Mini Normal 1988 (Endgame)

[mozamis]

It is partly him saying "I'VE GOT A SECRET PLAN HEY PUT THE SPOTLIGHT ON ME!" I know people disagree but I took that as town.
Plus he doesn't seem reticent in anyway, he's been happy to argue the toss with everyone.

[Roy Tagliaferro]

if you're town, why are you tunneling

Did you seriously ask this?
Town tunnel all the time. Hell on my other accounts I famous for it

Evidently, I did. I mean, what's the town value of tunneling, as opposed to keeping an open mind and weighing out options?

Yeah, my "announcement" might've been a bit weird but I was just wanting to try something out and throw it out here. Discussion, y'all! Yay! Gamesolving!

Lynch pool for now would be Leeoon, Bu, TIAM, TGP. Townleans Seph, Luca, Chumba, Lalendra. Rest is MOTR.

[Chumba]

Evidently, I did. I mean, what's the town value of tunneling, as opposed to keeping an open mind and weighing out options?

Keeping options open imo is what scum want. Tunneling means you think you found scum and now you want them lynched. Clearly if somebody makes a good argument to show why that person is town or why somebody else is scum, they shouldn’t be ignored but I haven’t seen good arguments from anyone yet

[TwoInAMillion]

Being overconfident doesn't help town. It's one thing if you actually have a read on someone, it's another if you're just guessing and trying to put up a strong front.

[Sephiroth]

Can we get a vote count? I feel like voting TIAM but at the moment I don't want to detract from this Buj wagon. Interested to see where that one is going.

[Sephiroth]

It is partly him saying "I'VE GOT A SECRET PLAN HEY PUT THE SPOTLIGHT ON ME!" I know people disagree but I took that as town.
Plus he doesn't seem reticent in anyway, he's been happy to argue the toss with everyone.

Just out of curiosity do you think that 'putting the spot light on him' would put him in any sort of real danger as scum? It just seems that reading between the lines you're saying this isn't scummy because it draws attention to him, but I really don't think its the kind of attention that most scum would worry about.

[Prism]

BuJaber thinking nailing all 3 scum on Day 1 as not only possible but imminent needs to stop. Those last few sentences of 229 are the kind that make you think "Either this guy is completely clueless or he's scum". While we want to win and will actively try to figure out which one it is, this isn't the kind of choice you want us to make.

I'd slot him as a townlean but not a hardread. I think Luca's conception of the read on him/Roy is a bit off (Bujaber's critique seemed to be more broad characterizations of means and ends, and them being two different styles I don't think has much to do with it. The spirit is just "Doing a lot but not seeming to be genuinely interested in finding scum" The latter can take the form of trying too hard to appear like you are while not actually doing it (ie. Roy) or by ) Others reads (ie. me/Lalendra being only one scum) can be pretty convoluted/inaccurate but his explanation of it was great. The only thing that would really give me pause is 229's "I'm being the most open" line but the rest seems more just like a lack of selfawareness to me.

I've got a feeling about Prism/Jaber being scum - Jaber's scumread on him after his opening post felt weird, and the way Prism casually accepted it was even weirder.

His accusation of it being a reach was completely accurate. I have differing reads from him. Being scumread isn't a surprise.

I'm going to preemptively say I'm aware of the response that being scumread

should

be a surprise when you're town. This is not the case for me. If you want me to elaborate, let me know.

I originally scumread Bujaber when I typed this part, so this wasn't really meant to be a defense or buddying attempt but more of a defense of myself.

Chumba's posts in general rock. I don't know if he's town, but the dude knows what he's doing and is experienced, and everyone would be better to listen to them. He will probably have hated this entire section. If he's scum I don't think he'll get past me but it might take awhile.

His vote looks straight up like chiainsaw defending to me. He also thought roy was newer which is why he thought that post was bad, but when learning that roy isn't actually new his opinion doesn't change which imo it should since it roy being new was part of the basis for it. He also seems to be trying too hard in his opening post.

I didn't respond to the "Roy is an alt" post to just not be a jerk. To be blunt, Roy's play is more of what tells me he's newer more than the join date. All it did was move the question to "Revisit later" for when I have a better idea. I think the mainslip (assuming that's not just another alt) reinforces this more than negates it, despite coming after the fact.

I like Nero's #224. Somewhere GoldenParadox made a really good fairly long post that I'll have to find and extrapolate, the "scumclaim" for Bujaber though was just awful. I don't think it overrules whatever I liked about the big post but god when people call selfvotes scumclaims is it bad.

I wanted to revisit Roy here but I'm out of time, I'll pick up where I left off and see what I can get out of 200/238

[Luca Blight]

I still want a TIAM lynch today. He has done nothing to warrant a stay of execution, and his excuse that 'not much has happened' simply isn't valid.

Evidently, I did. I mean, what's the town value of tunneling, as opposed to keeping an open mind and weighing out options?

Keeping options open imo is what scum want.

Which is what you seem to be doing.

[Chumba]

How’s that? I’ve got 3 scum reads and there is very likely 3 scum. I’m probably not going to vote anyone else unless I have to.

[Luca Blight]

You haven't particularly taken a hard stance on anyone yet this game. You're voting Roy yet are not pushing his lynch. Your other scum reads are poorly reasoned and again you don't seem to be following up on them. You haven't taken a stance on Jaber or TIAM either.

You say you're famous for tunneling as Town on your other account, so why are you being so different here?

[Chumba]

I’m busy so really haven’t had time to dedicate to this game unfortunately but can you honestly say anyone has done a good job at it? I can’t because I haven’t been conviced my reads could be wrong.

I’m playing different because that was the point of this account. To play different. I wasn’t even going to out I was an alt but I alt slipped elsewhere.

Roy is so obviously scummy to me and the only one defending him is using the thing I find scummy as a town tell. This bu wagon is a joke Nd nobody has a half decent case for him. I’ve stated my reasons for my reads and Roy has done the most scummy things. His recent posts just prove my point. His reasons and his vote were bad and the unvote didn’t really help him.

[Chumba]

You haven't taken a stance on Jaber or TIAM either.

Why do I have to take a stance on them if I already have people I’m scum reading?

Anyone not in my list is either town or null

[Luca Blight]

Roy is so obviously scummy to you, yet you're not pushing his lynch, despite your natural tendency to tunnel when you're Town? If I hadn't ISO'd you I wouldn't have even realised you were voting Roy. That's pretty damning in itself.

What about my case that Jaber basically invented his read on me? His read progression doesn't add up. You still haven't mentioned TIAM.

Please detail why we should lynch Roy. The only thing you said previously was his gambit, which isn't particularly compelling. Why is his recent vote worse than the others who voted Jaber?

You haven't taken a stance on Jaber or TIAM either.

Why do I have to take a stance on them if I already have people I’m scum reading?

Anyone not in my list is either town or null

Because they are the lynch candidates, so you either need to compromise on one of them or push your own target. If you're not scumreading them, state why.

You seem to be content doing none of the above.

[Chumba]

I can’t help if you are a shitty reader. It’s obvious from my posts who I scum read cause I’ve said it at least twice and have said or implied I scum read Roy more than that.

I’ll compromise if I have to. I don’t have to yet.

[Chumba]

You seem to be content doing none of the above.

Yes I am

[Luca Blight]

My point is you haven't been pushing Roy's lynch. I saw you make the odd comment on Roy, but I honestly didn't think you were voting anyone until I looked back over your ISO.

If you're not going to compromise yet then why not try to convince me and others to vote the guy who is so obviously scum to you?

What do you think of TIAM's vote on Jaber? Better or worse than Roy's?

You also avoided my question on Jaber. You say no-one has a half-decent case on him, I pointed out my one and asked you what you thought, but again you avoided this question.

[Archwing]

VOTE: TIAM

[Luca Blight]

Another thing that's been bugging me about Chumba for a while is this:

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Leeoon

His complete lack of content cannot be ignored.

What about my lack of content?

I feel like he asked this question purely for the purpose of being townread for it. It's a version of LAMIST -

"Why would scum draw attention to themselves like that?"

The reason it stands out to me is because there is no reason to ask it. It was clear, and is still clear why I voted Leeoon over anyone else at that point for lack of content. Chumba himself had way more content at this point. The fact he then uses it to cast shade on me, again without following up on it, is even worse.

[Chumba]

My point is you haven't been pushing Roy's lynch. I saw you make the odd comment on Roy, but I honestly didn't think you were voting anyone until I looked back over your ISO.

If you're not going to compromise yet then why not try to convince me and others to vote the guy who is so obviously scum to you?

What do you think of TIAM's vote on Jaber? Better or worse than Roy's?

You also avoided my question on Jaber. You say no-one has a half-decent case on him, I pointed out my one and asked you what you thought, but again you avoided this question.

I’m busy and I’m not strong arming any lynches day 1.

I’ll look at this stuff you want me to look at tomorrow

[Chumba]

Another thing that's been bugging me about Chumba for a while is this:

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Leeoon

His complete lack of content cannot be ignored.

What about my lack of content?

I feel like he asked this question purely for the purpose of being townread for it. It's a version of LAMIST -

"Why would scum draw attention to themselves like that?"

The reason it stands out to me is because there is no reason to ask it. It was clear, and is still clear why I voted Leeoon over anyone else at that point for lack of content. Chumba himself had way more content at this point. The fact he then uses it to cast shade on me, again without following up on it, is even worse.

No I honestly wanted to know why you single one person out when others are guilty of it.

[Luca Blight]

If you had asked '

what about other people's lack of content

' it would be a more reasonable question, but to ask specifically what about his lack of content just seems off.

I can't imagine a townie mindset being

'why aren't you voting me instead?'

[Chumba]

If you are town Think outside the box. It’s better

[Luca Blight]

No I honestly wanted to know why you single one person out when others are guilty of it.

And what did you make of my explanation? Again, I don't know as you never followed up on it.

[Chumba]

Not a fan of it.

Side note, skimming your iso I think it’s funny you call me out for lamist but you’ve made some lamist posts yourself. Those in glass houses...

You also seem to be just grasping at things that aren’t scummy. Like you have made a few posts calling things scummy that aren’t really scummy. You’ve done that multiple times towards me even. If you are town stop focusing on surface scummy things (which aren’t even scummy).

[Luca Blight]

Such vagueness...

Why aren't you a fan of my explanation?
What have I done that is LAMIST?
What are the things I called scummy that aren't even scummy?