Civilization Mafia [GAME OVER]

[The DEO]

VOTE: Brian Skies

Like this one. It is a pic so what? It is short direct to the point.
Takes a clear stance on a random vote hopped in and it is on a slot that is obv Town.

Like that is good scum hunting 101 make people explain.

~~Math

[The DEO]

When I have the exact same reaction to the post in the exact same amount of time...It's probably because we share an alignment. (And hint I'm town)

~~Math

[Nero Cain]

Random vote on Nero doesn't help

You discrediting the vote and describing it as random is scummy.
The fact that you didn't try to hear him out is scummy.
Everything about this one line is scummy.

-Nebby

how do you know A+N is town?

[Nero Cain]

errrrr

but being wrong

[The DEO]

JaeReed do you have further questions or can I go to bed? I kinda wanna stay up later for you since no one is normally on when you are. Then other people can see you game solve.

~~Math

[Nero Cain]

I mean, I'm just not going to agree. Maybe I'm right. Maybe everyone telling me I'm wrong means I'm wrong . I just don't feel like he's real townie. I feel like him blaming ABR for EOD was p sad. Calling me confbias but scum doesn't go together.



I'm also a little bit confused but that post of his with the cookie monster picture that you are calling so fucking town.

Your original reaction was that he was "lynch shopping". Why would town do that?

[Nero Cain]

Like that is good scum hunting 101 make people explain.

but then its like...Max can't dislike a naked unexplained vote and that's bad but Ali can not like a naked unexplained vote and its scumhunting?

[Nero Cain]

Also you are calling Spiff scum (and I agree) so I dunno why you aren't more wary that A+N is a Spiff buddy.

[The DEO]

I mean, I'm just not going to agree. Maybe I'm right. Maybe everyone telling me I'm wrong means I'm wrong . I just don't feel like he's real townie. I feel like him blaming ABR for EOD was p sad. Calling me confbias but scum doesn't go together.



I'm also a little bit confused but that post of his with the cookie monster picture that you are calling so fucking town.

Your original reaction was that he was "lynch shopping". Why would town do that?

I also blame ABR for EOD and so there for I am sad. Sad townies unite to lynch scums.

Scum lynch shop.

I like don't see what you are talking about with Maxous and A&N those are two different worlds of posts.

I am sleepy JaeReed isn't on.

If you think Spiffeh is scum push Spiffeh if Spiffeh flips scum we lynch Yuri if Yuri flips scum we lynch ABR.

That is my ideal world.

~~Math

[Leonshade]

I think all of {DEO, ABR, PeregrineV, Creature, Sondam}

I have lesser town reads on {A&N, Nero Cain, Yuri, Drixx, Uzi, Vecna, Elbirn}

Which leaves me {NoticeMeSenpai, davesaz, ssbm_Kyouko, Leonshade, Maxous, Caesar}

What were your reads prebeeboy lynch and who changed because of it?

~~Math

Mathblade I'm ignoring all of your posts from now in if that wasn't clear

Same with Uzi

I'm not dealing with your ridiculous suspicions of me and reading your posts about me make angry enough to want to insult both of you instead of actually scumhunt which is toxic to the gamestate and in the grand scheme of things makes me useless

So don't expect that question to get answered

That's a very reasonable question to just ignore.

I will comply with players I feel are town and being reasonable to work with.

Right now that aren't many. I'm starting with ABR and Maria and hopefully that group grows.

What are you defining reasonable as? Because from an outside perspective it looks like you consider reasonable "doesn't scumread me and agreed with my reads".

[Leonshade]

While the Senator known as Creature is most tiresome and wrong-headed in many of his proposed initiatives, we find him to be a most loyal citizen. Our experience with this worthy opponent suggests that his conduct in this conclave, in contrast to other such congregations, has the best interests of the Empire at heart. Nevertheless, we find some of his proposals most disagreeable. In particular, we object to the aspersions he has cast upon the proposed construction of the Pyramids outside Imperial Rome, a project We Your Emperors are considering. We find that this Monument to the Gods will be most useful in perpetuating our lineage and our rule beyond the mortal sphere. Further, we would build this wonder to deny it to those other nations who would use it for ill. Further consultation is required before a decision is made regarding Rome's priorities - a grand series of Hanging Gardens also appeals to Our sophisticated aesthetic senses, and a Statue to Jupiter would allow our wisdom to echo through the ages more effectively. We implore Senator Creature not to close his mind to the beneficial effects of these grand projects out of fear for imagined dangers. Such cowardice is unworthy a Roman Senator.

This is bad.

"Creature is town but here are the long-winded, wordy reasons why he is wrong about these roles"

I see no point in saying this unless you want to give the impression that you're contributing more than you are. It's not like anyone was actively agreeing with what Creature was saying so what's the point in devoting all these words to it?

Good catch.

@Leon

@Leon who are you scum reading atm?

NoticeMeSenpai. There could also be scum in ABR/Yuri, but I don't feel confident about either.

Elaborate on all of these.

Notice because JaeReed doesn't seem like my experience with town!JaeReed, and he's a transparent player who doesn't really vary his style so that makes me think he's scum here. I also think he makes long rants with AtE/complaining about non-game things because that's the only thing he, uncomfortable with lying, feels comfortable talking about.

ABR and Yuri were both popular wagons that got diverted, while the beeboy lynch was pushed through much easier, so I feel that the difficulty with lynching one of them could be due to them being scum (Vecna was also a popular wagon but I'm TRing them). I wouldn't support a Yuri wagon, as their seemed towny during/after they were close to being lynched, and I was only really scumreading ABR because I thought his early inactivity was deliberate.

You don't actually know me enough to say that, we're not friends, so stop talking like you know me. Also, I do vary my style quite fucking often, so no. You have literally been in one game and saw me replace into one where I hurt a friend and became a little more subdued after that. And still proceeded to step on the toes of another friend. You trying to say you know my meta based off one game where I was a mason and another where I fucked up and hurt my friends is disingenous as fuck.

And complaining about the pace of the game is definitely a game related thing. So is complaining about the toxicity and gaslighting exhibited by certain players. Is it AI? No, or at least I don't think so in my case, but it is certainly game related. < Yes I understand this is semantics it just bugged me.

Yuri was a consensus wagon for a pretty long time and no one bothered to hard derail it for so long that I don't think they're scum. Only thing I'm wary of there is their defense of me but I think the emotional responses were genuine. ABR is town because he sees the same shit from Vecna that I do, was kinda waffling on this early game because his early game in Shadowrun was more aggressive but the push to derail the Yuri shit was good.

Talk to me about your TR on Vecna? This whole thing feels like grapes all over again.

First off, I apologize if I was coming off like I know your mindset. My intention was to comment on your play, nothing more.

I'm also counting Undertale mafia since I was still following it after my death. I think I explained more clearly in an earlier post, but I interpret your technically game-related, but not game-advancing comments about game length and such as active lurking, the appearance of contributing while not really doing so.

I see what you're saying about Yuri's wagon, but the lack of a visible derail could be caution on the part of his buddies, if they are scum (which, mind you, I doubt at this point).

My Vecna-read was solidified during resolution phase, he made such a strong push for None, and a case for the other two being anti-town, that I think it came from a genuine place. My reads have also been similar to his and I haven't yet had a reason to doubt my TR on him.

How do you feel about A&N and LUV, ABR's other two SRs?

[Leonshade]

So you think I'm scum and you call me "confbias". These two things don't go together.

So you're saying that Confbias can only come from town?
-Nebby

Nero does have a good point, scum can't confbias. Though they may appear/put on the appearance of confbias if they're trying to push someone.

Bee was obvious town man. Entrance alone should have put all doubt to the side. I want to lynch Spiffy today.

VOTE: None

No. Spiffeh is town.

Why?

[Vecna]

Pedit thanks

Sorry *blush*

I find it an interesting theory scum took doctor. Do you realize that even if assuming Frogger is obvTown that doesn't make him the NK? If someone's reads are bad they can live longer. Has happened to me when I have derped. Assume Frogger isn't derping? What does that indicate to you?

~~Math

Frogger's reads weren't bad, he caught Vecna. He was simply indecisive because strong personalities were pulling him in different directions and he couldn't handle it. He didn't like having people rely on him for choosing what to do. Who do you think is obvtown....? since you say there are others besides frogger, but I only saw frogger.

He didnt catch anything genious, I made a very obvious and in your face play to get you lynched or die trying. When I explained my reasoning he backed off and even hopped on your bandwagon because he realized I mightve been right.

Town has no reason to keep misconstruing these facts. Youre a lyar. And a manipulator.

[Leonshade]

Oh, Pine is one half of a hydra. That doesn't change much for me though.

Why not, if you're voting him based solely on his low vote count?

@ mostly Brain and anyone else

pls vote Nebby.

They are scum b/c they tried to blame ABR for the Yuri wagon dissipating when it wasn't his fault. When I pointed this out they said that that wasn't what they were arguing. When I posted quotes of them arguing exactly that (4444 they didn't reply. He then goes on to call me confbias while still calling me scum. It doesn't make sense so I feel like they are scum that know that I am town. He then argued that there was nothing to respond to in 4444. While yes, 4444 doesn't ask a direct question, I find it oddly convenient that they have no response to the crux of my case.

Counterpoint: He's a VI (my words) but Spiff thinks that her blaming ABR comes from bad town and the Maria head of Sodom think she wouldn't be this mind boggingly stupid (embellishment mine)

Your counterpoint is my viewpoint.

[Vecna]

What do you think of him warming up to the possibility of you being scum? One of his posts that made me Town read him was (paraphrasing) ABR did this. If he was obvious Town and assume you are Town and that would make his reads wrong why would scum kill obvTown whose reads were wrong?

His vote for Vecna was because he saw something. His vote for me was mindless appeasement of my detractors to shake things up and see what would happen. He promptly backed off from me and went for Beeboy.

There was nothing prompt about it. And it was under heavy pressure from spiffeh and a bunch of other people that flocked there.

His vote for me was because I scumread you and then hopped on over to beeboy to get him hammered and set you up for rope the day after. That was the only reasoning he voted me. When I explained my reasoning his scumread was instantly gone, and he joined me on YOU.

You know he wouldve come after you again today, hence he had to die. Pretty convenient as well regardless since noone was ever going to lynch him anyway.

[Vecna]

Frogger was also the only player who tried to unite me and DEO. By removing him, they hoped to achieve further chaos and division, in addition to removing a player who was widely townread and trusted. Wherever Frogger voted, people followed, which he remarked upon himself and which unnerved him. He was the one player that could be counted on to lead a united town.

The town was united and fine untill you showed up. Once youre gone it will be reunited again.

[Vecna]

Frogger was also the only player who tried to unite me and DEO. By removing him, they hoped to achieve further chaos and division, in addition to removing a player who was widely townread and trusted. Wherever Frogger voted, people followed, which he remarked upon himself and which unnerved him. He was the one player that could be counted on to lead a united town.

This is patently false.
A&N tried. Sodham tried. Hell practically the entire thread tried but there were some people who wanted me to come out of my post ban and post more.

This is the same doubtcasting I saw and didn't like from LUV it puts us in a state of OMG we are going to fail.
This is day 2. Day 2.

A lot can change. Hell I have led town blocks before. I hate them but I CAN do it if not being told I am dumb and crazy every post.

This also goes against you strongarming the lynch onto Beeboy. You said you could lead this town then. Can you not lead it now? I find this response fishy.
~~Math

Good your seeing it as well.

ABR is trying to push a false narrative about what really happened.

[Leonshade]

FoS: Caesar

They seem to be the major wagon so I'll wait for a VC before voting.

[Vecna]

If ABR and DEO could pretend each other are masons and started to look for scum, that'd be good.

I am not pretending the most toxic player to the obvtown block is a mason. Sorry, especially when his whole shtick is Titus is terrible.

I can and will work around him. Caesar is the best lynch that ABR and I will agree on.

Giving ABR space to wreck things is why shit went south yesterday.

Why attempt to work with, as opposed to removing the toxicity?

you've stated it several times before - he tries to drive a wedge between people, he tries to lie about what happened - we need him dead, and then we can make optimal choices about what needs to happen.

[Vecna]

Mathblade you can't actually still think I'm scum lmao

I do.

~~Math

Im starting to get around to this way of thinking

ABR + Spiffeh seems possible.

Spiffeh didnt care about lynching beeboy at all. I wanted to trade him my vote for asnwers to questions - he ignored at least 6 of them.

ABR slippin the noose is a joke.

Jaereed is still scum as well.

Buddying attempt of Math noted.

Posturing noted.

Good note it.

Also note that im calling you + ABR as a scum-team. After we lynch him today and he flips scum, youre next.

[Vecna]

Both town.~Titus

So basically anyone who is against me is town. All the scum have decided to join my side. Got it.

Who are opposing you?

The scumbags I've caught: Vecnar, LUV, A+N.

And how did you "catch" them?

The only person you've given any reason for scumreading is A+N

Im 100% OMGUS after I 1v1'd you, LUV i dont even know.

[Vecna]

You think I'm scum because I claimed PR on D1 LOL

Yes we caught you slipping Day 1. Credit to frogger may his soul RIP.

This is not actual town thought process.

No scum would ever fake-claim a PR.

Calling this a slip is just forcing fake-ass reads.

[Brian Skies]

Why not, if you're voting him based solely on his low vote count?

Because skimming the hydra's iso just showed more of the same roleplaying activity. To be honest, I haven't read any of it in depth, and town are likely to get drowned out by noise, especially in a game as large as this one. I just don't see any reason to move my vote elsewhere, especially since I've seen scum do weird things to obfuscate their alignment, like spoilering each individual response in a wall response or [reiterating?] information with strange formatting.

Also, you're fos'ing them and waiting to vote them yourself. Why is that?

[Vecna]

The scumbags I've caught: Vecnar, LUV, A+N.

I have town leans on all of them

Can you explain why you're scum reading them?

Vecnar, because his thoughts made NO SENSE when he moved from Yuri to Beeboy to me and back to Beeboy. The whole thing reeks of scum.

A+N, super shady and opportunistic.

LUV, you can catch him slipping Day 1.

Any town with a real town perspective on this game knows that this is all horse manure.

[Vecna]

Spiffeh iso gives me a town vibe but I'm not very good at reading him so it's really weak.

This also really bothers me from davesaz.

Only because I can't think of any examples off the top of my head where he hasn't been good at reading from me. At the time, there were also some people speaking out against me, so this kinda looked like a way to appease both me and the people pressuring me, as well as give him a reason to vote for me later on.

This could easily be alleviated if davesaz could cite some games that he is visibly bad at reading me.

Davesaz is scum btw, so pay it no never mind.

ABR is actually townreading nearly the entire group that contains likely scum.

The ammount of dissonance from how actual town view the game-state is evidence enough for me to hang him.