Open 669 - Nightless Vengeful Mayhem [Game Over]

[Superhans]

Super answer my question.

Well I have absolutely no idea where you're getting 'Lucca is a nice fellow' from, so I thought perhaps you could actually explain what you mean.

[Revan]

And the other question?

[Superhans]

W A S T E M A N

I ask you two questions to understand where the fuck your reads from Lucca come from. You don't bother actually answering them, instead you grill me for asking them.. what?

You say that Lucca's reads are genuine, so I pick two other players whose reads are relatively genuine, and see how you value Lucca's reads relative to theirs.

[Revan]

How would your game solving benefit from knowing how I judge people's reads?

[Ultimate Despair]

wguerts post 39 is town. thinking about the game,wanting to discuss the game, actively engaged. All the things scum tend to avoid.

I'd already given my reasons. In a way, does it matter? As scum, i would say he is town cos i know it, and as town I would say he looks town because HE LOOKS SO FUCKING TOWN. The main gist of his posting early on was that he was clearly trying to get the game moving. Scum dont try and do that. ANd he was handing out unprovoked,strong reads. That's the GIST of what he was doing.
And that's what I'm good at. Giving the over view, seeing the wood from the trees.
You are obviously a "details" man, getting to grips with the minutae. Cool. We have different personalities, different playstyles. Dont fall into the trap of thinking I play like you as town. You stick with the point by point stuff. I 'll keep giving out the big, general stuff.
Aaaaaaaaaaaand the caffeine's still going lol

Your attempt to skirt the issue has been denied. I don't care how big picture you are being, my other head already showed you why the reasons you are using to read wgeurts as town are not real reasons. You keep asserting that it's "so fucking town" and "scum wouldn't do that" but scum do it all the time if they're even remotely competent.

And what concerns me is that you're not bothering to re-evaluate. A town member who's been told that their town read needs to be reevaluated will evaluate that townread because town members are afraid of derpclearing scum. The confidence in your post stems from certain knowledge about wgeurt's alignment.

- Junko

[Ultimate Despair]

Moving back to him as the whole “Sesq is defeated” posting she has been making timed with Friend Computer’s conspicuous absence paints a picture to me of a Scum Goon trying to take the bullet for the Scum Daykiller to make sure they don’t miss out on their second Daykill.

I think you have a good point here. I will bring this up in hydra chat and make sure we're on the same page.

- Junko

[Superhans]

How would your game solving benefit from knowing how I judge people's reads?

Answer my questions.

[Superhans]

@UD how are you reading Wguert?

I'm can see where Mix is coming from, Wguerts behaviour is try hard town.

[Superhans]

Moz not mix bloody autocorrect

[havingfitz]

Super answer my question.

Revan answer my question.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Sorry, I have a tight schedule...

Well the impeding rope is going to be tight for you also …

--

Ah sorry, I made a mistake and I take back calling what you said shoddy, I didn't read what you had written properly.

Please explain what your original reading of my post was.

--

Or maybe I just think Revan looks scummier? FC's wagon isn't that big and I was originally triying to redirect votes from my wagon to his. Don't really see this.

FC’s wagon has been established more or less all day and has always been bigger (or equivalent) to Revan’s (even when you have voted Revan and moved off FC).

Why, if FC is a scum read for you and you yourself say you were “trying to direct votes from your own wagon to FC’s”, did you suddenly stop?

And why not vote FC? There are multiple scum in the game. FC looks overwhelmingly more likely to be the Scum Daykiller than Revan based on game state. Yet you insist on trying to fuel a wagon on Revan.

And color me shocked that you (regardless of alignment) don’t see a theory as valid when said theory implicates you as scum … [/off sarcasm]

As for that early stuff, I've already explained it a million times. I'll answer when someone asks something new.

Just a reminder to everyone

– remember that said explanations haven’t held up to scrutiny and at last posting Sesq had retreated to “I was sure I did it for that reason despite nothing in thread indicating that as a possibility … sue me”.

Here's a game I was scum in.

Main thread: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=69351

Maifa thread: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=69349

Did I miss someone specifically asking your for this? If I didn’t what is the point of posting it? If I did please reference it.

--

seems to be some confusion over my votes.
its very clear - i ahve only voted Sesq this game.
Once before the DK, and once after.
So I dont know why people are confused, but there it is.
And for once i may actually have caught scum!

Who else is scum Moz? Your sole focus on Sesq isn’t helping me (and I suspect others) read you.

--

Your attempt to skirt the issue has been denied. I don't care how big picture you are being, my other head already showed you why the reasons you are using to read wgeurts as town are not real reasons. You keep asserting that it's "so fucking town" and "scum wouldn't do that" but scum do it all the time if they're even remotely competent.

And what concerns me is that you're not bothering to re-evaluate. A town member who's been told that their town read needs to be reevaluated will evaluate that townread because town members are afraid of derpclearing scum. The confidence in your post stems from certain knowledge about wgeurt's alignment.

- Junko

You saying “Please explain your Town read on wgeuts” and saying Moz’s reasoning is bad isn’t really very compelling Day 1 as a reason for him to totally re-assess.

Do you not Town read Wguets?

[Sesq]

As for that early stuff, I've already explained it a million times. I'll answer when someone asks something new.

Just a reminder to everyone

– remember that said explanations haven’t held up to scrutiny and at last posting Sesq had retreated to “I was sure I did it for that reason despite nothing in thread indicating that as a possibility … sue me”.

I know it's a shit excuse, you know a shit excuse, Old Man Jenkins knows it's a shit excuse. I just don't like repeating myself, it gets really annoying.

Here's a game I was scum in.

Main thread: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=69351

Maifa thread: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=69349

Did I miss someone specifically asking your for this? If I didn’t what is the point of posting it? If I did please reference

Wguerts asked for it before, and I complied, but I wanted to post it again as my play there is very, very different despite being scum.

[Sesq]

Or maybe I just think Revan looks scummier? FC's wagon isn't that big and I was originally triying to redirect votes from my wagon to his. Don't really see this.

FC’s wagon has been established more or less all day and has always been bigger (or equivalent) to Revan’s (even when you have voted Revan and moved off FC).

Why, if FC is a scum read for you and you yourself say you were “trying to direct votes from your own wagon to FC’s”, did you suddenly stop?

And why not vote FC? There are multiple scum in the game. FC looks overwhelmingly more likely to be the Scum Daykiller than Revan based on game state. Yet you insist on trying to fuel a wagon on Revan.

And color me shocked that you (regardless of alignment) don’t see a theory as valid when said theory implicates you as scum … [/off sarcasm]

Did you know that people can...

gasp

- change their minds?

I know. It shocked me too.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Did you know that people can... gasp- change their minds?

I know. It shocked me too.

What did you change your mind about? FC being scum? That doesn't add up considering you listed him as the other scum suspect with Revan in your last 'read list'.

Every post you make like this where you try to handwave away things as opposed to actually providing an answer brings me more confidence about you and FC as partners.

[Sesq]

Did you know that people can... gasp- change their minds?

I know. It shocked me too.

What did you change your mind about? FC being scum? That doesn't add up considering you listed him as the other scum suspect with Revan in your last 'read list'.

Every post you make like this where you try to handwave away things as opposed to actually providing an answer brings me more confidence about you and FC as partners.

No, about Revan being scummi

er

. I still think he's a scumread, but less so. I was voting and pushing him for a while, why is this partner theory a thing?

[doomfeathers]

I was completely and entirely aware it looked like terrible handwaving, but really what else am I going to do? I've already set myself up in a terrible position and it doesn't look like there's a way out other than by extreme chance. I'd vote myself to be honest.

Maybe if FC gets too much.

I am a new player, but I do not wish to hide behind that. Scum do have daychat in this game, so I don't think my kind of play would have went through with that, no?

What. On. Jupiter.

I see no explanation for this except Magna's theory, but I'm not sure why Sesq would say this so blatantly.

VOTE: Friend Computer

[MagnaofIllusion]

VOTE: Friend Computer

Thank you Doom.

That should put Friend Computer at 4 votes (Myself, Doom, Wguets and having. Two more needed to lynch.

@UD, Moz, Lucca

- Currently I don't think any of you are likely partners with my reads of FC / Sesq. If you have any questions about why FC is scum (and with a not-insignificant chance of being the Daykiller) please ask. Otherwise even if you are reading someone else as scum please consider moving your vote to FC and re-making your case for your primary read with FC's flip tomorrow.

[doomfeathers]

Scum reading me is fine, but to make ridiculous leaps in logic to

try and tie me with FC and Sesq

is really shoddy play.

Sacred bovines. Now that you point that out, that looks a lot like a scumslip to me, as if Superhans already knew who the scumteam were. At this point, I'm looking at Superhans for the day 3 lynch.

Magna, wgeurts, and anyone else, this looks like a scumslip to me. Does it to you?

[MagnaofIllusion]

Magna, wgeurts, and anyone else, this looks like a scumslip to me. Does it to you?

I think it is a possibility. If both Friend Computer and Sesq were to be lynched and flip scum I would be doing a strong review of the slot.

[Superhans]

After reflection of having read Superhans posts on this page and a quick re-ISO I'm moving him up to the second tier scum read I have (currently shared by Moz).

At first this page looks to be a good amount of content but at a deeper look there is little actual reads coming from his slot. The only thing close to an actual read is his sortaNullTown on Doomfeathers. Plenty of suggestions of scumminess (Revan for example) but no vote. Fence-sitting on both Friend and Sesq wagons. Looks to be similar play to my analysis of Revan's "FOS player, empty Mod Vote".

But there are some pretty strong relational Sesq ties there. If Superhans were scum and scum with Friend I'd expect he'd have jumped on the bus as he's very late to the pickup site. The way he is playing it he would get dinged pretty hard with a FC scum flip. Especially a Dayvig Friend flip. But he didn't do that. Instead he's leaving himself room to move there while fence-sitting on Sesq. And while doing that fence-sitting his narratives all tend to be "But Sesq could be Town who is ...."

VOTE: Sesq

I'm not Town reading FC but after seeing this and how Super is handling the game-state I'm happy to increase pressure on Sesq.

I'm already voting Regan...

Scum reading me is fine, but to make ridiculous leaps in logic to try and tie me with FC and Sesq is really shoddy play.

@Doom and Magna,
I misinterpretted what Magna had written, thought that he was accusing me of being scum with FC and Sesq for fence sitting on their wagons.

[doomfeathers]

Good point. It's not necessarily a scumslip. I still think it's suspicious, though. But let's lynch Sesq first, especially if Friend Computer flips scum.

[doomfeathers]

Actually, change that. Let's lynch Sesq next whether or not Friend flips scum. Sesq is scummier than Friend anyway.

[mozamis]

catching up

[Superhans]

Good point. It's not necessarily a scumslip. I still think it's suspicious, though. But let's lynch Sesq first, especially if Friend Computer flips scum.

if you plan to lynch sesq first, how will we know if fc is scum?
Out of FC and Sesq, I would want to lynch FC first, he is posting less, and his posts are kinda nonsense (e.g. voting mod etc). I like the train of thought in Sesq's posts and I think it would be hugely beneficial to keep her alive even if she is scum (if you get what i mean).

[Superhans]

Moz can you explain your read on Sesq
392
im not trying to throw shade or anything, just would like to hear a simplified case on Sesq.