Civilization Mafia [GAME OVER]

[Leonshade]

I've made my stance clear, but I'm not going to campaign for it.

Playing to not lose = stalling, defensive play, playing to avoid a loss.

Playing to win = pro-active, offensive play, playing to advance your win condition.

Scum can manipulate the game in all scenarios. Voting none will slightly hinder scum, but it also won't help town. Scum can strategize with five heads, but we can strategize with fifteen. Maximizing town information is good. Vote Sciences.

Where does the setup say five players? *squints eyes*

Anyway, I am in favor of sciences but it is a personal choice on my part. I like the study of votes and their placement. One player one vote simplifies the game for me.

~Titus

Vecna was the first one to bring up five players, why are you only focusing on me?

[The DEO]

I dont really see how any of those scenario's improve with sciences?

Let's say a Gunsmith pops in two ages. Let's say a player is known to be really good at Gunsmith . The doctor keeps that player alive.

The neighborizer can neighborize likely town VTs and discuss their abilities and plan out which one they go for on both days or hold until a later option comes up.

Stonehenge can park its flip on someone scummy, particularly if they say they want town power in the next age.

Now, did the setup confirm 5 scum and I missed it or did Leon slip or option 3?

~Titus

VOTE: Science

[Sondam]

@Titus I refuse to go another game coordinating night actions unnecessarily after The Thing Mafia. The Thing was different in that everyone's role was public knowledge so it made sense to coordinate night actions and even then, scum had a pretty easy time slipping through the cracks because of every night action being public.

What you're suggesting gives scum a roadmap as to how to proceed during the night JUST like it did in that game.

I still have PTSD
~Maria

[Vecna]

Lets just race to 11 on <none> so people can stop trying to make up excuses why we should pick a pro-scum option

Sometimes you just gotta protect em from themselves

[The DEO]

I missed that Leon. Vecna did say that first. So my question remains though but is Vecna slipping or something else?

[Lil Uzi Vert]

I full heartedly disagree. There's already awesome stuff now, and town can coordinate. There's two wonders I would want personally from this stage here. Who said wonders go up in value as time progresses?

For instance, sciences with the neighborizer can coordinate and form a masonry. Sciences with the Stonehenge can publicly cop who takes a scummy role if they die at night. The doctor can heal prime targets for good role acquisition. (If someone says, I am really good at X and wants it, the doctor can keep them alive).

It may not be traditional coordinating and leashing but it still is coordinating.

~Titus

All of them are awesome theory wise but have the potential to really swing the game into scums favor. There is only one Wonder this era that is guaranteed to help town and screw scum.

[Sondam]

I fully expect Gerry to want to take any wonder that has kill in the name....I may not stop him (B
Anyone who is voting art you're insane that's a pro scum choice and science is already explained on why it's trash now we gonna take 10 pages explaining this?
~Maria

[Spiffeh]

@mod If Arts is chosen, will a vote/lynch mechanic still be available during MYLO/LYLO?

Why does it seem like you're thinking so far ahead?

I'd like to know if picking Arts could fuck us over if scum end up getting like a double vote on a day with LYLO effect.

Like I said though, I don't think Nahdia would design a game where a decision this early would basically lose us the game in the end.

[Spiffeh]

I fully expect Gerry to want to take any wonder that has kill in the name....I may not stop him (B
Anyone who is voting art you're insane that's a pro scum choice and science is already explained on why it's trash now we gonna take 10 pages explaining this?
~Maria

What do you think of Titus' case for Sciences?

[Vecna]

I missed that Leon. Vecna did say that first. So my question remains though but is Vecna slipping or something else?

Just assuming the most likely option

[Sondam]

I fully expect Gerry to want to take any wonder that has kill in the name....I may not stop him (B
Anyone who is voting art you're insane that's a pro scum choice and science is already explained on why it's trash now we gonna take 10 pages explaining this?
~Maria

What do you think of Titus' case for Sciences?

Lol you call it a case that's cute It's still bad. Why give scum any options at all when we can give them none.
~Maria

[Spiffeh]

The fact that Titus is not acknowledging the concerns for Sciences that a few of us have raised and keeps harping on "but we could do this with these roles!!!" is concerning.

[Vecna]

I fully expect Gerry to want to take any wonder that has kill in the name....I may not stop him (B
Anyone who is voting art you're insane that's a pro scum choice and science is already explained on why it's trash now we gonna take 10 pages explaining this?
~Maria

What do you think of Titus' case for Sciences?

Lol you call it a case that's cute It's still bad. Why give scum any options at all when we can give them none.
~Maria

[PeregrineV]

Let's say a Gunsmith pops in two ages. Let's say a player is known to be really good at Gunsmith . The doctor keeps that player alive.

The neighborizer can neighborize likely town VTs and discuss their abilities and plan out which one they go for on both days or hold until a later option comes up.

All of this can be done without Science. Everyone finds out the wonders each Era as they appear.

[Vecna]

The fact that Titus is not acknowledging the concerns for Sciences that a few of us have raised and keeps harping on "but we could do this with these roles!!!" is concerning.

Not really, she tends to do that all the time. Like I said, we just have to protect her from herself

[Lil Uzi Vert]

I didn't notice Vecna was the first one to say 5 either. To be fair, me, him, and Maria just finished a game together where there were 20+ players and we were on a scum team of 5.

[The DEO]

@Titus I refuse to go another game coordinating night actions unnecessarily after The Thing Mafia. The Thing was different in that everyone's role was public knowledge so it made sense to coordinate night actions and even then, scum had a pretty easy time slipping through the cracks because of every night action being public.

What you're suggesting gives scum a roadmap as to how to proceed during the night JUST like it did in that game.

I still have PTSD
~Maria

Well, that's an issue and if you feel that way, I don't think my words will stop you. It hinders my towngame to have less information, so that is why I said it is a personal choice. I still feel town coordinate better than scum if we keep asking the why factor, something that was missed in The Thing after we died.

That being said, anyone who makes an argument about scum can coordinate too is *side eye*. Of course scum can, but that reeks more of denying info to town boogeyman. Saying town sucks at coordinating is different.

If I can identify town early, I am good at optimizing us.

Yet others do not play like that as a whole.

[Lil Uzi Vert]

MB and Titus were also in that game.

[Lil Uzi Vert]

We don't need information, we just need to force scum to beat us with strong Day play.

[Vecna]

Let it go LUV, absolutely noone is going to scumread me over something so obvious and trivial.

[Lil Uzi Vert]

Let it go LUV, absolutely noone is going to scumread me over something so obvious and trivial.

I was actually defending you

[Vecna]

I know, but its not required

[Elbirn]

Suggestion: We publicly agree on who builds which wonder, so that everyone else can submit no build request and get a higher priority during the next era. Then those player agree on which wonders to build while everyone else sits it out, and so on.

...So scum can have perfect knowledge of who to nightkill, and everyone else gets higher priorities and therefore no one gets higher priorities?

Yeh no



In other news uhh I did read what the two resolutions do and i'ma stick with science. Giving us the ability to better plan ahead for wonders > possibly giving scum more vote power

In fact I just don't like vote mechanics period, one voice one vote. Nahdia we even had a conversation about this before and then you go and you do this to me why

Pedit: this like 30 post Pedit is why you don't start typing a post and then drive home and try to finish the post

Pedit2: god shutup

Pedit3: vena I will pee on your car

[Akane and Nebby]

The majority of the Anicent Era Wonders suck

Bruuuuuuuuuuuuuuuh, they're the best wonders in Civ 5 what the fuck you talking about?

-Nebby

[Vecna]

(but you did manage to become my strongest townread after only 3 pages so kudos for that)