Civilization Mafia [GAME OVER]

[davesaz]

Just guide me to scum this time.

In the middle of my catchup, but giving fair warning -- blatant coasting like this will only earn you an incompetence read for a little while -- after that it's screaming scum.

[The DEO]

@JaeReed -- Without analysis it's just the vote counts. Like I don't have my reads in mind. I colored beeboy and myself. Then saw the tail end of the list being green. So I worked backwards...Do I townread this person Yes no >> IF yes what follows. If no what follows. Repeat >> If I get into conflict logically one of my reads has to be wrong. If I don't I'm probably right in my reads or have my scumreads as town and townreads as scum. Like I could go around all the conclusions and get various scum teams.

However the fact that the None wagon having me and Beeboy at the end necessarily means it's either an all town wagon or scum are towards the middle/front. Unless you scumread us that's a fact.

I don't know what to tell you. I do VCA start from facts. Then go to most likely. Then you have your answer. KIS.

@Nero -- Please explain why you don't. Because my read isn't meta. You didn't ask why I townread A&N.

~~Math

[Nero Cain]

ok but tell me these things that he's doing that make you think town?

Also I've explained about 50,00 times why I think A+N is scum. Just tell me why you think he's town. You don't even need my reasons to do that.

[davesaz]

This could easily be alleviated if davesaz could cite some games that he is visibly bad at reading me.

Saying that I don't remember reading you correctly is an

out of game

(or in other words RL) statement.

I never,

ever

lie about RL

[The DEO]

Random vote on Nero doesn't help

You discrediting the vote and describing it as random is scummy.
The fact that you didn't try to hear him out is scummy.
Everything about this one line is scummy.

-Nebby

Unexplained vote then.
w/e. Semantics.
You know what I mean

DEO's and Maria's votes are unexplained along with Uzi's. Why aren't you scumreading them?
And ya know what, let's play a little game.
No, I don't know what you mean, please explain it to me.

I'm not interested in explaining that right now. It's scum hunting time.

Oh look, more evasion.

-Nebby

Yeah I'm evading because me talking about that list is just going to lead us back to setup and mechanic talk.

Talk to me about why you voted None yet calling my reasoning for not wanting to vote Sciences shit. Talk to me about how asking the mod for you 2 to sign your posts with your actually names is scummy or even implies I'm scum reading your slot. Talk to me about how a meta read has no depth.

You assigned certain people to that list for a reason and I want to know why you want those certain people having those certain wonders.

I voted None because both me and Akane agree with Vecna's points, and we want to start pushing our scumreads.
That's gutpings.
The problem with Meta is that you're using it as an excuse to give a shallow read.

Also town!Uzi townhunts.
Scum!Uzi (as seen in Large Normal 200) scumhunts.

That one line is also LAMIST as fuck along with it goes along the lines of "Hey, let's look like I'm doing something" and "Hey, let's saying I'm going to be doing things but not do things."

-Nebby

I've been town hunting. When I'm saying probably not scum I usually mean null or town.

YOU JUST SAID LET'S START SCUMHUNTING!

-Nebby

Nebby's push here is really freaking townie. Whether LUV and Maxous are town are scum is irrelevant here.

Nebby head is factual and direct and has a strong opinion straight out of the gate when most of the thread is lurktastic and just barely limping in.

Nebby has had way too many opinions and poked way too many people in a similar manner to be scum. She's like advertised everything she is doing in a clear direct manner. I don't always agree with her, but I can clearly tell she has town's best interests at heart.

~~Math

[Nero Cain]

scum can be factual.

scum can push people.

What does him poking people in a similar manner have to do with anything?

What do you think of the case(s) on him?

[The DEO]

Yes they can be. But eventually scum devolve. They can't keep that up. Eventually it falls apart. Unless they have a plan from the first kill to the last mislynch they generally can't keep up the narrative.
It's about how the pushes are.

I think you are wrong on nearly all your scumreads Nero, but I townread you. It's because of what you are doing and what you are saying and "how you are pushing". It indicates a genuine belief and "I don't give a fuck if people like me I'm going to demonstrate my case." It doesn't mean arrogance you're right. It means arrogance your case has merit. Scum have to care about the "likable" part.

I fully believe you think A&N is scum. I just also fully believe you are wrong.

~~Math

[Nero Cain]

I'd also add that their attack on Max is basically a chainsaw defense of Spif. I don't think that Max not like a unexplained vote is scummy and Ali painting it as such actually is scummy. + the line "The fact that you didn't try to hear him out is scummy." is actually really bad. Like he was no where near getting lynched so why would a presumably townNebby care about how Max felt?

[The DEO]

I'd also add that their attack on Max is basically a chainsaw defense of Spif. I don't think that Max not like a unexplained vote is scummy and Ali painting it as such actually is scummy. + the line "The fact that you didn't try to hear him out is scummy." is actually really bad. Like he was no where near getting lynched so why would a presumably townNebby care about how Max felt?

That's actually one of the better lines. It shows a lack of scumhunting. To not read what someone is typing is bad.
You care because you want your reads to be right.

It doesn't matter the position of the wagon. It matters the alignment of the person.

~~Math

[Nero Cain]

it was a naked vote and he gave no reasoning so what did Max ignore?

[The DEO]

It's the fact it was called "random" without reason that is the problem. That's what A&N attacked. Like I don't get what you're asking about. Can you try again in a different way? I don't see the issue.

~~Math

[davesaz]

@ABR and Yuri

Are the people defending A+N

A) scum that know he's town
B)scum defending their buddy
C) bad town
D) trolls

I understand that if A+N is scum there will be a mixture of B and C and if town then A and C but can you guys give me some opinions?

E) Town who think you're tunneling on someone who just expressed what many people said D1. ABR DID derail the Yuri wagon. I don't know if he's scum for doing so, don't know if it's what he intended to happen, but it is what happened.

[Nero Cain]

So Max had opinions on what Spiff said. That's not ignoring what he said. That's straight up scum posting getting in the middle of argument.

[NoticeMeSenpai]

@Math hmm ok. I like to look for [REDACTED] with mine. I feel like you already know one of the techniques I use which so far seems really reliable for me but comes in after at least two lynches.

I'll re-ISO Spiffeh for you, as I really don't want to just brush you off, but from what I remember he just seemed town to me. I just really don't want to do it right now, so it'll have to be tonight or tomorrow depending on how I feel later.

[Nero Cain]

vote: NoticeMeSenpai

[The DEO]

So Max had opinions on what Spiff said. That's not ignoring what he said. That's straight up scum posting getting in the middle of argument.

Spiff isn't in that quote at all. What are you talking about?

~~Math

[Nero Cain]

your chain link is basically A+N fussing at Max over Max Spiff vote. your quoted 526 isn't even the whole post. Why?

[Nero Cain]

564 rather

[The DEO]

your chain link is basically A+N fussing at Max over Max Spiff vote. your quoted 526 isn't even the whole post. Why?

Because the point is the tone and how she hunts over many many posts.

Oh and JaeReed is town too.

~~Math

[Nero Cain]

ok, that was early d1. What do you think of her current posting?

[Nero Cain]

Yes they can be. But eventually scum devolve. They can't keep that up. Eventually it falls apart.

[The DEO]

@Math hmm ok. I like to look for [REDACTED] with mine. I feel like you already know one of the techniques I use which so far seems really reliable for me but comes in after at least two lynches.

I'll re-ISO Spiffeh for you, as I really don't want to just brush you off, but from what I remember he just seemed town to me. I just really don't want to do it right now, so it'll have to be tonight or tomorrow depending on how I feel later.

Honestly I can't think of it atm. I feel really discouraged and well. Like if I post a word of what I think some random person goes "It's Math" Despite the fact I have actually a deceent to average record. I'm just swingy.

~~Math

[The DEO]

ok, that was early d1. What do you think of her current posting?

Town as fuck...Otherwise I wouldn't be townreading her lol.

~~Math

[Nero Cain]

and whats been town as fuck about them?

[davesaz]

So I'm finally caught up all the way.

Nero's attempt at making a case on A&N looks town motivated. As I already said earlier during catchup, I don't agree with the basis of the case but being wrong doesn't detract from the motivation.

I reserve judgment on Caesar. Role play is fine, I don't see a reason to scumread someone for it, and it is 208 pages which is a fuckton to read no matter who you are. That degree of patience won't continue after the pace slows down a bit, and I'm going to expect that content post to make some sense.

I could be a nice guy and point Spiffeh to a place where I had trouble reading him. I am indeed being honest here that I have no confidence in that read at this point. But it's late...

I'm pretty serious on wanting more from Creature. Can someone explain the strong town read? Sheepskin is a pretty good disguise.

It's too late at night to do more than this -- almost 1am and I do have work tomorrow. If we let up on the accelerator a bit maybe there won't be 50 pages next time I have time to read. Don't get me wrong, the discussion is helpful in getting alignment data, but there is still chaff mixed in with the grain.