere with everything else.In post 222, Aeronaut wrote:It's four in the morning and I need to act in two shows tomorrow so I need to pick this up in the morning; Postie, the reason I'm asking you about your algebra reads in certain places is because I'm trying to show you that you're applying a double standard. You can't be asking me about every single thing I've said about Shannon and Dark Horse when you've got so much unexplained stuff on your own. I want to know why you think algebra is town, really. You had said before I think that Algebra reads to you as genuine. I feel like if you're going to ask me how I think Shannon feels genuine, you should have to answer that same thing about your read, especially since I'm scum reading that player and would like to hear why exactly you oppose that lynch
In post 224, Aeronaut wrote:I think a big reason we have such opposite reads is because I guess we see things as differently indicative. I don't remember if you're originally from offsite or maybe just have different experiences and play differently, but usually abandoning reads to jump onto a popular wagon is seen as scummy almost all of the time.
I disagree strongly here. It's not hard to fake reasons for your reads or pushes; what's hard to fake is several layers of thoughts, and thoughts that aren't superficial. I don't care how clear or logical someone's thoughts are, I care about how much it looks like they're genuinely scumhunting rather than just pretending to.In post 224, Aeronaut wrote:"logical progression" or a clear thought process and actions is something that's almost always seen as very town-oriented; scum have a lot harder time explaining their reasoning for doing things or sometimes there's not a clear motivation or thought process involved because they're making up justifications as they go along.
In post 137, ThinkBig wrote:Care to elaborate?In post 136, algebra wrote:Thinkbig is a scum trying to get by with surface level thinking
This exchange is what cements my townread.In post 138, algebra wrote:No
Yeah i'm sorry that this group has decided to put the 3 people with the least amount of posts on full fuckin blast. I have no reads on TB/Algebra, there's nothing there, not that I can read atleast. I see that you guys are putting up all sorts of reasons why one is town/mafia, I simply have yet to see enough amount of info from either to have reads that mean anything, I can arbitrarily throw scum/town around like everyone else here seems to be doing, but you won't catch me doing it.In post 263, Aeronaut wrote:Also the fact that Wyv is literally giving an opinion on every other player that's not the two viable lynches
This is good
VOTE: Wyvernite
I didn't know that people had to be lynch targets for me to ask questions and be inquisitive about it? When I was talking about people "silencing" this is exactly what I was talking about, and it coming from one of my top towns is very unsettling to say the least.In post 262, Aeronaut wrote:So... I'm town because I go into detail? I didn't realize all scum had a post restriction in which they had to be as vague as possible.In post 243, Wyvernite wrote:allright so I had to stay late at work so I apologize for not getting to analyze as much of the thread today as I wanted to, but I'll throw in a really quick and dirty rundown of reads thus far
I'll start with my town of
AERO - The amount of detail that he's gone into all of his posts seems very indicative of town, and I don't see him being mafia at all, especially with the posts he constantly references to support his reads/questions
And Postie has been here going into what I can only describe as an absurd amount of detail. Why are you town reading me for that but scum reading her for it? I mean, you're town reading me for the wrong reasons here, and it's gross.
I feel like you're literally taking the bare minimum of my original points to Postie and repeating them + focusing on Postie/Me/DH when none of those are really viable lynches right now.In post 247, Wyvernite wrote:You haven't called me out at all, you've asked questions, there's a very large difference between the two, same goes for postie, I see scum I call them as such, there's no OMGUS here. I said that I found it easy to step into her shoes, not that I agreed with her reads. I see how she came to them though; don't go putting words in my mouth tyvm. Postie's defense on you boils down to "it feels town" or "it was ballsy, brazen, and aggressive" because that's the only way she can explain how you've been playing this game, and it shows. I'll provide my own reasons why you're a scummy scum scum in my next few posts, but again as I said I didn't have time to do full reads on everyone, I'm going to showcase aero's accusations which I believe to be a solid basis on why you're scum. so take your bs 0/2 post crap out of here.
I would agree with shannon here, as I think pretty much everyone does. DH I can definitely see where you're coming from, and I can't really give you any reasons, as I don't have a post history to back myself up with, but it's happenstance that I find you/postie scum, and you pressuring me. I'm not OMGUSing you, and even if I were, its not a scum read, as postie used in your defense. (note the fact that I'm always talking about postie's defense of you, and never your own bothers me quite a bit, and is a major contributor in why I scumread both of you.)In post 255, Dark Horse wrote:Yeah, it feels like wyvernite saw two groups of townies arguing with each other, and is trying to align himself with the townies that haven't criticized him yetIn [url=http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph%20bp?p=8507398#p8507398]post 252[/url], shannon wrote: I feel like there's scum trying to create artificial factions between me/aero and DH/Postie. It's not an either/or situation, folks.
While I agree that the shannon/aero and DH/postie factions definitely seems to be a thing, I think the fact that you brought it up here will definitely put an end to that.In post 252, shannon wrote: I feel like there's scum trying to create artificial factions between me/aero and DH/Postie. It's not an either/or situation, folks.
Really.In [url=http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8507308#p8507308]post 250[/url], Dark Horse wrote:I said that your 206 was bad while pointing out its flaws, and postie agreed with me that it felt very forced. That's calling you out.
You said your though process was very similiar. That's very different compared to "I can clearly understand what her though process is"
Postie explicitly mentioned posts where she explained how my thought process is town, so saying there aren't any is willful ignorance
Really nowIs there any reason for me to want you and DH dead, and shannon/aero alive?
I mean as you stated earlier, a scumread, or tunneling is not indicative of alignment.In post 266, Postie wrote:I wouldn't hate a Wyv lynch, but I think my preference is still for a ThinkBig lynch right now, just because algebra has been latched onto ThinkBig all game so a scumflip there basically clears him.
???In post 270, Wyvernite wrote:I mean as you stated earlier, a scumread, or tunneling is not indicative of alignment.