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Post Post #100 (ISO) » Wed Oct 17, 2007 12:32 pm

Post by Kinetic »

I have, but I'd like to save this last card of mine for a little bit later in the day. I'd also like a few other people to speak up.
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Post Post #101 (ISO) » Wed Oct 17, 2007 4:15 pm

Post by Rhakith »

Rather than comment on the above, let me say this one thing:

There are plenty of characters in the SG universe. Numerous memorable, but by no means even considered by anyone as "main" or important to the cast. Not to mention, there are plenty of recurring characters. 20+ on the main page of Wikipedia alone.

Unless we get lucky and scum double-claim by accident, the reaction undoubtly favours the scum.
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Post Post #102 (ISO) » Wed Oct 17, 2007 4:19 pm

Post by spurgistan »

That's why I was trying to say last page. If there are more possible solid townie claims than townies, the town will find itself little better off as far as knowing who the scum are, if at all, while the scum will pick up on who our power roles are.
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Post Post #103 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 3:43 am

Post by Jester »

Kinetic wrote:A lot of trite BS about a mass name-claim
vote: Kinetic
.

You make this sound so nice: all puppies and rainbows. Problem is, if we have a Cop, it's Rodney McKay. If we have a Doc, it's Carson Beckett. And if we have a Vig, it's Ford or Dex. I give this information now because it now seems clear that I'm the only player really familiar with the show. Kinetic, you said that you're somewhat familiar with Atlantis, so I can only assume that you know this too. Therefore, someone would have to be an idiot to name-claim those three names.

You point out this danger, but you seem to think it's worth it. Well, I don't.

A mass name-claim puts us in a situation where either we lose our power-roles one by one because they've claimed, or to protect themselves, they lie about their names, and appear scummy if someone else counter-claims. And you haven't even said what happens if scum claim to be one of those names. Suppose we get two people claiming to be Carson Beckett? Sure, one's lying... but how do you pick which one has more credibility this early in the game? You gonna have us lynch a potential Doc because he might be lying? spurgistan, you pick up and name the first point. Your stock goes up a couple of points.

It'll be interesting to hear the other players weigh in on your little proposal, though.
Rhakith wrote:There are plenty of characters in the SG universe. Numerous memorable, but by no means even considered by anyone as "main" or important to the cast. Not to mention, there are plenty of recurring characters.
Didn't you read Kinetic's full proposal? He's proposing we lynch everyone not in the major six. I wish I was being sarcastic or exaggerating, but I'm not. Read his 77 again:
Kinetic wrote:If we assume there is a Pro-Town Killing role, EVEN if we out all of the power roles, if we just focus on killing the players that are not the above six, we could win this game in three days. Less if we use scum hunting abilities to aid us in choosing our targets.
In the meantime, here's what I have so far on players familiar with the TV show:

Code: Select all

Very familiar with the show:                        Jester
Somewhat familiar with the show:                    Kinetic
Familiar with SG-1 but not familiar with Atlantis:  Rhakith
Not familiar with the show:                         Gemelli, joost, ooba, spurgistan, Zephyr09
Haven't answered the question yet:                  bubka, destructor, pulsewidth, Tarhalindur


There hasn't been much if any discussion on anything other than the name-claim, so I'm caught up.
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Post Post #104 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 4:14 am

Post by Tarhalindur »

Add me on to the "very familiar with the show" category.

Also, Jester, you forgot a character who might be the vig: Sheppard.
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Post Post #105 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 4:25 am

Post by Tarhalindur »

After further consideration about Kinetic, I'm going to
Confirm Vote
.

Frankly, Kinetic's plan looks far more likely to screw the town than the scum - given the current situation, if the scum have even one safeclaim, then they can skate into endgame (by sacrificing any scum without a strong claim to get rid of four townies. If the scum have more than one safeclaim, then Kinetic's plan flat out wins the game for the scum (we kill 0-1 scum and 5-6 townies, they kill 3 town-aligned major characters, scum win the game handily).

The only way that Kinetic could know that scum don't have safeclaims is if he has inside knowledge (i.e, is scum himself)... in which case he's undoubtedly trying to screw us over (I can see at least two possible scum motivations behind Kinetic's plan - trying to out the power roles, and trying to find good falseclaims).
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Post Post #106 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 4:38 am

Post by destructor »

First of all, I think the idea of a mass name claim is just bad. pulsewidth noted the possibility that scum have safe claims of 'major' characters. Also, town power roles are very likely to be outed by this.

And anyway, I have a much simpler reason to oppose this idea: I want to play
Mafia
, which isn't a game about trying to figure out how to outwit the Mod and break their game, but about
scum hunting
. So let's do that - scum hunt. =)

Unless someone posts a radically attractive reason to mass name-claim, I'll state my opposition and have no desire to comment on this further.

Kinetic, if you're scum, it seems pretty obvious to me that you have a safe claim, and most probably one of those six names you mentioned. I actually thought you were being fairly pro-town until you started about the name claim.
FOS: Kinetic


On that, I haven't been convinced by most of the votes on Kinetic. His advocating of a mass name-claim makes it more unlikely that he's scum, unless he has a safe claim. But none of the people who've voted him, except Tar, have suggested this. Others on Kinetic's wagon: Rhakith (random vote), Gemellii, Jester. Can each of you articulate your reasons for voting Kinetic?

Jester, I don't know what we stand to gain by stating our familiarity with the series. How exactly is this helping our scum hunt?

I'm also a little disturbed by the number of people who seemed to be content with assuming Tar was town.
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Post Post #107 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 5:05 am

Post by Gemelli »

destructor wrote:His advocating of a mass name-claim makes it more unlikely that he's scum, unless he has a safe claim. But none of the people who've voted him, except Tar, have suggested this. Others on Kinetic's wagon: Rhakith (random vote), Gemellii, Jester. Can each of you articulate your reasons for voting Kinetic?
I've been trying to articulate my reasons for voting Kinetic for the last day or so; see posts 85, 90, 94, 97, and 99. I realize there's a lot of text to scale through there, but it's not like I've voted without comment.

But anyway, let me summarize: the essence of my case against Kinetic is that he proposed a strategy in post 77 that I think would be harmful to the town, and has continued to advocate it. Since post 77, Kinetic seems to have backed off on the aspect of the strategy that I found most disturbing -- namely, having the town focus on lynching/vigging players who did not claim names on his list of main characters -- but that was what set off my initial alarms.

Also, not to be pedantic, but I raised the possibility of a main-character safe claim before Tar did, in post 99:
Gemelli wrote:One final point: have you considered the possibility that our mod deliberately left some of the main characters out of the game to provide potential safe claims for scum?
If the mod DID spell out potential safe claims for scum in the role PMs, and if one of those safe claims was a major character, this is exactly the kind of tactic I would expect scum to try.

But this is getting pretty heavily into WIFOM and "if"-laden conjecture, so I don't think it's a solid scumtell. But just as importantly, I don't think calling for a mass nameclaim is an indicator of town alignment.
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Post Post #108 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 5:22 am

Post by destructor »

Oh yeah, it was you, not pulsewidth. I think. Sorry. It's 2am. heh. =D

I didn't have as much a problem with your vote on Kinetic, though when I was reading, it seemed like you were voting him half out of frustration. But just to clarify, was your vote on Kinetic based on him having a safe claim, or simply that his suggestion was anti-town?
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Post Post #109 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 5:31 am

Post by Gemelli »

destructor wrote:But just to clarify, was your vote on Kinetic based on him having a safe claim, or simply that his suggestion was anti-town?
The vote was based on him posting what I perceived to be an anti-town strategy. The "safe claim" point was just made to demonstrate that scum could indeed have reasons for advocating such a strategy.
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Post Post #110 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 9:20 am

Post by joost »

Personally I am in favor of a mass name claim. Yes it does potentially outs power roles, but with (almost everything) out in the open, the power roles will become a bit less valuable. Scum will try to kill townies if we name claim or not, the claim will not change it. I don't think advocating a theory that might help us find scum is a scum tell and I'm fairly suspicious of people think it is. People seem to forget that besides possibly outing power roles (and maybe we have a lot of those), mass name claim would possibly out scum roles too and I'm willing to sacrifice a cop or a doc for a scum role. So if two people were to claim Carson Beckett I have no problem lynching them both.

That being said I think that if Kinetic is scum I doubt he has a safe claim. It seems more likely that one (or more) of his scumbuddies has a safe claim and Kinetic is willing to take the blame. But this is just guessing.

I don't think Kinetic is acting scummy and Gemelli and Tar seem pro-town too. Though I'm not 100% convinced about Tar yet.
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Post Post #111 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 9:59 am

Post by pulsewidth »

To answer the question, I'm not familiar with the show at all.

Couple of things:

Rhakith, if I'm not mistaken, you still have your random vote on Kinetic. Are you leaving it there because you forgot about it, or are you happy with where your vote is?

Tar: That's the second time you've confirmed your vote. Nothing major, but it just struck me as odd.

destructor:
destructor wrote: Kinetic, if you're scum, it seems pretty obvious to me that you have a safe claim, and most probably one of those six names you mentioned. I actually thought you were being fairly pro-town until you started about the name claim.
FOS: Kinetic

On that, I haven't been convinced by most of the votes on Kinetic. His advocating of a mass name-claim makes it more unlikely that he's scum, unless he has a safe claim.
Unless I'm reading this wrong, this seems like a huge contradiction. You're FoSing Kinetic for proposing a mass name-claim, then you turn around and say that doing so makes it less likely that he's scum. This looks incredibly like scum-buddy distancing to me.

FoS: destructor


joost:
joost wrote: Personally I am in favor of a mass name claim. Yes it does potentially outs power roles, but with (almost everything) out in the open, the power roles will become a bit less valuable. Scum will try to kill townies if we name claim or not, the claim will not change it. I don't think advocating a theory that might help us find scum is a scum tell and I'm fairly suspicious of people think it is. People seem to forget that besides possibly outing power roles (and maybe we have a lot of those), mass name claim would possibly out scum roles too and I'm willing to sacrifice a cop or a doc for a scum role. So if two people were to claim Carson Beckett I have no problem lynching them both.
Vote: joost


Power roles are one of the few advantages that town has over the scum, and you're fine with making them less valuable? "Scum will try to kill townies if we name claim or not, the claim will not change it." You're trying to make it sound like a name claim won't make a big difference or give the scum a huge advantage, and you're just flat out wrong. Of course scum will kill townies regardless, but name claims give the scum a great deal of information on who to NK in order to cripple the town more effectively. Given the opportunity to NK a regular townie or a cop, I'm pretty sure the mafia will opt to NK the cop. Kinetic has presented us with a plan that will hurt the town, so it doesn't surprise me that scum have stepped up to support it.
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Post Post #112 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 11:25 am

Post by Kinetic »

destructor wrote:First of all, I think the idea of a mass name claim is just bad. pulsewidth noted the possibility that scum have safe claims of 'major' characters. Also, town power roles are very likely to be outed by this.

And anyway, I have a much simpler reason to oppose this idea: I want to play
Mafia
, which isn't a game about trying to figure out how to outwit the Mod and break their game, but about
scum hunting
. So let's do that - scum hunt. =)

Unless someone posts a radically attractive reason to mass name-claim, I'll state my opposition and have no desire to comment on this further.

Kinetic, if you're scum, it seems pretty obvious to me that you have a safe claim, and most probably one of those six names you mentioned. I actually thought you were being fairly pro-town until you started about the name claim.
FOS: Kinetic


On that, I haven't been convinced by most of the votes on Kinetic. His advocating of a mass name-claim makes it more unlikely that he's scum, unless he has a safe claim. But none of the people who've voted him, except Tar, have suggested this. Others on Kinetic's wagon: Rhakith (random vote), Gemellii, Jester. Can each of you articulate your reasons for voting Kinetic?

Jester, I don't know what we stand to gain by stating our familiarity with the series. How exactly is this helping our scum hunt?

I'm also a little disturbed by the number of people who seemed to be content with assuming Tar was town.
Bout fucking time one of the scum outed themselves. Jeez and I never thought I would have to wait until all these townies tripped over themselves trying to lynch me for a scum to finally slip up.

Vote:destructor


BTW: My read on Gem and Tar is relatively townie.

People who continue to strawman me: Yes. I think name claim is a good idea, but since no one actually wants to discuss the merits of it and just paint me as scummy and let that bias their views on my ideas I have no choice but to let it drop for now. I'm pretty sure this would have helped the town immensely, but too many people are not doing anything but what I call the "Parrot Effect". They repeat, throw accusations, but then don't add anything to the conversation. Then if they are called upon this later they just say, "Well I was just listening to him, its not my fault".

As for Destructor, I can already see what he is doing. He's trying to set up his own defense. He's asking for everyone's air tight reason before he votes himself. Then when I don't come up scum he can say "Well I was just following you guys." Look at the subcontext of his posts. He has gone out of his way to not say I look scummy so he can point to that later.

I'm fully prepared to be lynched to prove this. But if there is a vig, I'm telling you your target after you know my true alignment. If there isn't a vig, I expect the town to look into both his actions from this day and my actions. I've been trying to spark discussion on SOMETHING and it only helps the town to get everyone's opinions on a subject, any subject, so that if scum slip up we can hold them to it.
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Post Post #113 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 1:58 pm

Post by destructor »

pulsewidth wrote:Unless I'm reading this wrong, this seems like a huge contradiction. You're FoSing Kinetic for proposing a mass name-claim, then you turn around and say that doing so makes it less likely that he's scum
[, unless he has a safe claim]
. This looks incredibly like scum-buddy distancing to me.
Note my edit and how, in light of it, your post no longer makes sense. You also seem to have skimmed over the fact that I raised the edited-in point as a commentary on Kinetic's wagon.
Kinetic wrote:As for Destructor, I can already see what he is doing. He's trying to set up his own defense. He's asking for everyone's air tight reason before he votes himself. Then when I don't come up scum he can say "Well I was just following you guys." Look at the subcontext of his posts. He has gone out of his way to not say I look scummy so he can point to that later.
And you're accusing others of strawmanning
you
? :roll:
destructor wrote:Kinetic,
if you're scum, it seems pretty obvious to me that you have a safe claim
, and most probably one of those six names you mentioned.
I actually thought you were being fairly pro-town until you started about the name claim.

FOS: Kinetic


On that, I haven't been convinced by most of the votes on Kinetic. His advocating of a mass name-claim makes it more unlikely that he's scum,
unless he has a safe claim.
But none of the people who've voted him, except Tar, have suggested this.
I was waiting to follow people? I don't see how your comment reflects what I just quoted. I'm pretty sure that the part I italicised means I found your recent posts scummy and the last line means I'm criticising the wagon as it stands.

I'm still not convinced that you're scum, but you're coming across as pretty hard headed, which isn't good for anyone.

Kinetic wrote:People who continue to strawman me: Yes. I think name claim is a good idea, but since no one actually wants to discuss the merits of it and just paint me as scummy and let that bias their views on my ideas I have no choice but to let it drop for now. I'm pretty sure this would have helped the town immensely, but too many people are not doing anything but what I call the "Parrot Effect". They repeat, throw accusations, but then don't add anything to the conversation. Then if they are called upon this later they just say, "Well I was just listening to him, its not my fault".
Do you realise how narrow-minded you're being? Can you not see that you believing this as a good idea doesn't make it true and that others' opinions are equally valid? Someone having an opposing opinion to you doesn't make them scum. Why should we 'add anything to the conversation' if we feel there is nothing to add? It's not like everyone can be expected to have a unique view on everything.
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Post Post #114 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 2:57 pm

Post by pulsewidth »

destructor wrote: Note my edit and how, in light of it, your post no longer makes sense. You also seem to have skimmed over the fact that I raised the edited-in point as a commentary on Kinetic's wagon.
Okay, then I would like for you to clarify your reason for FoSing Kinetic. Are you FoSing because of his proposed mass name-claim coupled with the possibility that he is scum with a safe-claim? Or are you just FoSing because of the mass name-claim idea? Are you saying that those people on Kinetic's wagon who DIDN'T mention safe-claims do not have a good reason(s) for voting him?
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Post Post #115 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 3:29 pm

Post by destructor »

I FOSed him because I found his behaviour suspicious for the reasons I stated. I think his pushing of a mass name claim is anti-town and warranted an FOS.

And about his wagon, yes, I do think those that didn't mention safe claims, or provide any other thoughtful reasoning, do not have good reasons for voting him. If he doesn't have a safe claim, what motivation can we see for him as scum to advocate this strategy that isn't a reach? And accepting this, why would you vote for someone you didn't think was scum?
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Post Post #116 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 5:16 pm

Post by bubka »

Jester wrote:
Kinetic wrote:A lot of trite BS about a mass name-claim
vote: Kinetic
.

You make this sound so nice: all puppies and rainbows. Problem is, if we have a Cop, it's Rodney McKay. If we have a Doc, it's Carson Beckett. And if we have a Vig, it's Ford or Dex. I give this information now because it now seems clear that I'm the only player really familiar with the show. Kinetic, you said that you're somewhat familiar with Atlantis, so I can only assume that you know this too. Therefore, someone would have to be an idiot to name-claim those three names.

You point out this danger, but you seem to think it's worth it. Well, I don't.

A mass name-claim puts us in a situation where either we lose our power-roles one by one because they've claimed, or to protect themselves, they lie about their names, and appear scummy if someone else counter-claims. And you haven't even said what happens if scum claim to be one of those names. Suppose we get two people claiming to be Carson Beckett? Sure, one's lying... but how do you pick which one has more credibility this early in the game? You gonna have us lynch a potential Doc because he might be lying? spurgistan, you pick up and name the first point. Your stock goes up a couple of points.

It'll be interesting to hear the other players weigh in on your little proposal, though.
Rhakith wrote:There are plenty of characters in the SG universe. Numerous memorable, but by no means even considered by anyone as "main" or important to the cast. Not to mention, there are plenty of recurring characters.
Didn't you read Kinetic's full proposal? He's proposing we lynch everyone not in the major six. I wish I was being sarcastic or exaggerating, but I'm not. Read his 77 again:
Kinetic wrote:If we assume there is a Pro-Town Killing role, EVEN if we out all of the power roles, if we just focus on killing the players that are not the above six, we could win this game in three days. Less if we use scum hunting abilities to aid us in choosing our targets.
In the meantime, here's what I have so far on players familiar with the TV show:

Code: Select all

Very familiar with the show:                        Jester
Somewhat familiar with the show:                    Kinetic
Familiar with SG-1 but not familiar with Atlantis:  Rhakith
Not familiar with the show:                         Gemelli, joost, ooba, spurgistan, Zephyr09
Haven't answered the question yet:                  bubka, destructor, pulsewidth, Tarhalindur


There hasn't been much if any discussion on anything other than the name-claim, so I'm caught up.
Which TV show are you talking about?
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Post Post #117 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 5:33 pm

Post by Zephyr09 »

Gee, maybe the one that the game is based on?

Nah, it COULDN'T be that. That'd be just crazy!

Vote: Kinetic
for continuing to push tactics that would massively benefit scum over town. I REALLY don't like that kind of risk-taking.
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Post Post #118 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 6:03 pm

Post by Tarhalindur »

destructor wrote:First of all, I think the idea of a mass name claim is just bad. pulsewidth noted the possibility that scum have safe claims of 'major' characters. Also, town power roles are very likely to be outed by this.

And anyway, I have a much simpler reason to oppose this idea: I want to play
Mafia
, which isn't a game about trying to figure out how to outwit the Mod and break their game, but about
scum hunting
. So let's do that - scum hunt. =)

Unless someone posts a radically attractive reason to mass name-claim, I'll state my opposition and have no desire to comment on this further.

Kinetic, if you're scum, it seems pretty obvious to me that you have a safe claim, and most probably one of those six names you mentioned.
I actually thought you were being fairly pro-town until you started about the name claim.

FOS: Kinetic


On that, I haven't been convinced by most of the votes on Kinetic.
His advocating of a mass name-claim makes it more unlikely that he's scum,
unless he has a safe claim. But none of the people who've voted him, except Tar, have suggested this. Others on Kinetic's wagon: Rhakith (random vote), Gemellii, Jester. Can each of you articulate your reasons for voting Kinetic?

Jester, I don't know what we stand to gain by stating our familiarity with the series. How exactly is this helping our scum hunt?

I'm also a little disturbed by the number of people who seemed to be content with assuming Tar was town.
Nice direct contradiction.

Unvote, Vote: destructor
for committing one of the biggest scumtells in the book.
User out of ambit.

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Post Post #119 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 6:35 pm

Post by destructor »

Tar, you just did exactly what pulsewidth did, except you were more blatant about it by neglecting to bold the remainder of the sentence. Are you even reading the thread?
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Post Post #120 (ISO) » Thu Oct 18, 2007 8:05 pm

Post by ooba »

Jester wrote:In the meantime, here's what I have so far on players familiar with the TV show
You should put me in a category which says becoming more familiar with the show everyday :)

My observations

Bubka: His last post was just hilarious. He has not posted much. But has been actively lurking. (Check out the Match of Champtions )

Joost : Kinetic as been pushing the name claim from the begining. Although its something scum would try to do, his aggression in putting forth his ideas makes me believe he really thinks it will benefit town. On the other hand, I think joost has just tried to ride the Kinetic idea by
staying in the background and supporting it.

Something scum would try to do ...

Vote : joost


Pulsewidth and Gemelli appear town to me .
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Post Post #121 (ISO) » Fri Oct 19, 2007 12:46 am

Post by joost »

pulsewidth wrote:Vote: joost

Power roles are one of the few advantages that town has over the scum, and you're fine with making them less valuable? "Scum will try to kill townies if we name claim or not, the claim will not change it." You're trying to make it sound like a name claim won't make a big difference or give the scum a huge advantage, and you're just flat out wrong. Of course scum will kill townies regardless, but name claims give the scum a great deal of information on who to NK in order to cripple the town more effectively. Given the opportunity to NK a regular townie or a cop, I'm pretty sure the mafia will opt to NK the cop. Kinetic has presented us with a plan that will hurt the town, so it doesn't surprise me that scum have stepped up to support it.
In general I agree with you, power roles are a huge help for the town, but this is based on a normal game without name roles. The biggest disadvantage a townie has is that he doesn't his friends from his foes and I think a massclaim will help townies decide better who their friends are. If this is true (and I think it is) the use for cops deminishes after a mass claim. Also a name claim does not equal role claim. The scum won't have the choice between NKing a cop or a townie, they'll have the choice to NK for instance John Sheppard and Elizabeth Weir. But as Tar already claimed his role, and it was neither cop nor doctor. I think that a name claim will out less information about power roles than you want us to believe.

You can believe Kinetics plan will hurt the town or that it will benefit it. But if we don't try it, it will not be proven one way or the other. Voting for someone because he disagrees with you on the plan is just bad play, in my opinion, and it will give scum the opportunity to join a bandwagon of someone who is actively trying to scumhunt.
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Post Post #122 (ISO) » Fri Oct 19, 2007 4:26 am

Post by pulsewidth »

joost wrote: The biggest disadvantage a townie has is that he doesn't his friends from his foes and I think a massclaim will help townies decide better who their friends are.
It is not the townie's job to decide who their friends are. It's their job to decide who is scum. Over the course of the game, you can determine who is less likely to be scum than others, but that is based on people's words and actions. All a mass name-claim would do is muddy the waters and have people lynching based on a name and what it might mean. The information that it would give the scum FAR outweighs any benefits the town might gain. If the mafia have safe claims, then they have even more of an advantage.
joost wrote: Also a name claim does not equal role claim. The scum won't have the choice between NKing a cop or a townie, they'll have the choice to NK for instance John Sheppard and Elizabeth Weir. But as Tar already claimed his role, and it was neither cop nor doctor. I think that a name claim will out less information about power roles than you want us to believe.
Right, and using a handy tool called Wikipedia, I can easily look these names up and see what likely roles I can match them up with. If the mod matched up roles in accordance with the flavor of the show, then the mafia would have gained considerable info on who the powerroles are.
joost wrote: Voting for someone because he disagrees with you on the plan is just bad play, in my opinion, and it will give scum the opportunity to join a bandwagon of someone who is actively trying to scumhunt.
I am voting you because of the reasons you are agreeing with Kinetic's plan, not just the fact that you are agreeing. And I have seen very little scumhunting from you so far. Your last several posts can basically be summed up as "I think we should try Kinetic's plan."
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Post Post #123 (ISO) » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:56 am

Post by joost »

pulsewidth wrote:It is not the townie's job to decide who their friends are. It's their job to decide who is scum. Over the course of the game, you can determine who is less likely to be scum than others, but that is based on people's words and actions. All a mass name-claim would do is muddy the waters and have people lynching based on a name and what it might mean. The information that it would give the scum FAR outweighs any benefits the town might gain. If the mafia have safe claims, then they have even more of an advantage.
Well I phrased that a bit sloppy. I think mass claim will help us find scum easier. We can do that the hard way by weighing words and some voting actions or we can do it the fast way via mass claim. I think it's likely that we will find at least some scum with it. But I guess we disagree on this. No big deal, I don't find you scummy because you want to do it the traditional way.
pulsewidth wrote:Right, and using a handy tool called Wikipedia, I can easily look these names up and see what likely roles I can match them up with. If the mod matched up roles in accordance with the flavor of the show, then the mafia would have gained considerable info on who the powerroles are.
Did you find what character of the show kills people who target them at night? And with that I mean did you find the role name of Tar?
pulsewidth wrote:I am voting you because of the reasons you are agreeing with Kinetic's plan, not just the fact that you are agreeing. And I have seen very little scumhunting from you so far. Your last several posts can basically be summed up as "I think we should try Kinetic's plan."
I have seen very little scumhunting from most people in this game, other than "you are not following the popular opinion". Don't get me wrong I think you make a good case. But you are one of the few and I'm not sure why you single me out. Also I think my last few posts are "I think we should try Kinetic's plan and here is why:...." Which is not scummy in my eyes.

My biggest suspect at the moment is Zephyr.
Zephyr09 wrote:Gee, maybe the one that the game is based on?

Nah, it COULDN'T be that. That'd be just crazy!

Vote: Kinetic
for continuing to push tactics that would massively benefit scum over town. I REALLY don't like that kind of risk-taking.
Here he votes for a popular target with little reasoning. And he seems to parrot others.
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Post Post #124 (ISO) » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:28 am

Post by pulsewidth »

joost wrote: Well I phrased that a bit sloppy. I think mass claim will help us find scum easier. We can do that the hard way by weighing words and some voting actions or we can do it the fast way via mass claim. I think it's likely that we will find at least some scum with it. But I guess we disagree on this. No big deal, I don't find you scummy because you want to do it the traditional way.
In my opinion, faster does not equal better in Mafia. I think it's in the best interests of the town to not rush toward a lynch on D1. We should spend the time scumhunting and coming to a well-informed decision rather than a hasty one. It's obvious we're not going to agree on this, and as I said before, I think you're scummy because of the reasons you stated for supporting the mass name-claim, not just the fact that you are supporting it. Until I see scummier behavior from someone else, my vote will remain.
joost wrote: Did you find what character of the show kills people who target them at night? And with that I mean did you find the role name of Tar?
I found what could be a likely match, yes. But the question is disingenous. We already have a good idea as to what Tar's claimed role is. Noone is likely to offer up that kind of information again. The only way the scum can get more role info is via this name-claim. It wouldn't tell them exactly what role someone is just going off a name, but it would certainly help.
joost wrote: My biggest suspect at the moment is Zephyr.
I agree with you here. Zephyr, you state that Kinetic is continuing to push his name-claim idea, but in his last post he specifically stated that he is dropping the idea. So your vote doesn't make any sense. It looks like you're just trying to jump on a popular wagon and ride it to an easy lynch.

FoS: Zephyr


bubka, quit lurking and contribute, scumbag.

mFoS: bubka
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